***Official*** Australia in South Africa

[Ruckus]

Ponting's second innings dismissal in particular, has absolutely nothing whatsoever with age. And that type of dismissal is typical of how he has been getting out over the last 12 months.

If these people who you are speaking for had any idea of the technical aspects of batting, they would note that his problem is that he is no longer standing tall at the crease. Now, unless he has a degenerative back disorder caused by age, that is concerned with technique. Most of his dismissals over the past 12 months have been. He hasn't been late on balls at all, if anything he is pre meditating them in the persuit of early dominance.

His problems are form related which stems from a failing technique. Not age.

Even if his problems are technical, what makes you think he will suddenly resolve them after at least two years of ****?

 

[Spikey]

more importantly why should two years of **** be acceptable? By anyone?

 

[Woodster]

Tell that to Haddin. I've watched Hussey's shot a few more times and it's just a normal poor dismissal as far as I'm concerned. I know it was first ball after the break which makes it slightly worse (for some reason), but his wicket was pretty standard, often it would go between the fielders and you wouldn't think much of it. I prefer Hussey's shot compared to Hughes as Hughes definitely showed his technical weaknesses while Hussey just didn't hit his drive well.

The pure fact that Hussey played such a loose shot in relation to the situation of the game and the fact it was his first ball of the innings! The pitch was doing enough to encourage bowlers, they don't need gifts like stuffing a wide half volley down gully's throat. His feet went nowhere, by all means have attacking intent if that was the way they decided to play, but you still have to pick your deliveries, and it's much easier once you've faced at least a few deliveries!

Brad Haddin is another one whose dismissal is prompting many to call for his head. It was a poor shot, he hasn't really given himself much of a chance of succeeding in that moment. However, that is more Haddin's game, I'm sure Clarke will have instructed him to go out and be more positive than normal, I agree that doesn't mean throwing your bat at everything, but with Haddin it's almost worth the risk of him losing his wicket in order to upset the bowlers and try and score some quick runs. With Hussey it isn't, he is crucial to Australia and is one of the few players capable of digging in and grinding out a 40 or 50.
Hussey should have known better than to go at a ball like that first up.

I agree with your comments about Hughes, there is a definite technical issue, and it doesn't take a great bowler to exploit it, which obviously makes it a more frequent occurrence. He gets out like this time and again, and he should have been out caught by Smith before he actually was out.

 

[benchmark00]

Even if his problems are technical, what makes you think he will suddenly resolve them after at least two years of ****?

Because he's an all time great, and form is temporary.

more importantly why should two years of **** be acceptable? By anyone?

Because he's shown he's such a great player. You would have a point if we had a mountain of players in shield cricket putting together seasons where they average 50-60. As it stands...


Players go in and out of form, everyone needs to be carried for a few matches sooner or later. Ponting's done his fair share of carrying. The fact is, he's still in our top 6 batsmen.

 

[Ruckus]

Because he's an all time great, and form is temporary.

If you are not drawing the line now, at what point do you draw it?

 

[benchmark00]

If you are not drawing the line now, at what point do you draw it?

Say what you want about Ponting, but you can never ever question his mind set when it comes to putting the team first. He will know when his time is up. He obviously feels the team is better with him in it, and undoubtedly I think that's true. As soon as he no longer feels he is an asset to the team, he will retire.

I'm expecting him to come out and flog a ton next match. I certainly hope so anyway.

 

[Woodster]

Is it fair to say then there are currently question marks in the Australian over the following positions -

Opening batsman - Phil Hughes simply for the continuous nature of his dismissals must be under serious pressure for his spot. Perhaps Shane Watson too, his place in the side may not be in question, just his position at the top of the order. Does a middle order slot beckon due to his growing stature as a bowler and more time for him to recover from those spells ? This comes more into the spotlight as he has currently lost that consistency that saw him frequently get Australia off to a decent start, without really ever converting those starts.

Is Shaun Marsh a consideration for stepping up, or is Chris Rogers still an option? A seasoned campaigner that knows his game inside-out, would be reliable, and would bridge the gap till the next young opener blossoms or Hughes sorts out his technique.

Number Four - It's going to be a tough call for the selectors. How do you judge whether a player of Ponting's age has lost form, or whether he really is 'over the hill'? If there was someone absolutely beating the door down, this decision may be easier, there isn't, will Ponting resurrect himself Hussey-style ?

Wicket-Keeper - There are always more groans about Haddin's failures than many others. I'm a fan, but he seems to be coming under increasing pressure from Matthew Wade. Is now the time to make the change ? (well after this series anyway)

Pace Bowler(s) - There is presumably only Ryan Harris consider a certainty in the pace bowling slots. Has time finally run out on Mitchell Johnson, the odd match-winning performance really isn't enough when he is so anonymous when it's not his day. Peter Siddle is another that seems to have split the fans, it seems there are some quite happy to see him selected and plenty of others simply waiting for him to fail. There is of course the exciting Pat Cummins, is he too young to be unleashed yet, or is it worth throwing him in. While people may claim he can't do much worse, the best interest must be what's best for his development.

Spinner - Nathan Lyon hasn't really do much wrong yet. Perhaps he retains a stay of execution for this reason alone.

So am I right in thinking that only Clarke, Hussey, Watson, Marsh, and Harris are the only certainties for the short-term ?

 

[Spikey]

Yeah more or less

i will point out that haddin is safe for now because they've invested a lot in tim paine - who hasn't repaid them much - and he's currently injured. It would be a huge surprise - new selectors and all - to see M. Wade move ahead. I would have thought Haddin will get the two tests against NZ considering there's no sign of Paine returning

 

[Ruckus]

Say what you want about Ponting, but you can never ever question his mind set when it comes to putting the team first. He will know when his time is up. He obviously feels the team is better with him in it, and undoubtedly I think that's true. As soon as he no longer feels he is an asset to the team, he will retire.

I'm expecting him to come out and flog a ton next match. I certainly hope so anyway.

While I do think Ponting is very much a team man in a match situation, I also think for his career as a whole he has a lot of personal pride to the point of obstinance sometimes:

"I've never put a finish date on my career," he said yesterday. "I don't see a finish line yet and I think it's really important for me that I don't look at it that way.

"Things haven't been as I would have liked for the last 12 months. I haven't scored a Test hundred in that period of time. I want to make sure that I'm getting back to playing somewhere near my best cricket.

"If I can do that, who knows, the (2013) Ashes might not be out of the question. My destiny lies in my hands, really."

The fact that he is saying he doesn't see a finish line yet, and clearly has ambitions to play in the 2013 Ashes tells me he is at least partly playing for pride.

In any case, the problem is he might legitmately believe he is still an asset to the team, without that being true. He might have confidence in himself hitting form again, yet could continue to fail (for whatever reason) despite that belief. The bottom line is, beliefs and expectations don't always come to fruition. At the end of the day all that matters is the results. He is an ATG and deserves a lot of leeway to allow for a recovery in form - he has been given that without any success, so his time should truly be running out.

 

[andyc]

Yeah more or less

i will point out that haddin is safe for now because they've invested a lot in tim paine - who hasn't repaid them much - and he's currently injured. It would be a huge surprise - new selectors and all - to see M. Wade move ahead. I would have thought Haddin will get the two tests against NZ considering there's no sign of Paine returning

TBF Wade did play the T20Is against South Africa, so the selectors have at least acknowledged that he exists and is capable.

 

[Spark]

Is it fair to say then there are currently question marks in the Australian over the following positions -

Opening batsman - Phil Hughes simply for the continuous nature of his dismissals must be under serious pressure for his spot. Perhaps Shane Watson too, his place in the side may not be in question, just his position at the top of the order. Does a middle order slot beckon due to his growing stature as a bowler and more time for him to recover from those spells ? This comes more into the spotlight as he has currently lost that consistency that saw him frequently get Australia off to a decent start, without really ever converting those starts.

Is Shaun Marsh a consideration for stepping up, or is Chris Rogers still an option? A seasoned campaigner that knows his game inside-out, would be reliable, and would bridge the gap till the next young opener blossoms or Hughes sorts out his technique.

Number Four - It's going to be a tough call for the selectors. How do you judge whether a player of Ponting's age has lost form, or whether he really is 'over the hill'? If there was someone absolutely beating the door down, this decision may be easier, there isn't, will Ponting resurrect himself Hussey-style ?

Wicket-Keeper - There are always more groans about Haddin's failures than many others. I'm a fan, but he seems to be coming under increasing pressure from Matthew Wade. Is now the time to make the change ? (well after this series anyway)

Pace Bowler(s) - There is presumably only Ryan Harris consider a certainty in the pace bowling slots. Has time finally run out on Mitchell Johnson, the odd match-winning performance really isn't enough when he is so anonymous when it's not his day. Peter Siddle is another that seems to have split the fans, it seems there are some quite happy to see him selected and plenty of others simply waiting for him to fail. There is of course the exciting Pat Cummins, is he too young to be unleashed yet, or is it worth throwing him in. While people may claim he can't do much worse, the best interest must be what's best for his development.

Spinner - Nathan Lyon hasn't really do much wrong yet. Perhaps he retains a stay of execution for this reason alone.

So am I right in thinking that only Clarke, Hussey, Watson, Marsh, and Harris are the only certainties for the short-term ?

I'd say so, yes.

 

[Jarquis]

 

[Spikey]

unlucky tbh.

 

[popepouri]

Philander has a nice action.

 

[honestbharani]

They're damning numbers. Warner I think is likely to make it as a test player, though he's another bloke who goes hard at the ball.

Still not convinced by Usman on the forward press, something very likely to get sorted out in conditions where it's moving about.

What about Ferguson for the longer versions?

 

[AlwaysProteas]

Philander is a great find, hopefully the figures weren't just due to the track.

 

[Nate]

Warner in for Hughes, someone in for Ponting and Copeland in for Johnson.

EDIT: O'Keefe for PM, knighthood, Australia's Next Top Model, etc.

 

[abmk]

Good measured chase from Smith and Amla .. Harris and Watto did look threatening in parts, siddle and johnson an over here and there, but that's about it ...

 

[centurymaker]

Reliance ICC Player Rankings

kallis hands over the top position to sanga, while Ponting drops to 34. Last time he was this low in the rankings was back in 1999.

 

[abmk]

Aus simply cannot afford to play both Siddle and Johnson. Should probably bring in Copeland for Johnson.

Ferguson also deserves a chance in near future IMO

Haven't seen much of Khwaja to comment much on him really