Butt/Amir/Asif - Spot Fixing Trial

[outbreak]

Glad to see they got actual sentences and not a celebrity slap on the wrist.
The argument of them being sentenced too harshly as they only made small amounts of money is stupid, they were affecting the outcome of a game which has millions of dollars world wide bet on it.
The argument of paying players more to stop fixing is also stupid, by that argument a fry cooker in the local mcdonalds should be let off if he robs the place as it's mcdonalds own fault for not paying him enough. If they aren't happy with how much the PCB pays them they should seek alternate employment. I'm sure what they are being paid is above average for their countries wages,

 

[Cevno]

Faisal, I think after the guilty verdict, I don't think anyone of them should play cricket ever again. It will be quite embarrassing for Pakistan if we allow it. In fact the UK and other cricketing nations probably won't even grant them visas to enter, so it would be pointless.

Why wouldn't they grant Visas?

As i said before wouldn't have a problem with Amir coming back tbh. For the rest of the 2, i think it is over in any case. From what i have heard and can gather, there is a possibility of Amir having his sentence suspended on appeal.

 

[Cevno]

Just a guess but I believe it was a response to him saying,

Which was a fair comment if that Prision/whatever it is called has such a reputation and he highlighted a incident too.

 

[vic_orthdox]

Why wouldn't they grant Visas?

As i said before wouldn't have a problem with Amir coming back tbh. For the rest of the 2, i think it is over in any case.

Not an expert in the field by any means, but it's usually pretty difficult to get a visa when you have a conviction against your name, isn't it?

 

[Cevno]

Not an expert in the field by any means, but it's usually pretty difficult to get a visa when you have a conviction against your name, isn't it?

With regards to a single charge of Cheating and that too five years before? No expert either, but most countries have a rule with regards to "serious criminal offences" and threat perception, i believe.

Depends from country to country but except maybe the UK(though i am not sure there too), i doubt any other country would deny a Visa on these grounds to them, especially if they are representing their countries and the Pakistan government takes a guarantee and presses for it.

 

[silentstriker]

To be honest you wouldn't expect the families to say anything else.

They must be going through hell, feel sorry for them for what their relatives have put them through. As for the prisons, they are almost like a holiday camp over here. Human rights and all that etc...

I can almost guarantee you that they aren't. I know nothing of UK prisons but any place that is jam-packed full of antisocial and other psychotic personalities is never going to be a "holiday" camp.

 

[Xuhaib]

expecting Asif to befriend some drug dealer inside getting out starting a drug's business and become a millionaire in no time its Johnny Depp's Blow all over again.

 

[Jacknife]

Which was a fair comment if that Prision/whatever it is called has such a reputation and he highlighted a incident too.

I'm sure if you look through the papers enough, every YOP in the country has had horrible incidents occur.
I know people that work in prisons and YOP's and unfortunately, I have had acquaintances and friends do time in them and if your going to get a rough ride, it will be in a YOP. They are full have dickheads with something to prove and a reputation to make. Whereas adult prisons, people tend to just get their heads down and do their time.

 

[Jacknife]

I can almost guarantee you that they aren't. I know nothing of UK prisons but any place that is jam-packed full of antisocial and other psychotic personalities is never going to be a "holiday" camp.

I don't know about holiday camp but get put in a Cat D prison it's not far off, they are usually the kind of places Bankers and the like do their time, or low risk prisoners.

 

[Daemon]

Do they group the guys in there doing time for violent crimes along with those that are in for non-violent ones?

 

[Daemon]

Boohoo.

 

[Jacknife]

Do they group the guys in there doing time for violent crimes along with those that are in for non-violent ones?

Depends on what the severity of the crime is, you get drug users etc in with guys who have committed GBH or assault and the like. But violent offenders and murderers will be housed in Cat A prisons, which are the highest security ones.

 

[Daemon]

Sorry in advance for being ignorant, I get my information from the Discovery Channel

Some of the US State prisons are so damn free and easy, well equipped and comfortable, it's no wonder it's not a deterrent Drugs being smuggled into the prison ffs, doesn't get much worse.. The only thing that's a likely deterrent is the crime that goes on inside the prison itself, crime that shouldn't be happening in the first place. Are UK prisons anything like that?

SG cells are usually something like this

The caning is insane..people have said they'd rather get sodomized then get caned. You can't sit and can barely stand or walk at all, taking a dump is a nightmare and the only position you can lie down on till it heals is on your stomach. If you've been sentenced to say 6 strokes, they all come within a short span of each another, right after the wounds from your previous ones have closed. Lots of controversy surrounding it, many human rights campaigns have failed to change the government's stand on these things though, and it does reflect in the crime rate.

 

[Jacknife]

Cells are not as basic as that but are still very similar in size etc and depending where you are and in what Category, you can get TV's & radio's.
Not heard of anyone getting canned mate or it ever being mentioned.
Tbh Prisons in the US seem very scary places even more so than the UK.

 

[SJS]

Anyone feel we're one tiny step towards addressing the real problem? [/B]Thought not...

Thats the best query I have seen in this thread - seriously.

One would like to think and fervently hope we are but it is seriously doubtful.

To start with spot fixing is very very difficult to spot (excuse the pun). We have to thank NOWT for this one but stings are not something we can look to for a cure. Notwithstanding the fact that the "Majeeds" of the future will be more difficult to trap in a repeat.

Thus the onus is with ICC and even more so with the individual boards. They have given no indication over the 12 years since "Cronjegate" that they are interested in this. Being equipped to do it comes later.

Remember even Cronjegate was a fluke occurrence. The Delhi police were tapping someones lines in a case that had nothing remotely to do with cricket and they overheard this conversation and got interested. Thats not going to happen again I bet for the odds are very long indeed.

ICC does not seem to think of punishment as a deterrent. The boards' attitude towards punishment is a joke.The fact that these guys got a five year ban shows the ICC thought they were guilty and if they were guilty why stop at five years. These blokes should not be allowed to step on a cricket ground (emerging from the pavilion steps that is). There is talk now to turn the sentences to life ban. That may have been the right thing to do then, today it will make them look even more stupid and Pawar may be anything he is not stupid.

By the way, I haven't come across any word from our Agriculture minister on this yet.

Finally we, the cricket fans, have memories that are notoriously short, bordering on being afflicted by Alzheimer's and there goes our only genuine chance of reducing if not ridding the game of this menace.

 

[marc71178]

Not an expert in the field by any means, but it's usually pretty difficult to get a visa when you have a conviction against your name, isn't it?

Certainly is in some countries, especially for a working visa. I seem to remember 2 or 3 of the Newcastle squad having to sit out their preseason tour to the US because of it.

 

[Furball]

With regards to a single charge of Cheating and that too five years before? No expert either, but most countries have a rule with regards to "serious criminal offences" and threat perception, i believe.

Depends from country to country but except maybe the UK(though i am not sure there too), i doubt any other country would deny a Visa on these grounds to them, especially if they are representing their countries and the Pakistan government takes a guarantee and presses for it.

The perfect reason not to give a sportsman with a conviction to cheat and defraud bookmakers a visa to play sport in your country.

 

[Cevno]

The perfect reason not to give a sportsman with a conviction to cheat and defraud bookmakers a visa to play sport in your country.

Have those convicted of cheating through doping been denied Visas in the past? Marion Jones has not had many problems from what i can gather after being sentenced to 6 months of prison and 2 years probation.

Infact, some countries still call her up as a expert on athletics.

Pretty sure there would be many other examples too of even other crimes and charges years back.

 

[keeper]

Have those convicted of cheating through doping been denied Visas in the past?

It would completely bugger up our Olympics if they were

I'm unclear as to the point at which doping comes under legal, rather than just sporting, jurisdiction.

 

[Cevno]

I'm sure if you look through the papers enough, every YOP in the country has had horrible incidents occur.
I know people that work in prisons and YOP's and unfortunately, I have had acquaintances and friends do time in them and if your going to get a rough ride, it will be in a YOP. They are full have dickheads with something to prove and a reputation to make. Whereas adult prisons, people tend to just get their heads down and do their time.

Not disagreeing with you here, but what's that to do with what was the initial point?

Infact, it further reinforces the point wrt to the other 2 being in normal prison vs Amir being in this YOP.