*Official* First Test at the Gabba

[Prince EWS]

That logic has worked before for Aus

1st Test: South Africa v Australia at Johannesburg, Feb 28-Mar 4, 1997 | Cricket Scorecard | ESPN Cricinfo

Haha yeah he took heaps of wickets against the West Indies in a couple of games too.

 

[Prince EWS]

What are Copeland's FC figures at the moment? Just curious.

8 games
54 wickets
Avg: 17.46
SR: 39.3
4 5WI
1 10WM

If Josh Hazelwood for example started his career with those sort of figures he'd be in the Test team for sure, but because he came into Shield cricket in his mid 20s with no real pedigree other than grade cricket performances to die for, they'll hold him back for a couple of seasons, I'd say. He reminds me of Mohammad Asif a lot, but there are times where he also reminds me of Brett Dorey. Somewhere in between is probably about right...

 

[four_or_six]

Yeah, you're happy today, we were happy yesterday, you were happy the day before that and we were happy the day before that. We each won two days, it's been more or less even. Anything else is spin.

It matters who is happy at the end of the match, to a certain extent. Ending on a high after bad periods earlier on is more valuable than having good periods earlier and ending on a low.

 

[flibbertyjibber]

Michael Holding was doing his nut when Watson had the 7-2 field, and said if his captain had asked him to bowl to that, he would have given him the ball and told him to do it. It didn't go on long in that case, a couple of balls later Watson called Ponting over and the field was changed.

I love listening to him as with him being neutral he just says it as it is with no hint of bias.The likes of Botham,Healy and Chappell always talk up their own players and talk down the opposition regardless of what they are doing on the field.

The way Holding spoke about Johnson at Lunch was very insightful.Basically said nobody with an action like him will ever be capable of producing consistant performances and that he had heard he was a great bowler many times but never seen it himself.

 

[Spark]

I love listening to him as with him being neutral he just says it as it is with no hint of bias.The likes of Botham,Healy and Chappell always talk up their own players and talk down the opposition regardless of what they are doing on the field.

The way Holding spoke about Johnson at Lunch was very insightful.Basically said nobody with an action like him will ever be capable of producing consistant performances and that he had heard he was a great bowler many times but never seen it himself.

I don't know how "insightful" that is though. Johnson's "mercuriality" is the stuff of legend.

Don't mistake me though, I think Holding is a top-class commentator.

 

[Goughy]

A Test captaincy nod in Australia is a permanent invitation to lead and the idea of another captain existing in the same team (and dressing room, and press conferences) as Ponting would cause a natural division of loyalty as to who the leader - as opposed to the titular captain - of the side was. That would be nothing but destructive considering how long Ponting's been leading the side and nurturing most of its personalities - who would probably flock to him if there was a split in the team. With the weight attached to Ponting's legacy, there's every chance of a Pakistan-like split should things go **** up.

Who knew Australians were such a high maintainance, whiny and fractious lot? Either you are doing them a grave disservice or they are far more amatuer and petulant than I would ever have thought.

On the policy of retaining a player never losing the captaincy if they are in the XI, I kind of like the idea that the bad times from the policy are outweighed by the good and therefore stick with it but at the same time find it bizarre to stick with something that reduces the chance of winning out of principle alone.

 

[flibbertyjibber]

The David Gower funny from the first session is up on Youtube.

Liked it later on when Botham called him a squealing pig.

 

[Prince EWS]

It matters who is happy at the end of the match, to a certain extent. Ending on a high after bad periods earlier on is more valuable than having good periods earlier and ending on a low.

Haha, we heard about this a lot in the last Ashes in England - constant references were made to how vital momentum was. If anything, the opposite was true. Australia were all over England in the first Test and England just survived through that Panesar/Onions partnership, but then England smashed Australia in the second Test. Australia were then all over England in the next two, drawing a game in which they were the better side and then winning by an innings, giving them the ultimate momentum into the fifth Test... whereby they got hammered.

Both sides are good, but neither side is consistent or ruthless. It means we're going to see a lot of see-sawing fortunes, just like we did in this Test.

 

[Goughy]

Bollocks IMO. A 300+ run partnership is anything but "not important" whatever the circumstances. We have problems, but so do you.

Both teams may have problems but, using this thread alone as a barometer, Australias are bigger than Englands.

 

[flibbertyjibber]

I don't know how "insightful" that is though. Johnson's "mercuriality" is the stuff of legend.

Don't mistake me though, I think Holding is a top-class commentator.

There was more to it,just can't remember it now as tiredness is kicking in.

 

[Spark]

There's no doubt IMO that if Ponting was pushed rather than stepped aside but kept in the team, assuming Clarke takes over, there would be a lot of problems, as AWS Clarke is a far weaker personality and far less influential than Ponting. Ponting has near-universal adulation in the CA/Domestic community I believe.

 

[pasag]

Holding's an idiot.

 

[four_or_six]

I love listening to him as with him being neutral he just says it as it is with no hint of bias.The likes of Botham,Healy and Chappell always talk up their own players and talk down the opposition regardless of what they are doing on the field.

The way Holding spoke about Johnson at Lunch was very insightful.Basically said nobody with an action like him will ever be capable of producing consistant performances and that he had heard he was a great bowler many times but never seen it himself.

It's true he's good and it's good to have a neutral. However, he also said that he'd only really seen Johnson play in & against England, which isn't a fair reflection of his overall career.

 

[vcs]

haha, we heard about this a lot in the last ashes in england - constant references were made to how vital momentum was. If anything, the opposite was true. Australia were all over england in the first test and england just survived through that panesar/onions partnership, but then england smashed australia in the second test. Australia were then all over england in the next two, drawing a game in which they were the better side and then winning by an innings, giving them the ultimate momentum into the fifth test... Whereby they got hammered.

Both sides are good, but neither side is consistent or ruthless. It means we're going to see a lot of see-sawing fortunes, just like we did in this test.

awta.

 

[Howe_zat]

The David Gower funny from the first session is up on Youtube.

Liked it later on when Botham called him a squealing pig.

Voila.

YouTube - David Gower's world of pain! Foot crushed by Nasser Hussain

 

[Spark]

Both teams may have problems but, using this thread alone as a barometer, Australias are bigger than Englands.

We're just less accepting of mediocrity, that's all

Perhaps they are but the difference in the magnitudes, if there is one, is not so big as some would like to believe.

 

[flibbertyjibber]

There's no doubt IMO that if Ponting was pushed rather than stepped aside but kept in the team, assuming Clarke takes over, there would be a lot of problems, as AWS Clarke is a far weaker personality and far less influential than Ponting. Ponting has near-universal adulation in the CA/Domestic community I believe.

So what happens if Australia don't win this series?

Can he carry on as captain if he hasn't won the ashes back and would the public still want him to carry on anyway.

I know that is an if,but or maybe but it may happen and he is probably under more pressure now than at any time of his reign and if today is anything to go by he hasn't handled it well as some of those fields were bizarre to say the least.

 

[Prince EWS]

So what happens if Australia don't win this series?

Will probably get dropped IMO.

 

[Spark]

Indeed.

To lose the Ashes at home is possibly the biggest crime in Australian cricket.

 

[pasag]

Honestly, the talk of Ponting being booted if Australia don't win the series is nonsense. It's not the captains job to win the series, it's the teams. The captain's job is to:

a) Lead the team well
b) Make good tactical decisions

By all means get rid of him because he can't set a proper field, but it's not his fault the batting keeps collapsing or Mitchell Johnson and friends can't bowl properly anymore. Clarke won't be any better on b) anyways and the talk on North taking over makes me want to throw up. Happy for Katich to take over though. Truth be told we have enough problems at the moment, stability at the top is essential for now.