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***Official*** Tendulkar vs Ponting Thread

Ruckus

Ruckus

International Captain
There are just so many variables in those comparisons though. Pretty damn difficult to extract anything meaningful out of them.
 
K

kingjulian

U19 12th Man
Ikki said:
Harbhajan, Swann, Caddick, Doul, Johnson? Nah.

Missing out Kumble and Bond, at the top of my head.

Batting records | Test matches | Cricinfo Statsguru | Cricinfo.com
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Harbie has a sub 30 average against Australia, where as Kumble has 30+.

Likewise on Doul and Bond. Bond played very little tests against Australia as well. 3 innings i think.

Johnshon is a sub 30 average bowler as well.

Swann is a great bowler. He is the best spinner in test Cricket right now.

I'm really struggling to think of the best NZ and Eng bowlers. But Fraser and Caddick both have sub 30 average i think.
 
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Ikki

Ikki

Hall of Fame Member
It's pretty obvious who was the better bowler. Doull shouldn't even be in that discussion. Bond was Steyn with a career crippled by injuries. But he was one of the best. Early days for Midge yet.
 
K

kingjulian

U19 12th Man
Ikki said:
It's pretty obvious who was the better bowler. Doull shouldn't even be in that discussion. Bond was Steyn with a career crippled by injuries. But he was one of the best. Early days for Midge yet.
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Bond played 3 innings against Ponting and none against Steve Waugh. So it was prety easy to exclude him.
 
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Ikki

Ikki

Hall of Fame Member
So? It won't harm Waugh's record and everybody else who played him from Australia will have their cases in the balance. Don't tell me you're not putting him because Ponting did well?
 
K

kingjulian

U19 12th Man
Ikki said:
So? It won't harm Waugh's record and everybody else who played him from Australia will have their cases in the balance. Don't tell me you're not putting him because Ponting did well?
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He has bowled 60 overs against Australia at an average of 100 on hid debut test series where he played 3 innings.

Grouping Span Mat Inns Overs Mdns Runs Wkts BBI BBM Ave Econ SR 5 10
v Australia 2001-2001 2 3 67.0 5 289 3 1/74 2/154 96.33 4.31 134.0 0 0

He got creamed by everyone not just Ponting. It looks more like a statistical anomaly than anything.
 
Ikki

Ikki

Hall of Fame Member
Yet you included his 2 tests for Tendulkar - although Tendulkar hardly made runs against him.

He is one of the best bowlers of the last decade era. Even in his short career he pretty much played everyone and only Australia - and namely Ponting - really got on top of him. In the Test in Hobart, Ponting scored the most off him and did it at a run a ball. He conceded 135 runs and 45 from Ponting alone.
 
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K

kingjulian

U19 12th Man
Ikki said:
Yet you included his 2 tests for Tendulkar - although Tendulkar hardly made runs against him.

He is one of the best bowlers of the last decade era. Even in his short career he pretty much played everyone and only Australia - and namely Ponting - really got on top of him.
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See it's like this. Peter George could well go on to become the McGrath of the next decade, but his debut test was atrocious and every Indian batsman comfortably played him.

Langer, Hayden and Ponting carted him around in one innings.

He was dropped after that innings. Called back for the third test, and he fared no better. Bond was a late bloomer. It was the other NZ bowlers who took most of the wickets. He was outshined by bowlers from his own team, and no Australian player had any problem playing him.

He started his career late, and was thrown in to Tests with very little first class cricket behind him. It was not until a year after his debut he bowled well.
 
vcs

vcs

Request Your Custom Title Now!
kingjulian said:
See it's like this. Peter George could well go on to become the McGrath of the next decade, but his debut test was atrocious and every Indian batsman comfortably played him.

Langer, Hayden and Ponting carted him around in one innings.

He was dropped after that innings. Called back for the third test, and he fared no better. Bond was a late bloomer. It was the other NZ bowlers who took most of the wickets. He was outshined by bowlers from his own team, and no Australian player had any problem playing him.

He started his career late, and was thrown in to Tests with very little first class cricket behind him. It was not until a year after his debut he bowled well.
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Then exclude Warne's debut Test against India. I don't want to be harsh, but mate, this is a pointless exercise.
 
K

kingjulian

U19 12th Man
vcs said:
Then exclude Warne's debut Test against India. I don't want to be harsh, but mate, this is a pointless exercise.
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The Indian Batsmen vs Bowlers is a just by the way...

The main point i wanted to make was that Waugh averaged more against tougher bowler. Ponting is not even the best Australian batsman in the last 20 years.
 
Ikki

Ikki

Hall of Fame Member
kingjulian said:
See it's like this. Peter George could well go on to become the McGrath of the next decade, but his debut test was atrocious and every Indian batsman comfortably played him.

Langer, Hayden and Ponting carted him around in one innings.

He was dropped after that innings. Called back for the third test, and he fared no better. Bond was a late bloomer. It was the other NZ bowlers who took most of the wickets. He was outshined by bowlers from his own team, and no Australian player had any problem playing him.

He started his career late, and was thrown in to Tests with very little first class cricket behind him. It was not until a year after his debut he bowled well.
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You could be right. But really, it was the very next series he played onwards where he was pretty incredible for pretty much the rest of his career.

Don't know a whole lot about Bond truth be told; but I know Ponting played him very well - as he has pretty much all pacers.

Even excluding Bond (look at my link), Ponting still has a great record against the others - better than Waugh with those bowlers. Ponting is pretty widely regarded as the best Aussie batsman in the last 20 years. In the 90s Waugh was superb though; probably even better than Tendulkar when you look at the attacks he scored runs off.
 
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K

kingjulian

U19 12th Man
Ikki said:
Yet it was easy to include Ian Bishop who, like Bond, only played 2 Tests against Ponting.
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Look there is a sample size of 60 odd tests. You are reduced to nit-picking.

Ian Bishop was at his peak when he bowled to Ponting. Ian Bishop played more than 5 test matches against Waugh.

I thought Waugh didn't play it looks like he played. So it will be fair since he too had a chance to hit out. But actually By the time Waugh came in there was over 500 runs on the board, so there was not much for him to do.

If you insist on including sub-par Bond on his debut test series, go ahead and include. One innings will Boost Pontings average by nearly 2 runs. But Waugh I believe still comes out on top.

Next....
 
K

kingjulian

U19 12th Man
Ikki said:
You could be right. But really, it was the very next series he played onwards where he was pretty incredible for pretty much the rest of his career.

Don't know a whole lot about Bond truth be told; but I know Ponting played him very well - as he has pretty much all pacers.

Even excluding Bond (look at my link), Ponting still has a great record against the others - better than Waugh with those bowlers. Ponting is pretty widely regarded as the best batsman in the last 20 years. In the 90s Waugh was superb though; probably even better than Tendulkar when you look at the attacks he scored runs.
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I think you missed out the link in your reply. Post it again, ill have a look.

Tendulkar, Waugh and Lara were all in a different planet when it came to scoring against the best attacks in 90s. Compared to anyone else who played then.

I have used pretty much the same Bowlers for Australia and India in my comparison and a fair few of them are from the 90s. It is very neck and neck between Waugh and Tendulkar. Tendulkar had to play against Australian attack, while Waugh had to play much of his cricket in more bouncy Australian wickets. In terms of average, there is not much to separate but in terms of Strike rate Lara and Tendulkar leave Waught well behind. You have to remember Tendulkar in the 90s was a very attacking batsman like Lara. Sachin even had a slightly higher strike rate to show for it.

Against the lesser attacks especially in 2002-2004 and 2008-2010, Tendulkar has really helped himself to an average that take his career average to the high 50s.
 
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