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*Official* England in South Africa

Prince EWS

Global Moderator
But I though that word was acceptable and may have not spelt it correctly.
Frankly, I don't believe that for a second. Either way it wasn't an acceptable post - it's not like he didn't get warned for his and he didn't even evade the filter. If you have further issues, email us at moderators at cricketweb dot net; don't carry it on in this thread.
 
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TT Boy

Hall of Fame Member
What about other players that have left possibly taking into consideration that they can not make the team given that they are of wrong colour? Do you think Kieswetter maybe counted the no of blackies and whities in the team and then decided there was just no possibility he would ever make SA team? I mean any young bat besides Vindiar must be thinking oh **** theres AB, Smith,keeper,steyn, morkell, harris,kallis in team =7 whities which means that any chance of making the team as a whitie are slim = **** off overseas and maybe make a career there.
Nice terminology.
 

jboss

Banned
Frankly, I don't believe that for a second. Either way it wasn't an acceptable post - it's not like he didn't get warned for his and he didn't even evade the filter. If you have further issues, email us at moderators at cricketweb dot not; don't carry it on in this thread.
Err I pointed this out in a previous post that the report function does not work in my browser = opera.
 

Prince EWS

Global Moderator
Err I pointed this out in a previous post that the report function does not work in my browser = opera.
I didn't ask you to report a post; I asked you to actually send us an email. Open up your email client and send an email to moderators at cricketweb dot net if you have further issues.
 

Briony

International Debutant
What about other players that have left possibly taking into consideration that they can not make the team given that they are of wrong colour? Do you think Kieswetter maybe counted the no of blackies and whities in the team and then decided there was just no possibility he would ever make SA team? I mean any young bat besides Vindiar must be thinking oh **** theres AB, Smith,keeper,steyn, morkell, harris,kallis in team =7 whities which means that any chance of making the team as a whitie are slim = **** off overseas and maybe make a career there.
Maybe Kieswetter also counted the pounds on offer. As I said previously, I'm not a fan of quotas, now in particular as SA seems to have enough non-white players who can make it on merit but you also have to consider that the very good white players who have been determined to play for their country usually have. And Wagner and Elliott would have struggled to make it into the SA team quotas or no quotas. They have, probably a bit like Nash who would never have played for Australia, seized the opportunity to play international cricket where there is less genuine competition.
 

jboss

Banned
Maybe Kieswetter also counted the pounds on offer. As I said previously, I'm not a fan of quotas, now in particular as SA seems to have enough non-white players who can make it on merit but you also have to consider that the very good white players who have been determined to play for their country usually have. And Wagner and Elliott would have struggled to make it into the SA team quotas or no quotas. They have, probably a bit like Nash who would never have played for Australia, seized the opportunity to play international cricket where there is less genuine competition.
Well leaving quotas aside, do you think that it is fair for some fans to be crying about Bangladesh being a test nation for not being able to produce cricketers of test quaility, yet Eng clearly can't do the same. What about the bias in colonialism here? Eng as the opressor surely set to benfit the most given that not nonly did they rule SA for many a year, but they are also 1st world which means they would no doubt draw more international players to thier shores than Bangladesh? Kieswetter could also go play in Bangladesh I bet. My main irritation here is that EVERY white South African has a link to Europe that dates to a mere 400 years at most and the moment they enter the EU (not just England) they become elligable to play for England due to kolpak and a numerous amount of other EEA /EU agreements. This is HUGE hand up to England alone in world cricket. I also think the ICC should step in and say that country x must compensate country y for amount of time and resources that were taken inot developing a good cricketer.
 

TT Boy

Hall of Fame Member
Maybe Kieswetter also counted the pounds on offer. As I said previously, I'm not a fan of quotas, now in particular as SA seems to have enough non-white players who can make it on merit but you also have to consider that the very good white players who have been determined to play for their country usually have. And Wagner and Elliott would have struggled to make it into the SA team quotas or no quotas. They have, probably a bit like Nash who would never have played for Australia, seized the opportunity to play international cricket where there is less genuine competition.
According to what I’ve read, Craig was told by Western Province that he wouldn’t get a contract as a wicket keeper because in their opinion he wasn’t a very good keeper. They told him to work on his keeping and comeback when it improved. Kieswetter from all reports is a bit of hot head (like KP) took it personally and left in disgust.

Additionally, Western Province, Boland and the Cape Cobras wicket keepers are not black, so he did not have black competition. The Cobras find transformation targets easily achievable; their entire bowling attack is black and no one can really argue they are not selected on merit. Particular when they look at the likes of Pepler Sandri, a white seamer who left the Cobras to go play for Sussex was promptly released by the county after a year. Or in the case of Domenic Telo, a white batsman from the Cape who according to the BBC was on the brink of a call-up to the Proteas (LOL) signed for Derbyshire on a long term deal with the view to England but is now back in the Republic playing amateur cricket. Kieswetter if he does go on would be an anomaly like KP and Trott, as for every KP there is fifteen or more Sandri’s or Telo’s.
 

jboss

Banned
According to what I’ve read, Craig was told by Western Province that he wouldn’t get a contract as a wicket keeper because in their opinion he wasn’t a very good keeper. They told him to work on his keeping and comeback when it improved. Kieswetter from all reports is a bit of hot head (like KP) took it personally and left in disgust.

Additionally, Western Province, Boland and the Cape Cobras wicket keepers are not black, so he did not have black competition.
OMG clown it only works that way if you look at it one sided. Quotas effect white players more than black players. There is a limit of 4 black players at minimum which is the same as saying 7 white players as a maximum. So if there were 7 white players that were really good, he would have no chance. Of course there is no limit to haveing an all black team. The competition is ONLY white versus white as there is no restriction on black versus black.
 

TT Boy

Hall of Fame Member
Well leaving quotas aside, do you think that it is fair for some fans to be crying about Bangladesh being a test nation for not being able to produce cricketers of test quaility, yet Eng clearly can't do the same. What about the bias in colonialism here? Eng as the opressor surely set to benfit the most given that not nonly did they rule SA for many a year, but they are also 1st world which means they would no doubt draw more international players to thier shores than Bangladesh? Kieswetter could also go play in Bangladesh I bet. My main irritation here is that EVERY white South African has a link to Europe that dates to a mere 400 years at most and the moment they enter the EU (not just England) they become elligable to play for England due to kolpak and a numerous amount of other EEA /EU agreements. This is HUGE hand up to England alone in world cricket. I also think the ICC should step in and say that country x must compensate country y for amount of time and resources that were taken inot developing a good cricketer.
Kieswetter's links with the UK are not tenuous (parent is Scottish) and yet he still has to qualify to represent England. He didn't just get on a plane and instantly qualify; it has been a three year process. Yet, when he does qualify he still has to wait in the wings as England have Prior and probably Davies ahead of him. Paradoxically if he stayed in South Africa and thought for a place domestically he would have now probably played for the Proteas. According to the ECB’s criteria, Craig is still three years away from national selection.
 

TT Boy

Hall of Fame Member
OMG clown it only works that way if you look at it one sided. Quotas effect white players more than black players. There is a limit of 4 black players at minimum which is the same as saying 7 white players as a maximum. So if there were 7 white players that were really good, he would have no chance. Of course there is no limit to haveing an all black team. The competition is ONLY white versus white as there is no restriction on black versus black.
Did you not read the last page? You cannot address me like that. :)
 

jboss

Banned
Kieswetter's links with the UK are not tenuous (parent is Scottish) and yet he still has to qualify to represent England. He didn't just get on a plane and instantly qualify; it has been a three year process. Yet, when he does qualify he still has to wait in the wings as England have Prior and probably Davies ahead of him. Paradoxically if he stayed in South Africa and thought for a place domestically he would have now probably played for the Proteas. According to the ECB’s criteria, Craig is still three years away from national selection.
I think you misundertand kolpak then and the fact that getting into europe is as easy as having an ancestor there which no doubt every white south african has. Of course I am not implying that one can just walk into europe but it is VERY easy. Once you get into europe, you are entitled to be able to work and travel freely due to almost any country being a member of an EEA / EUA agreement. It really is not hard and def a lot easier than SA re making it for Tahir or more recently in rugby for the beast.
 

jboss

Banned
Kieswetter's links with the UK are not tenuous (parent is Scottish) and yet he still has to qualify to represent England. He didn't just get on a plane and instantly qualify; it has been a three year process. Yet, when he does qualify he still has to wait in the wings as England have Prior and probably Davies ahead of him. Paradoxically if he stayed in South Africa and thought for a place domestically he would have now probably played for the Proteas. According to the ECB’s criteria, Craig is still three years away from national selection.
Ok so being scottish means u get to play for england? Why the scottish, Irish, Wales and England rugby boards then?
 

TT Boy

Hall of Fame Member
I think you misundertand kolpak then and the fact that getting into europe is as easy as having an ancestor there which no doubt every white south african has. Of course I am not implying that one can just walk into europe but it is VERY easy. Once you get into europe, you are entitled to be able to work and travel freely due to almost any country being a member of an EEA / EUA agreement. It really is not hard and def a lot easier than SA re making it for Tahir or more recently in rugby for the beast.
I haven't, you have. Being Kolpak entails you to de facto EU working status; it doesn't make you get a British passport/qualification any quicker. That is what you were originally arguing.
 

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