*Official* England in South Africa

[Sir Alex]

60 - he's played two thirds of 100 Tests, so in the final third he needs to be twice as much above as he's currently below.

Required batting avg = Destination batting avg + [current deficit / (remaining tests/played tests)]

current deficit = destination bat avg - current average

In strauss case, current deficit = 50-45 = 5

So req bat avg = 50 + 5/(32/68) = 50 + 10.625 = 60.625

Not at all disagreeing with Samuel_Vimes. Just putting in a forumla.

 

[zaremba]

Required batting avg = Destination batting avg + [current deficit / (remaining tests/played tests)]

current deficit = destination bat avg - current average

In strauss case, current deficit = 50-45 = 5

So req bat avg = 50 + 5/(32/68) = 50 + 10.625 = 60.625

Not at all disagreeing with Samuel_Vimes. Just putting in a forumla.

Spot on.

 

[King Pietersen]

Just watching the start of England's innings on Sky + and loved the brilliant starts from Cook and then the even more epic first ball from Friedel De Wet, one of the worst first deliveries bowled in a Test career by a geniune bowler?

As for Cook, I thought he'd sorted his technical issues out with Gooch? Clearly not. Continually gets out in the same fashion time and time again, although he was lucky to be dropped by ABDV this time. I'd presume he gets out caught in the slips though without having watched the innings. I'd rather he be dropped than Bell, Bell gets alot of really unfair flak on these forums, he's really not that bad. Think it's gone beyond just a bad run of form for Cook, he's been pretty horrible for a long, long time. Made a few contributions but if he doesn't have a good series here, then he could be under real pressure. Get Carberry in tbh.

 

[BoyBrumby]

almost chocked on my breakfast listening to Ottis Gibson on sky. He was asked about fitness and said that it was cramp yesterday and that even the fittest players can cramp up. Seem to have short memory span these english.

Sure it's news to Ottis he's English all of a sudden.

Ah the fitness discussion again! Ottis Gibson claiming this morning that england bowler had cramp yesterday but at the same time England bowlers are fit! Well I remember chubby Strauss saying that cramp was down to lack of fitness. Anyway I am not convinced that the fitness is relevant in SA heat when you been out in the field for 2 days.

Now you must be angling here, surely? "Chubby" Strauss? He could gain five stone and still be the slimmest captain in the series.

I've long held the opinion that Cook gets a free ride with fans in comparison to Bell who has become the team scapegoat at times on forums, but I think dropping Bell would make a lot more sense at the moment as they aren't exactly openers bashing the door down. Joe Denly fills me with even less confidence than Cook at this point and I don't think the selectors would actually pick Carberry or Key TBH.

Moore, IMHO. We're obviously phasing English batsmen out (Morgan will doubtless replace Colly when he retires) and look a better side for it, frankly.

 

[Pothas]

Just watching the start of England's innings on Sky + and loved the brilliant starts from Cook and then the even more epic first ball from Friedel De Wet, one of the worst first deliveries bowled in a Test career by a geniune bowler?

As for Cook, I thought he'd sorted his technical issues out with Gooch? Clearly not. Continually gets out in the same fashion time and time again, although he was lucky to be dropped by ABDV this time. I'd presume he gets out caught in the slips though without having watched the innings. I'd rather he be dropped than Bell, Bell gets alot of really unfair flak on these forums, he's really not that bad. Think it's gone beyond just a bad run of form for Cook, he's been pretty horrible for a long, long time. Made a few contributions but if he doesn't have a good series here, then he could be under real pressure. Get Carberry in tbh.

Agree to a certain extent about Bell, he really has been that as a number 3 but if England want to go with six batsmen then the in the lower middle order he is pretty solid.
Would love to see Carberry play a test but he needs to back up last season with another good one this year, had a great 2006 then a shocker in 2007 followed by a fantastic season last year, if he has a good season this year then he should go to Australia where I think he would do pretty well.

 

[King Pietersen]

Yeah, as a number 3 he was pretty terrible, but he averages 42 at 4, 54 at 5 and 49 at 6. They're decent numbers, and he is a decent player. He's got his problems, he seemed to struggle against Johnson's bouncers and then looks to be moving across his stumps abit too much, setting him up for LBW's, but generally he's very good technically. He also had an excellent season in FC and OD cricket. I don't see why so many people want him out of the team so much, I think he's a good player, who, in the middle order has made runs. I wouldn't mind him in the ODi team either, and definitely think he should have been picked ahead of Cook and Denly. Actually has a pretty nice ODi record, averaging over 35 with a hundred and an ok strike rate. Better player than people give him credit for I think.

 

[Quaggas]

Spot on.

 

[Goughy]

Just watching the start of England's innings on Sky + and loved the brilliant starts from Cook and then the even more epic first ball from Friedel De Wet, one of the worst first deliveries bowled in a Test career by a geniune bowler?

As for Cook, I thought he'd sorted his technical issues out with Gooch? Clearly not. Continually gets out in the same fashion time and time again, although he was lucky to be dropped by ABDV this time. I'd presume he gets out caught in the slips though without having watched the innings. I'd rather he be dropped than Bell, Bell gets alot of really unfair flak on these forums, he's really not that bad. Think it's gone beyond just a bad run of form for Cook, he's been pretty horrible for a long, long time. Made a few contributions but if he doesn't have a good series here, then he could be under real pressure. Get Carberry in tbh.

Couldn't disagree more. Why would you ever drop the younger more talented guy for an older and worse player? Its just a case of thinking the grass is always greener.

Cook struggled against Australia but he has a good record for this past year. Even with supposed technical issues he is averaging high low 40s. Ill take that.

Cook and Strauss should be nailed on for the next couple of years come what may. Everyone has ups and downs and everyone has technical issues. The good players know how to cope with them. If Cook is a victim of his flaws and still producing what he does despite them then imagine what he could do if he sorts them out. Im not holding my breath but then he is already doing fine by me.

 

[GIMH]

Plus Cook & Strauss have a good record together, very good

The last thing we should do is drop our young opening batsman when we have no reserve opener on tour. Who would we bring in then? Luke Wright to open? What kind of ******** team would do that sort of thing on a tour of this magnitude?

 

[Pothas]

Couldn't disagree more. Why would you ever drop the younger more talented guy for an older and worse player? Its just a case of thinking the grass is always greener.

Cook struggled against Australia but he has a good record for this past year. Even with supposed technical issues he is averaging high low 40s. Ill take that.

Cook and Strauss should be nailed on for the next couple of years come what may. Everyone has ups and downs and everyone has technical issues. The good players know how to cope with them. If Cook is a victim of his flaws and still producing what he does despite them then imagine what he could do if he sorts them out. Im not holding my breath but then he is already doing fine by me.

I am not arguing as fervently as others for Cook to be dropped, would give him this tour at the very least but there is no way he should be nailed on. His performances over the last year or two really have not been very good. He is averaging 40 for this year because he scored runs against on very flat wickets in the West Indies and at home when they did not want to be there. There is genuine cause for concern with Cook and I don't think anyone can deny that.

 

[Goughy]

On the topic of Cook. He is still 24 and has 9 Test tons.

Who is the youngest English player to 10 Test 100's?

Cant be many, if any, that have done it before their 25th birthday.

 

[Pothas]

Yeah none have, Cook has got the most, Botham managed 8 though, just another illustration of how stupidly good he was at the start of his career.

Hutton surley would have had it not been for the that anoying little war.

 

[Goughy]

Yeah none have, Cook has got the most, Botham managed 8 though, just another illustration of how stupidly good he was at the start of his career.

Hutton surley would have had it not been for the that anoying little war.

Do you know who is the current holder is of the youngest to 10 Test tons for England and how old?

 

[Pothas]

Cannot bring myself to look at statsguru twice in one day but my guess would be Botham or Pietersen.

 

[aussie]

Seeing Cook continue to fail makes you realise how good Atherton was although he played in a difficult era. Dont rate Carberry as potential test opener, id be more inclined to go with Rob Key.

 

[Pothas]

ugh Key will never really be test class.

 

[aussie]

ugh Key will never really be test class.

He is not the greatest of course, his last stint as an ENG player he did ok. I think he has improved a bit in recent years, he's definately better than Carberry based on what i've seen of them IMO.

 

[Pothas]

Think we have seen enough of Key at test level to know that he is not going to be good enough, I have seen a lot of Carberry and must say that I never really exected him to be talked about in England terms but there were times last season that he looked top class, has great natural timing against pace and can score at a very good rate, he is also a great athlete and a fantastic fielder. Looks poor against spin at times and I am far from convinced that he would be a long term sucess at test level but I think we could do a lot worse.

 

[Furball]

Think we have seen enough of Key at test level to know that he is not going to be good enough, I have seen a lot of Carberry and must say that I never really exected him to be talked about in England terms but there were times last season that he looked top class, has great natural timing against pace and can score at a very good rate, he is also a great athlete and a fantastic fielder. Looks poor against spin at times and I am far from convinced that he would be a long term sucess at test level but I think we could do a lot worse.

yeah, cause there's no way a player can improve in 5 years.

 

[Pothas]

yeah, cause there's no way a player can improve in 5 years.

Well I don't think that his domestic performances has improved that dramatically since he last played a test match,

I will be honest, I have never really taken a liking to Key and I never claim to be entirely objective while judging a player but he has never looked like an international batsman to me. Fine player to watch in county cricket, saw him score a double hundred against an awful West Indies team which was very entertaining but would never back him to succeed on a long term basis.