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*Official* England in South Africa
- Thread starter James
- Start date
four_or_six
Cricketer Of The Year
I wonder why on earth he isn't scoring.
Oscillatingmind
U19 Cricketer
Anyone know about this David Wiese,
David Wiese | Cricket Players and Officials | Cricinfo.com
very promising looking all-rounder stats there.
David Wiese | Cricket Players and Officials | Cricinfo.com
very promising looking all-rounder stats there.
Briony
International Debutant
They are not really first class cricketers in that most rarely play for the top six franchises in SA. They would be the equivalent of club cricketers in the Aussie system.
King Pietersen
International Captain
I'm just hoping that we don't choose to go in with Wright @ 7. I honestly don't see what Luke Wright offers to the team. He weakens the batting (compared to if we had say Bell at 6) and I don't think strengthens the bowling a great deal. Sure he'll help bowl a few overs, but I don't see him being a genuine wicket-taking threat and therefore doesn't really bring anything to the table. He's an ok bits and pieces cricketer that does a decent job in the absence of Andrew Flintoff in ODi's and I don't see him being a success at Test level. If Anderson, Broad, Swann and presumably Onions can't get 20 wickets in a Test, then I don't see how Wright is going to help things.
I'd like to see us going into the 1st Test with:
Strauss
Cook
Trott
Pietersen
Collingwood
Bell
Prior +
Broad
Swann
Anderson
Onions
I'd like to see us going into the 1st Test with:
Strauss
Cook
Trott
Pietersen
Collingwood
Bell
Prior +
Broad
Swann
Anderson
Onions
zaremba
Cricketer Of The Year
Trott will definitely play. There's no way even our selectors would drop the man who in his last Test innings scored an Ashes-winning hundred.
As for Bell v Wright, it's not a great choice really. But let's face it, Bell is in a completely different league as a batsman. Wright does indeed have something about him but whatever it is it's not Test quality. His bowling has never been particularly threatening in county cricket and although his batting has improved he's nowhere near Bell's class. So I would prefer to see Bell at 6. His record there is good IIRC.
Am I forgetting someone though? I seem to remember saying recently that Prior should bat at 6 and another batsman at 7 (not Broad and not Bell). Can't remember who that was though.
As for Bell v Wright, it's not a great choice really. But let's face it, Bell is in a completely different league as a batsman. Wright does indeed have something about him but whatever it is it's not Test quality. His bowling has never been particularly threatening in county cricket and although his batting has improved he's nowhere near Bell's class. So I would prefer to see Bell at 6. His record there is good IIRC.
Am I forgetting someone though? I seem to remember saying recently that Prior should bat at 6 and another batsman at 7 (not Broad and not Bell). Can't remember who that was though.
four_or_six
Cricketer Of The Year
Rashid?
King Pietersen
International Captain
Dropping Bell would be harsh I think. He made a good contribution in the final Test match, making a very nice 72 in the first innings that deserved a hundred, and really helped put us in a good position in the match. He had a very good season in FC and One Day cricket for Warwickshire last season and I personally love watching him bat. He has 4 hundreds batting at 6 at an average of 49 as well, so I'd much prefer to see him there in place of Luke Wright. He really does get some unfair criticism around here.
zaremba
Cricketer Of The Year
No although there may be a case for it soon.
The player I was thinking of was Morgan but since he's not in the Test squad it seems a long shot.
So Bell is probably the man. The selectors do like to pick 5 bowlers though and on that basis might pick Wright to bat 7. Hmmmm.
TT Boy
Hall of Fame Member
Courtesy of amateur cricket. Huge hitter of the ball though.
As Briony rightfully pointed out, England are playing a bunch of amateurs. **** knows why England agreed to it. Hardly adequate preparation for a test match.
zaremba
Cricketer Of The Year
Amateur or not, it's FC cricket isn't it? What's the story here? Sorry, I'm a bit in the dark about South African domestic cricket.
Prince EWS
Global Moderator
It's First Class cricket by name only; not by standard. It's a tier below the franchise competition - essentially it's an old competition left over from the restructure that didn't have its First Class status revoked even when its best players stopped competiting in it. It's a trap you have to avoid; it has about as much relevance as Sydney 1st Grade cricket.
TT Boy
Hall of Fame Member
South Africa has two first class cricket systems. Franchise cricket is professional (6 teams), provincial is amateur and played by kids, journeymen ex-pros, franchise reserves and primarily acts as a feeder towards franchise cricket. Why it retains first class status despite its poor standard is more of a legacy of the past, boards still very strong and it also means transformation is more obtainable.
A guy like David Wiesse is one of many cricketers who due to this have fine statistical records but they mean nothing. Richard Levi is always the example I use, now playing franchise cricket with the Cobras (Graeme Smith's team) but when he use to play amateur cricket for Western Province, he averaged over 100 with the bat.
And Vernon 'Pro' Philander currently has a first class bowling average at around 20 (150 plus first class wickets) but without checking, I would guess the majority of those wickets were taking playing provincial cricket.
Prince EWS
Global Moderator
120 wickets @ 21 for the Cobras actually. It surprised me too because he's looked rank bad every time I've seen him bowl.
Goughy
Hall of Fame Member
^ all true, but also worth pointing out that the Franchise teams are representitive of combinations of Provincial teams. Like how Super 14 rugby works.
So Titans are made up of players from Easterns and Northerns first class cricket teams and to a lessar extent Limpopo and Mpumalanga.
Think of Provincial cricket as the FC system (the traditional) and the Franchise cricket as a layer between that and International where the best cricketers are pulled together to form stronger teams. It doesnt necessarily work that way as Franchise is now the focus and Provincial cricket is pretty weak but that is the logic.
Provincial cricket stats are now pretty useless in assessing a player for further honours.
So Titans are made up of players from Easterns and Northerns first class cricket teams and to a lessar extent Limpopo and Mpumalanga.
Think of Provincial cricket as the FC system (the traditional) and the Franchise cricket as a layer between that and International where the best cricketers are pulled together to form stronger teams. It doesnt necessarily work that way as Franchise is now the focus and Provincial cricket is pretty weak but that is the logic.
Provincial cricket stats are now pretty useless in assessing a player for further honours.
aussie
Hall of Fame Member
ha.
Uppercut
Request Your Custom Title Now!
Haha that's nuts. Although I've only seen him play ODIs. He might be a decent FC bowler because I don't imagine he overuses his pace variation so ridiculously in that form of the game.
TT Boy
Hall of Fame Member
Newlands and Paarl are dog wickets, suits Philander down to a tea as he moves the ball both ways and bowls stump-to-stump. I would be interested to see what he averages outside of the Cape. Though, he didn't disgrace himself at Middlesex with the ball.
Said it before but if he lost weight, learnt to catch, worked on the batting and cut the attitude (apparently he wasn't very popular in the national side), he would be a better option than McLaren.