*Official* England in South Africa

[wpdavid]

First class bowling this season

Onions 69 at 19.95 econ 3.21 /sr 37.2
Plunkett 52 at 22.40 econ 3.29 s/r 40.8
Anderson 39 at 22.71 econ 3.04 s/r 44.6
Harmison 62 at 23.48 econ 2.96 s/r 47.5
Sidebottom 31 at 24.51 econ 2.91 s/r 50.3

Lewis 51 at 20.60 econ 2.67 s/r 46.2 (2nd Div)
Kirby 62 at 20.85 econ 2.88 s/r 43.4 (2nd Div)
Lucas 52 at 23.15 econ 3.11 s/r 44.5 (2nd Div)

Broad 36 at 26.08 econ 3.30 s/r 47.3

Finn 53 at 30.64 econ 3.88 s/r 47.3 (2nd Div)
Woakes 46 at 32.52 econ 3.22 s/r 60.5
Mahmood 38 at 33.39 econ 3.61 s/r 55.5
Harris 39 at 34.35 econ 3.37 sr/ 61.1 (2nd Div)
Bresnan 32 at 35.50 econ 2.63 s/r 83.1

Plunkett's figures are noteworthy - I'd realised he'd had some good performances, but I hadn't realised they were that good. Perhaps a platform for next year and beyond.

Can't see how Bresnan's justify him going to SA, even if he is supposed to recognise one end of the bat from the other.

 

[BoyBrumby]

I think Kirby's might catch the eye of the selectors too. Although he's now north of 30, he is more of a back-of-a-length bowler than any of the other possibles apart from Harmy (who doesn't sound as if his heart is really in touring & was awful when we won in SA anyway) and maybe Finn, whose time will come again. I think if we pack the squad with bowlers who rely on swing for the most part (and Sid & Jimmy seem neutered without it) we're making ourselves too much a hostage to fortune. Or the weather.

Kirby's definitely got a bit of devil in him and was picked for the second Loins game, so is on the selectors' radar at least.

 

[aussie]

James Harris anyone?

One of the better young bowlers around, but he is not ready for international cricket.

 

[fredfertang]

Here's a plan - pick Glen Chapple - take a hypnotist on tour and every morning put Chappy under and convince him its Lancashire's last game of the season and they need to win to avoid relegation - a spell of 6 for next to nothing will follow - and it works for his batting too

 

[Manee]

Doesn't explain the averaging 21 tbh. 21! I don't think people are grasping just how good that is. Find me a current international fast bowler with a better FC record than that. There must be something seriously good about this guy.

And if there's not and it's all a big bizarre fluke, you can't fault the selectors for giving him a try. Has been bloody good for the Lions too, incidentally.

What does he average?

 

[Jarquis]

What does he average?

249 FC wickets @ 21.32 to be precise

 

[Pothas]

Only seem him bowl once, tbf. Operated exclusively around 78-81mph and got absolutely carted. Only bowled 4 overs of his allotment and went for about 40-odd. Davies took a real liking to him. Suspect Pro40 probably not his natural milieu, but Sky rarely carry FC games.

Would say Clark's faster on the gun and off the pitch myself and definitely gets more carry. Davies is Jon Lewis with better hair & worse fitness, essentially.

Saw him for the first time last week on a dead Rose bowl pitch and would guess he was bowling at just around 80 with the keeper up, pitch had nothing in it for the fast bowlers though and he did not look threatening however he did not bowl a single bad ball and conceeded very few runs. Always hard to tell how good such a bowler is on a pitch like that, I saw Shane Bond bowl on a similar wicket a couple of years back and he never looked like getting a wicket.

 

[tooextracool]

According to Scyld Berry in the daily Telegraph, G. Jones is set for a recall for the reserve keeper spot to SA based on a one season run in season 2 and Joe Denly is one ODI knock away from a place in the test side on the basis that he's impressed the England management with his rubbish technique and poor temperament.

 

[tooextracool]

First class bowling this season

Onions 69 at 19.95 econ 3.21 /sr 37.2
Plunkett 52 at 22.40 econ 3.29 s/r 40.8
Anderson 39 at 22.71 econ 3.04 s/r 44.6
Harmison 62 at 23.48 econ 2.96 s/r 47.5
Sidebottom 31 at 24.51 econ 2.91 s/r 50.3

Lewis 51 at 20.60 econ 2.67 s/r 46.2 (2nd Div)
Kirby 62 at 20.85 econ 2.88 s/r 43.4 (2nd Div)
Lucas 52 at 23.15 econ 3.11 s/r 44.5 (2nd Div)

Broad 36 at 26.08 econ 3.30 s/r 47.3

Finn 53 at 30.64 econ 3.88 s/r 47.3 (2nd Div)
Woakes 46 at 32.52 econ 3.22 s/r 60.5
Mahmood 38 at 33.39 econ 3.61 s/r 55.5
Harris 39 at 34.35 econ 3.37 sr/ 61.1 (2nd Div)
Bresnan 32 at 35.50 econ 2.63 s/r 83.1

Has anyone seen Plunkett bowl this season? Are the calls for his selection justified?
There aren't really very many options, seems like its really between Harmison and Plunkett so it might not be the worst option I guess.

 

[zaremba]

Davies has to be given a chance sooner or later. He's a medium pacer, let's deal with that. Yes, medium pacers can look unthreatening on modern Test pitches from time to time, but so can finger spinners, and England seem happy to select finger spinners who average in the 30s in FC cricket. Davies averages 21. Worth a shot.

 

[Lillian Thomson]

Joe Denly is one ODI knock away from a place in the test side on the basis that he's impressed the England management with his rubbish technique and poor temperament.

I didn't realise they'd set the bar that high.

 

[fredfertang]

Davies has to be given a chance sooner or later. He's a medium pacer, let's deal with that. Yes, medium pacers can look unthreatening on modern Test pitches from time to time, but so can finger spinners, and England seem happy to select finger spinners who average in the 30s in FC cricket. Davies averages 21. Worth a shot.

He's all but 29 though - after this season's performance if another Durham seamer is going to get the trip it really should be Plunkett - he's averaging 44 with the bat too

 

[zaremba]

All but 29 - so what? Fred, you're nearly that old and you won't convince me that you've given up on your hopes of international honours just yet.

Honestly, the guys' got 250 wickets at 21, it's not as though he's a late developer, he's just a normally-developing outstanding bowler who's just never been picked to play. Stuart Clark was that sort of age when he first got picked for the Crims, and he was (and remains) a high quality Test bowler who, as has been pointed out, gets it down the other end at about the same pace as Davies.

Sure, maybe Davies benefits a little from playing his home matches in conditions consisting of subarctic tundra where the ball skids off the frozen soil, but even allowing for that, this guy is a seriously good bowler with an outstanding record.

England is not blessed with a deep well of quality seamers* and the idea that we can overlook Davies is folly.

*See Harmison, SJ, constant selection of and Plunkett, LE, talk of a recall of

 

[aussie]

According to Scyld Berry in the daily Telegraph, G. Jones is set for a recall for the reserve keeper spot to SA based on a one season run in season 2 and Joe Denly is one ODI knock away from a place in the test side on the basis that he's impressed the England management with his rubbish technique and poor temperament.

Although both decisions would be crazy if they do come to pass. But no way does Denly have a rubbish technique (although it aint fantastic by any means) and poor temperament.

 

[aussie]

Has anyone seen Plunkett bowl this season? Are the calls for his selection justified?
There aren't really very many options, seems like its really between Harmison and Plunkett so it might not be the worst option I guess.

I caught him in a OD game on sky about 2 weeks ago i think, didn't see anything special to suggest he is an improved bowler by any means. I am stunned at his FC performances this year TBH, i guess it just goes to show how poor the standard of cricket is, if Plunkett is doing so well.

Harmo is stress, but he has to tour SA once he wants to still play for ENG. If we seriously considering Plunkett, you know we got problems.

 

[fredfertang]

All but 29 - so what? Fred, you're nearly that old and you won't convince me that you've given up on your hopes of international honours just yet.

'tis true Mr Z but the "Boo Boo" game does not put quite such the same emphasis on youth

Honestly, the guys' got 250 wickets at 21, it's not as though he's a late developer, he's just a normally-developing outstanding bowler who's just never been picked to play. Stuart Clark was that sort of age when he first got picked for the Crims, and he was (and remains) a high quality Test bowler who, as has been pointed out, gets it down the other end at about the same pace as Davies.

Sure, maybe Davies benefits a little from playing his home matches in conditions consisting of subarctic tundra where the ball skids off the frozen soil, but even allowing for that, this guy is a seriously good bowler with an outstanding record.

England is not blessed with a deep well of quality seamers* and the idea that we can overlook Davies is folly.

*See Harmison, SJ, constant selection of and Plunkett, LE, talk of a recall of

Don't misunderstand me - I'm not knocking Davies more noting that Plunkett has done well and, by all accounts, has played very well

Personally I'm still all for ceding Durham to Scotland and giving the Sweaties Test status so we can have a competitive LVCC next year - of course in that way there'd be a vacancy in Div 1 for one of the weaker counties

 

[zaremba]

Ouch

 

[fredfertang]

Ouch

Sorry - what I meant was one of the stronger counties could be reprieved

 

[zaremba]

haha, nice one. Right, I'm off to bed, I've got a busy day tomorrow escaping from the bairns and the mother-in-law working.

 

[popepouri]

Looks like Neil Manthorpe agrees. Can't see Albie keeping his place much longer. Fantastic hitter, but if you're coming in at number 7, you're not really contributing that much to the team except for 6 hitting down the order, which South Africa has plenty of in Bouch, VDM and Parnell.

Concentrating on the Proteas' failed run chase against England and Graeme Smith's epic 141 is to miss the point about South Africa's exit from the Champions Trophy. It was the bowling which failed, not the batting.

Dale Steyn and Wayne Parnell were rusty but they are the future. They have already won games as a new-ball combination against Australia and, although they will have 'off' days like everyone else, they are the best combination in the country and have the potential to become one of the best in the world.

The problem for the Proteas lies with the third seamer. Jacques Kallis is bowling as well as he ever has at the moment but, because of the attacking length he bowls naturally and his batting responsibilities, he is not - and never has been - a 10-over man. Which means someone has to share his allocation. And Albie Morkel is struggling.

The bitter irony is that Morkel was first selected for South Africa as a fast bowler who could smash a few runs at the end of the innings but injuries have taken their toll and his medium pacers now lack control and leave the team vulnerable every time he comes on to bowl.

He still hits the ball more cleanly than anyone and there's no better sight that Albie in full cry during a batting power play - but at the moment he's a 'luxury' item at number seven and the Proteas need a genuine, wicket-taking third seamer. Are Albie's days numbered?

Looks like Morne is hitting some form domestically and I can see him making a comeback at first change. Tsotsobe is more of a swing bowler so I don't see him doing much with the older ball and he's just not quick enough, however I haven't seen him bowl recently.

The line up should be:

Smith
Amla/Gibbs
Kallis
AB
Duminy
Boucher
VDM
Parnell
Botha
Morne/Lopsy
Steyn

If they drop him, I don't see this as the end of Albie. He looks like a fantastic no. 6 when Kallis retires.