Richard
Cricket Web Staff Member
Even if this were correct, the fact is Gilchrist of '99/00-'03 was far superior than Gilchrist AT ANY POINT later in his Test career.
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Greatest individual performance ever
- Thread starter oitoitoi
- Start date
Richard
Cricket Web Staff Member
That'd be why... TBH.
Cruxdude
International Debutant
The very fact that a bowler managed to get all ten batsmen out should make it come near the top. Put in India vs Pakistan and the drama behind the series its importance increases. But yeah the pitch was a turner, considering it was in India and it was a 4th day pitch, but still as you said it is a remarkable performance which ahs not been repeated since given there have been even worse turners around. (Ind vs Aus Mumbai)
Richard
Cricket Web Staff Member
Not to mention the fact it'd been vandalised just a few weeks earlier.
Cruxdude
International Debutant
Yeah what you say is true but this match was between two sub continental teams, not Australia or England. They also had a great spinner, Saqlain (I truly believe he is plain unlucky not to be competing for one of the best spinners of the modern era). It was a good enough pitch and if you remember Pakistan was going on well till around 101/0.
So what I want to say is while the pitch was helpful it wasn't unplayable at all and nor were the batsmen poor players of spin. It was indeed a top class effort.
Richard
Cricket Web Staff Member
It was, IMO, a proper Indian turner with a bit of "help" from vandals. It's a damn shame we haven't seen very many of that sort of deck in India of late.
Places like the FSK, IIRR, tended to specialise more in them than many Indian grounds (and let's face it, there are so many grounds in India you're always going to get plenty of variation - or at least, did until recently when almost all seem to have become uniform slow, low, not-much-seam, not-much-turn conformists).
Places like the FSK, IIRR, tended to specialise more in them than many Indian grounds (and let's face it, there are so many grounds in India you're always going to get plenty of variation - or at least, did until recently when almost all seem to have become uniform slow, low, not-much-seam, not-much-turn conformists).
Cruxdude
International Debutant
Ya the tracks in India have very much become boring. I just don't understand the logic of complaining to the ICC when India pitches turn a mile. It is like complaining the Perth pitch is too fast, it swings in England and such stuff. I think the nativity of the pitches is something that should not be removed. Come to India prepared to play on turners.
Noble One
International Vice-Captain
Tough to be regarded as one of the best spinners of the modern era when you are competing against Warne, Murali and Kumble. Didn't have the longevity of his contemparies either, 49 Tests is a small amount compared to the competition.
Saqlain was a fantastic off-spin bowler in test cricket, but belonged to a tier below the best. Was always one of the best spin bowlers to watch when in form, classical off-spinners action, good doosra. Almost appeared to lose his ability to bowl as an off-spinner in the later part of his Test career, became too focused on bowling the doosra.
Fantastic cricketer though, decent Test bowler, brilliant ODI bowler (one of the best). Shame his international career drifted off perhaps too early.
SJS
Hall of Fame Member
I completely agree.
Saqlain was one of the great off spinners of the game. He was a fabulous bowler as it is but when you remember that it was he who gave cricket the doosra, his place in the spinners legions becomes very important. Saqlain is the Bosanquet of Off spinners.
He is also probably the finest limited spinners of all time. Yes Murali is a better bowler but then he is a wrist spinner as Richard never fails to remind me (and I agree he has a point) - take away Murali and you have to go back a long way to find a better finger spinner than Saqlain Mushtaq.
His tragedy is his poor career ending and the fact that he was an unglamorous cricketer which never makes you a super-star in the sub-continent.
Totally agree, his record really stands up to scrutiny too which is a rare thing among even some of the great players. One of my favourite schoolboy imitations (you know when you're a kid and each boy pretends to be an international player, everyone fights over tendulkar...) was shouting 'Bowling Saqi Bowling!' a la Moin Khan & Rashid Latif. Had a lovely action too. Very underrated, was amazed at how easily he was discarded and how quickly he was forgotten. Of course having to bowl to Sehwag at Multan at the back end of your career doesn't help. IMO the best ever limited overs spinner, I've seen Murali thrashed too many times. They should legalise the doosra to within 20-25 degrees IMO, makes the game so much more interesting, extraordinarily difficult to bowl it legally otherwise, though Saqlain found a way. Don't remember even Bedi having anything bad to say about him.
Shri
Mr. Glass
Cruxdude
International Debutant
The way Bedi goes after Murali is a real disgrace. The poor man has bowled with his arm in a brace and shown that he can still bowl the doosra. I feel it is a case of jealousy and arrogance.
andruid
Cricketer Of The Year
The ICup is a legit FC tournament not soem toss about in a park
.............it was a joke, test cricket only. ICup is nowhere near that standard I'm afraid.
aussie
Hall of Fame Member
As we've argued before, there is no reason to exclude IND 03/04 - NZ 05 from his "peak period".
aussie
Hall of Fame Member
Yo, a wa do ya mateyyyyy???, rassclathhhh
As we have argued before. Just because your "statistical perfection ideals", that Gilchrist specifically between IND 03/04 to NZ 05 - didn't average 60+ doesn't mean he was in a form slump.
Simply because unlike the 05 Ashes he was worked out technically or looked incapable of scoring runs cosnsistently in test, as was the case from 05 Ashes to IND 07/08. Nobody during 2003/04 to 2004/05 had highlighted or was attacking him with the around the wicket-tactic for example.
Its just that during that period he played in the sub-continent alot & he played the way Gilly plays againts spin, which is hit & miss - just like IND 01. Based on this boring argument now that I think of it, Gilchrist should have been in a form slump for the last two test of the 2001 series??, since if you check his innings list, he had not gone 4 innings without a big score betwwen PAK 99 to Mumbai 01??
Plus vs IND 03/04. He got himself most of the times, only time he got a good delivery was the SCG when Pathan bowled him with a brilliant inswinging yorker & possibly the 2nd morning @ tthe Gabba (the only overcast period of the 5 days) when Khan took advantage i think he got a good delivery, can't remember for sure.
But fact is, there is no way you could have seen Gilchrist bat from IND 03/04 to NZ 05 & come to the conclusion he was in a form slump. Just give this one up will ya dawgy...
