Who has been the worst ever best batsman in the world?

[Something_Fishy]

Hmmm... Is it only me that picked up on a grammatical error in the title? Surely there is only one best ever batsman, and then he is the best and the worst?

 

[Matt79]

Typo, should read worst ever "best batsman in the world"?

Between Chappell and Richards' retiring and Tendulkar, Waugh and Lara climbing the mountain, Allan Border and or Javed Miandad would surely have had to be in contention for the title?

Let's break this down - perhaps someone can be arsed looking up those PWC ranking thingys, but I can't and will just go off "I reckon"...

2002 - Ponting/Dravid/Kallis/MoYo
1993-2002 - At any time one of Tendulkar/Lara/Waugh
circa 1987/8-1993 - Border/Miandad
1970-1987 - either Greg Chappell/Viv Richards/Sunil Gavaskar
1959-1970 - Garry Sobers
1948-1959 - Neil Harvey/Everton Weekes/Frank Worrell
1930-1948 - Bradman
192?-1929 - Hammond
1918-192? - maybe Hobbs (although he himself said he was never the same after WWI)/Sutcliffe

Off that rough listing, I'd nominate MoYo and perhaps Dravid as the worst players (although its a pretty damn select list). The thing is there were probably other players who bobbed up to claim the title for a year or two in the manner of MoYo that I'm not including here, before my time.

 

[The Sean]

Hutton and May both spent time as the "acknowledged" best batsman in the world during the 1950s as well. Statistically one could argue that Peter May was very much among the lesser lights to have held that title (4,537 runs at 46.77), and yet his reputation is such that this would be branded laughable by those who saw him play.

 

[adharcric]

Peter May is certainly an outside contender. Well, I just went through the ICC test batsmen ratings for January 1 of every year since World War I and emerged from the tedious (actually, it was a great cricket history lesson and I'm glad I went through the effort) process with some interesting findings. Only on five occasions have the top-rated test batsmen had a rating below 800:

1973 Garry Sobers 776 (Stackpole close behind)
1974 Garry Sobers 789
1985 Allan Border 783 (Miandad close behind)
1991 Richie Richardson 789
1995 Sachin Tendulkar 776 (Adams, Lara close behind)

Looks like Sobers and Tendulkar were the worst ever "best batsman in the world".

 

[archie mac]

Hutton and May both spent time as the "acknowledged" best batsman in the world during the 1950s as well. Statistically one could argue that Peter May was very much among the lesser lights to have held that title (4,537 runs at 46.77), and yet his reputation is such that this would be branded laughable by those who saw him play.

There is a claim for Morris circa 1948-1950 that he was better then the ageing Bradman

I think Hobbs was the best until Hammond and then Bradman, and then I would go Morris, Hutton, May, Weekes, Sobers (although Pollock had a claim for a little while), GSC or Gavaskar, Richards, Richardson or Border

 

[Evermind]

Both Border and Miandad are pretty good nominations. Seconded.

 

[biased indian]

so this should exclude every player played since 1989 rite since tendulkar is still going on ???

or we are looking at there top performing period only ??

 

[Uppercut]

so this should exclude every player played since 1989 rite since tendulkar is still going on ???

or we are looking at there top performing period only ??

Nah it's who was considered the world's best batsman at the time. In 1990, for instance, noone thought Sachin was the world's best- I would guess he was viewed in the same way as, say, JP Duminy is viewed today.

 

[Matt79]

so this should exclude every player played since 1989 rite since tendulkar is still going on ???

or we are looking at there top performing period only ??

i think its basically referring to those PriceWaterhouseCooper's rankings, or equivalent. Although Tendulkar has a strong claim to have been the best batsman career wise for most of his career, there have certainly been times during his career when others have been ahead of him in a short-term sense.

 

[biased indian]

Nah it's who was considered the world's best batsman at the time. In 1990, for instance, noone thought Sachin was the world's best- I would guess he was viewed in the same way as, say, JP Duminy is viewed today.

but i the bowler thread SS had taken Mcgrath entire career ???

think once he is established as the best... his full career is taken

 

[Matt79]

SS is not always entirely rational about McGrath. That said, one amazing thing about McGrath is he never really had any kind of substantial slump through his whole career, whereas Sachin, Lara, Waugh etc as batsmen all certainly have.

 

[Uppercut]

but i the bowler thread SS had taken Mcgrath entire career ???

think once he is established as the best... his full career is taken

Nah, it's just that at that time you had Ambrose and Akram so for the purposes of a debate on low-quality fast bowling it barely got a second glance.

 

[Uppercut]

SS is not always entirely rational about McGrath. That said, one amazing thing about McGrath is he never really had any kind of substantial slump through his whole career, whereas Sachin, Lara, Waugh etc as batsmen all certainly have.

His slump was at the start...

 

[G.I.Joe]

His slump lasted for one whole day sometime in 2001 imo.

 

[Richard]

I would say he was better than Vengsarakar though. I'd put Yousuf in my all time XI over Vengsarkar.

 

[Richard]

i think its basically referring to those PriceWaterhouseCooper's rankings, or equivalent.

But they don't show who's the best, just who's the most in-form.

Although Tendulkar has a strong claim to have been the best batsman career wise for most of his career, there have certainly been times during his career when others have been ahead of him in a short-term sense.

Tendulkar, in my view, was indisputably the best batsman around between 1996 and 2002. Between '94 and '96 it'd have been Lara; '90 to '94 Gooch.

Between '03 and '06 I'd say Lara again; in '06/07 Ponting; currently Pietersen.

Richards probably stopped being the best in, what... '88? So if we say Vengsarkar for 2 years there until Gooch took over in '90?

Before Richards (whose reign started in '76) it'd have been Greg Chappell. Before Chappell, Sobers. When did he establish himself again? And who between him and Bradman's retirement in '48?

Not too difficult, I don't think, to say:
Hobbs - 1918 to 1926
Hammond - 1936 to 1929/30
Bradman - 1930 to 1948
Weekes - 1949 to 1958 (was he still playing then?)
Sobers - 1958 to 1973
Greg Chappell - 1974 to 1975/76
Vivian Richards - 1976 to 1988
Vengsarkar - 1989
Gooch - 1990 to 1993
Lara - 1994 to 1996
Tendulkar - 1996 to 2002
Lara - 2003 to 2006
Ponting - 2006/07
Chanderpaul - 2007 to current

Just a couple of gaps to fill - the first would obviously need at least 2 players. EDIT: based on Sean's post, yes, that Everton Weekes wasn't bad, was he?

 

[thierry henry]

Well then, I vote Pietersen

 

[sammy2]

Chanderpaul has been the best batsman over the last few years. Get the hell outta here with your rubbish.

 

[TT Boy]

Chanderpaul has been the best batsman over the last few years. Get the hell outta here with your rubbish.

Good shout, Sammy. Chanderpaul fits this criteria.

 

[Uppercut]

Good shout, Sammy. Chanderpaul fits this criteria.

Funny because it's true.