Who do you think the best bowlers are at present??

[Athlai]

Period from?? I guess start of 2008.

Last 12 months.

 

[Uppercut]

Vettori's been a bit ineffective lately in tests.

 

[BoyBrumby]

No brainer, the best is Murali.

Quite.

Best seamer more of an interesting shout tho. I remain mildly unconvinced by Steyn, mainly because he never seems to do much in games I've watched.

I am biased, obv, but think Sir Frederick has a good a case as any.

 

[Uppercut]

Quite.

Best seamer more of an interesting shout tho. I remain mildly unconvinced by Steyn, mainly because he never seems to do much in games I've watched.

I am biased, obv, but think Sir Frederick has a good a case as any.

Freddie has that habit of bowling brilliantly without getting any wickets though. I've just had a look, and in the SA series he finished with an average of 36, the 8th best out of both teams. Despite bowling damn well. And since that's the only series he's played in what seems like forever, i don't think he has a case to be number 1.

 

[BoyBrumby]

Freddie has that habit of bowling brilliantly without getting any wickets though. I've just had a look, and in the SA series he finished with an average of 36, the 8th best out of both teams. Despite bowling damn well. And since that's the only series he's played in what seems like forever, i don't think he has a case to be number 1.

Would call that treason if you weren't a non-pom.

Think he's asked to do too much, myself. He's both our best defensive bowler & our best attacking option, so his figures don't actually reflect his true ability as a bowler. IMHO, obv.

 

[Uppercut]

Would call that treason if you weren't a non-pom.

Think he's asked to do too much, myself. He's both our best defensive bowler & our best attacking option, so his figures don't actually reflect his true ability as a bowler. IMHO, obv.

Obviously an average of 36 doesn't remotely do his ability justice, nor does his career average. I do love ol' Freddie.

I just think he has trouble with turning good bowling into wickets, always has done, and he never ever gets big hauls.

 

[BoyBrumby]

Obviously an average of 36 doesn't remotely do his ability justice, nor does his career average. I do love ol' Freddie.

I just think he has trouble with turning good bowling into wickets, always has done, and he never ever gets big hauls.

No, that is certainly true. 2 five-fors in 60+ (I think) tests is shocking for a bowler of his ability. Does the hard yards, but never seems to pick up the tail as some other seamers do. Don't know why, really as his yorker is more than serviceable.

 

[Rant0r]

he bowled quite brilliantly in and leading up to '05, has been crippled by injury since, even in australia in '06/07 he was marvellous without reward while carrying his team and injury. while the aussies piled up runs he kept pounding in and beating the bat, hope he gets back to full fitness

 

[Uppercut]

No, that is certainly true. 2 five-fors in 60+ (I think) tests is shocking for a bowler of his ability. Does the hard yards, but never seems to pick up the tail as some other seamers do. Don't know why, really as his yorker is more than serviceable.

Yeah i had a look at his record against players batting at 8-11 in comparison with Kallis and Steyn a while back. Relatively speaking, his tail-cleaning abilities are pretty shocking.

I remember someone here suggesting that it's his back-of-a-length line that tends to make tail-enders play and miss a lot rather than nick out. Their example was that Makhaya Ntini has a similar poor record against the tail. Dale Steyn by comparison, who pitches the ball as full as any top-class bowler i've ever seen, is unbelievable at cleaning up the last few.

Also i haven't seen that many tail-enders fall to yorkers recently. Not sure if that's a real trend or it's just in matches i've watched. The only player i've seen use them successfully to rip through the lower order regularly is Lasith Malinga.

 

[Rant0r]

which seems to be chris martin's weakness, full and on the stumps, amazing, misses it almost every time

 

[Richard]

I saw in the other thread you were telling FC records are there for a reason. (Re Krejza I think). You discounted test performances by citing FC records then. Now you discount FC records of Mendis by stating he's played only 3 tests. Why dont you check out his ODI records also???

FFS Show some consistency.

Totally different matter. Am I saying there's no indication of how Mendis is likely to fare in Test cricket? No, of course I'm not. I fully expect him to be excellent, as his First-Class record - even by Sri Lankan standards - is terrific.

I'm saying that you can't really call him one of the best Test bowlers right now, because he's played virtually no Test cricket.

Consistency of answer requires consistency of question.

 

[tooextracool]

Yeah i had a look at his record against players batting at 8-11 in comparison with Kallis and Steyn a while back. Relatively speaking, his tail-cleaning abilities are pretty shocking.

I remember someone here suggesting that it's his back-of-a-length line that tends to make tail-enders play and miss a lot rather than nick out. Their example was that Makhaya Ntini has a similar poor record against the tail. Dale Steyn by comparison, who pitches the ball as full as any top-class bowler i've ever seen, is unbelievable at cleaning up the last few.

Also i haven't seen that many tail-enders fall to yorkers recently. Not sure if that's a real trend or it's just in matches i've watched. The only player i've seen use them successfully to rip through the lower order regularly is Lasith Malinga.

One of my major criticisms of Flintoff throughout his career is his inability to bowl on the stumps. There really is no point in having a tailender playing and missing, you have to bowl on the stumps so that if they miss (and they will miss sooner rather than later) they will be out.
Ntini is possibly also the same, however, in his case it might not make much of a difference to his overall record for IMO he is a rather ordinary bowler anyways. With Flintoff it is frustrating for he could be a far better bowler by bowling at the stumps more often.

 

[analyst]

At the present moment, in terms of quicks, I would pick Steyn and Sharma almost at the same level, followed closely by Morkel, Zaheer,Lee(even if he is having a blip) and Clark. With regards to spin, Murali, Mendis and Harbajhan and the cupboard is a bit bare.

 

[tooextracool]

The idea of Morne Morkel being one of the best bowlers around when he hasnt had a series averaging less than 30 fills me with dread tbh. He has potential yes,but when that potential involves spraying it around the place the standard of bowling must really be low to be able to accomodate him at the very top.

 

[Uppercut]

The idea of Morne Morkel being one of the best bowlers around when he hasnt had a series averaging less than 30 fills me with dread tbh. He has potential yes,but when that potential involves spraying it around the place the standard of bowling must really be low to be able to accomodate him at the very top.

Has a better average than Ishant Sharma, and he's been mentioned. Morkel's massively awkward to play even when wayward, so tends to pick up wickets when bowling badly. The opposite of Flintoff, you might say.

Certainly wouldn't put him in the top bracket though, not for a second.

 

[andruid]

One of my major criticisms of Flintoff throughout his career is his inability to bowl on the stumps. There really is no point in having a tailender playing and missing, you have to bowl on the stumps so that if they miss (and they will miss sooner rather than later) they will be out.
Ntini is possibly also the same, however, in his case it might not make much of a difference to his overall record for IMO he is a rather ordinary bowler anyways. With Flintoff it is frustrating for he could be a far better bowler by bowling at the stumps more often.

Since when has Ntini been a "ordinary" bowler? Non-flashy maybe but not ordinary.

 

[analyst]

The question was 'Who do you think the best bowlers are at present' An inference as to who will play if selected tommorow, I chose accordingly, I don't believe some players are at the peak of their abilities. I am not a fan of Johnson, otherwise he deserves a place too.

 

[tooextracool]

Has a better average than Ishant Sharma, and he's been mentioned. Morkel's massively awkward to play even when wayward, so tends to pick up wickets when bowling badly. The opposite of Flintoff, you might say.

IMO Morkel is Harmison mark II. Hes yet to have a decent test series, his figures in England flatter him hugely and thats despite the fact that he averaged 30. I think while his height and pace can be awkward for batsman and do give him an edge, I cannot see how someone with his current accuracy and bowling action will have long term success. Maybe that might change, but at the moment hes not very good.

As far as Ishant is concerned, hes had some very good series of late and his most recent performance was spectacular when you consider that his more respected and highly rated comrades and opponents in Lee, Clark and Zaheer were continuously inferior in the series. He might not be the best fast bowler around, but hes definetly bowling as well as almost everyone at the moment.

 

[tooextracool]

Since when has Ntini been a "ordinary" bowler? Non-flashy maybe but not ordinary.

Ntini's home and away record speak volumes of his one-dimensioness. Perhaps I was being a bit over-critical of him when I called him ordinary but I dont think he is very good. Its hard to rate a bowler who bowls exactly the same ball time and time again, without even bowling that ball on the stumps. He doesnt swing it, doesnt bowl cutters and doesnt have a very good slower ball. Hes always been a hit-the-deck seam bowler who ran in hard every ball and tried his hardest without the ability or the variety to do much else

 

[Richard]

Since when has Ntini been a "ordinary" bowler? Non-flashy maybe but not ordinary.

Ntini is neither outstanding nor poor. Pretty ordinary, in fact.