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***Rugby League World Cup 2008 Thread***

chaminda_00

chaminda_00

Hall of Fame Member
Burgey said:
Tharmi'll hate this but simply, too many Manly players in the Aussie side. When there were less Manly players we beat NZ easily, and don't forget when we did they had Matai, also a Manly player.

They lose Mattai, so one less Manly toss pot. We gain Watmyth - one extra Manly toss pot.

It upset the natural order of things, costing us a win.

Kite - did ok for a non-rep prop.
Watmyth - not a rep player
G Stewart - good club player, that's it.
Williams - meh, a fast winger - they're a dime a dozen.

On a serious note, wtf was Stuart doing replacing a 125 metre per game prop in Steve Price with a wide-running back rower in Watmyth? That's a disaster waiting to happen. Petro and Kite go off the ground, and we're light on for size. Played right into NZ's hands.

They were superb actually. Deserved to win. Happy for Cayless after so much big game nothingness for him in the past.

And whoever chose Lockyer as MOTM obviously hit their head when they fell out of the ute with Changa before the game, in yet another example of Rugby League pre-game entertainment going so very, very well.
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TBH I agree with the Manly thing to an extent.

Matai a good player but gives away too many penalties and has a habit of missing the odd tackle due to his technique/over aggression. The balance of the Kiwis side was better with Mannering in the centres, he not a backrower.

Kite useless at rep level, when he isn't hiding behing Price and Civ. If he Australia next best front rower after those two, it going to be a long couple years. Will never have the x-factor to make it as a starting rep front rower. Decent off the bench however.

Watmough and the other backrowers were on a hiding to nothing trying to rotate around the front row. Especially with the sameness of the backrow. Same applies to Stewart.

It was mentioned a bit before, that having variety in backrow was going to hurt us. That was there for anyone to see yesterday. Don't think you can right them off as rep players yet, especially Stewart.

But NSW and Australia need to pick different type of backrowers around them to be effective. Maybe someone that makes big metres or bust a tackle, rather then just extra skill and fitness.

Williams yeah he did decent I thought. But was never going to be ready this early in his career. Boyd would have been a better pick for the final.
 
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BoyBrumby

BoyBrumby

Englishman
dontcloseyoureyes said:
IMO they're no better than the side that had Johns/Fittler in the halves and Locky at FB.
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Yeah, quite. Simon was moaning how this was the worst Kangaroo team in yonks before the tournament started.

Simon said:
Cant believe how much I don't care for this tournament right now. I think for me its because it's one of the weakest looking Australian teams I've seen in a long time and we should still probably win it. Also the fact it's now cricket season doesn't help. Couldn't even get myself interested enough to make the 15 minute drive out to Bruce to watch Scotland vs France.
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Johnners

Johnners

Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
Despite the Kiwis winning, actually enjoyed watching the final.

Lol'd hard at Slater, and then Monaghan. Disappointed that none of Inglis, Thurston or Smith really offered anything in attack though, apart from JT's linebreak at the end.
 
Simon

Simon

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dontcloseyoureyes said:
Yeah they're terribly unbalanced. No depth in any positions bar fullback. Those sides of the 80's through until the late 90's had 3 players for every position.
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Thats exactly the problem, it's the depth of talent, in most positions. This IMO is what would have been our strongest team at the start of the year, for arguments sake Im saying everyone is in form, fit and we arent picking token reps from the premiership winning side.

1 Billy Slater
2 Israel Folau - At rep level is a better winger than centre. Particuarly with the boms to the corner
3 Justin Hodges - Would have made a mountain of difference to the team
4 Mark Gasnier - Same with Hodges, 2nd best centre we had
5 Greg Inglis - Apart from origin 2 this year all his good rep games have been on the wing
6 Darren Lockyer
7 Jonathon Thurston
8 Petero Civoniceva
9 Cameron Smith
10 Willie Mason - Would have given us size up front we badly needed
11 Ryan Hoffman - Of all the wide running backrowers we have he's the best imo
12 Anthony Laffranchi
13 Greg Bird - Complete douchebag, but can play a game of footy, we needed a ball player at lock, imo we would have won the world cup if Campese was in this role at least
Reserves
14 Paul Gallen - Good player, not quite a starting 13 for mine
15 Steve Price - Would have been a lot better coming off the bench
16 Sam Thaiday - Versatile can play prop or 2nd row, is one of the hardest running forwards in the game
17 Kurt Gidley

I'm not making excuses as NZ had injuries too with Asotasi out, SBW same as Gasnier etc... Just highlighting that the players that did come in were either playing in the wrong position at this level and that they werent in the same league as the incumbents.
 
Simon

Simon

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Agree with Stuart to an extent, an NZ win suited organisers etc... but we were our own worst enemy in that final, we should have been good enough to overcome any bad decisions that went against us.
 
Burgey

Burgey

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Simon said:
Thats exactly the problem, it's the depth of talent, in most positions. This IMO is what would have been our strongest team at the start of the year, for arguments sake Im saying everyone is in form, fit and we arent picking token reps from the premiership winning side.

1 Billy Slater
2 Israel Folau - At rep level is a better winger than centre. Particuarly with the boms to the corner
3 Justin Hodges - Would have made a mountain of difference to the team
4 Mark Gasnier - Same with Hodges, 2nd best centre we had
5 Greg Inglis - Apart from origin 2 this year all his good rep games have been on the wing
6 Darren Lockyer
7 Jonathon Thurston
8 Petero Civoniceva
9 Cameron Smith
10 Willie Mason - Would have given us size up front we badly needed
11 Ryan Hoffman - Of all the wide running backrowers we have he's the best imo
12 Anthony Laffranchi
13 Greg Bird - Complete douchebag, but can play a game of footy, we needed a ball player at lock, imo we would have won the world cup if Campese was in this role at least
Reserves
14 Paul Gallen - Good player, not quite a starting 13 for mine
15 Steve Price - Would have been a lot better coming off the bench
16 Sam Thaiday - Versatile can play prop or 2nd row, is one of the hardest running forwards in the game
17 Kurt Gidley

I'm not making excuses as NZ had injuries too with Asotasi out, SBW same as Gasnier etc... Just highlighting that the players that did come in were either playing in the wrong position at this level and that they werent in the same league as the incumbents.
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AWTA. All this crap about being the best Australian side ever.

What about the 86 Kangaroos?
Player Club
Greg Alexander Penrith
Gary Belcher Canberra
Martin Bella North Sydney
Noel Cleal Manly-Warringah
Phil Daley Manly-Warringah
Les Davidson South Sydney
Greg Dowling Wynnum-Manly (Qld)
Paul Dunn Canterbury-Bankstown
Ben Elias Balmain
Steve Folkes Canterbury-Bankstown
Des Hasler Manly-Warringah
Garry Jack Balmain
Brett Kenny Parramatta
Les Kiss North Sydney
Terry Lamb Canterbury-Bankstown
Paul Langmack Canterbury-Bankstown
Wally Lewis (c) Wynnum-Manly (Qld)
Bob Lindner Wynnum-Manly (Qld)
Mal Meninga Canberra
Gene Miles Wynnum-Manly (Qld)
Chris Mortimer Canterbury-Bankstown
Bryan Niebling Redcliffe (Qld)
Michael O'Connor St George
Steve Roach Balmain
Dale Shearer Manly-Warringah
Royce Simmons Penrith
Paul Sironen Balmain
Peter Sterling Parramatta


I defy any Australian side before or since that tour to get on the same park as that squad. FTR Meninga couldn't get a game except off the bench as a replacement forward. Neither could Belcher.

I think the 1st test side was:
Jack
Shearer
Kenny
Miles
O'Connor
Lewis
Sterling
Lindner
Cleal
Neibling/ Folkes/ Davidson
Roach
Simmons
Dowling

Reserves: Who cares? They'd lap the Heaven RL team. Though Lamb was there, as he played every game on tour.
 
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Simon

Simon

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94 Kangaroo tour team was the one for me. Mullins, Meninga, Langer, Stuart, Daley, Fittler, Wishart, Lazarus, Pay, Menzies, Walters brothers, ET, Sailor, Harragon, Clyde, Furner etc... Was awesome. Definitely the equal of the 86 squad that was unbeaten.
 
Johnners

Johnners

Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
Yeah, pretty sure you meant the '86 team Burgey :P

Also agree with Smith that the team with a 1,6,7 of Lockyer, Fittler & Johns was as good, if not better than the current one.
 
Simon

Simon

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Clapo said:
Yeah, pretty sure you meant the '86 team Burgey :P

Also agree with Smith that the team with a 1,6,7 of Lockyer, Fittler & Johns was as good, if not better than the current one.
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Easily.

As a fullback Lockyer>Slater
As a 5/8 Fittler>Lockyer
halfback Johns>Thurston
 
howardj

howardj

International Coach
You always sound like a fruit cake and a sore loser when you allege what Stuart did the other night. But, to my mind, there's no doubt the Refs gave the NZ team a leg up the other night and tried to make it a contest. As it turned out, the Refs didn't need to, as NZ were competitive enough. Anyway, as I said at the start of the tournament, by picking guys like Wolfman and Fitzgibbon, we were really asking for trouble. With Williams, but for the beard and the cult figure status, would he be anywhere near the Australian team?
 
Craig

Craig

World Traveller
howardj said:
You always sound like a fruit cake and a sore loser when you allege what Stuart did the other night. But, to my mind, there's no doubt the Refs gave the NZ team a leg up the other night and tried to make it a contest. As it turned out, the Refs didn't need to, as NZ were competitive enough. Anyway, as I said at the start of the tournament, by picking guys like Wolfman and Fitzgibbon, we were really asking for trouble. With Williams, but for the beard and the cult figure status, would he be anywhere near the Australian team?
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If Billy Slater wasn't a mong would NZ have scored anyway? This is why I hate Ricky Stuart as a coach. He should HTFU and move on. Australia still should have won.
 
chaminda_00

chaminda_00

Hall of Fame Member
howardj said:
With Williams, but for the beard and the cult figure status, would he be anywhere near the Australian team?
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There are plenty of wingers that are probably better. But there not too many that are clearly better. Though with the depth we have at fullback Hunt should have played on the wing. The whole picking specialist is a joke and the only place you have to pick a specialist is in the front row. Backrowers playing front row never works and that where they selected extra non specialist

If you got no winger of rep quality then pick some more centres or fullbacks. One the few positions that you can get away with have a non specialist. End of the day that what happens when you pick the best players for each position not the best players.
 
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