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***Official*** English Domestic Season 2008

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Richard

Richard

Cricket Web Staff Member
Chubb said:
Problem is they act like they have a superb side and some people fall into the trap of believing all their bombast and self-promotion.
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Well... from time to time they have been a faaaaaaaairly decent side y'know.

Not so long ago their squad boasted 21 players who could be described as good to excellent county players: Mark Butcher, Darren Bicknell, Ian Ward, Newman, Carberry, Shahid, Stewart, Thorpe, Ramprakash, Alistair Brown, Adam Hollioake, Clarke, Jonathan Batty, Radcliffe, Ben Hollioake, Gary Butcher, Tudor, Gareth Batty, Salisbury, Martin Bicknell, Saqlain Mushtaq. This lot didn't quite all overlap but I think most played within a year at best of one-another. And almost all were home-grown, coming through the Surrey schools\academy system. To go from such riches to the current rags (as I detailed earlier there are few good players and even fewer home-grown ones at the club at the moment) is pretty remarkable.
 
Chubb

Chubb

International Regular
Richard said:
Well... from time to time they have been a faaaaaaaairly decent side y'know.

Not so long ago their squad boasted 21 players who could be described as good to excellent county players: Mark Butcher, Darren Bicknell, Ian Ward, Newman, Carberry, Shahid, Stewart, Thorpe, Ramprakash, Alistair Brown, Adam Hollioake, Clarke, Jonathan Batty, Radcliffe, Ben Hollioake, Gary Butcher, Tudor, Gareth Batty, Salisbury, Martin Bicknell, Saqlain Mushtaq. This lot didn't quite all overlap but I think most played within a year at best of one-another. And almost all were home-grown, coming through the Surrey schools\academy system. To go from such riches to the current rags (as I detailed earlier there are few good players and even fewer home-grown ones at the club at the moment) is pretty remarkable.
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I know they used to be a top side, but to continue acting the way they do in the media when the team is so poor is delusional.
 
stumpski

stumpski

International Captain
The batting hasn't been too bad, six batsmen are averaging over 30 I think and Brown, who's just been released, averaged 36 from his six games which isn't too shabby - the problem has been bowling sides out twice. Collins, Ormond, Jordan and Nicholson have all been paying far too much for their wickets - almost makes me want to see the return of Mohammad Akram (no, I wouldn't go quite that far) and team selection has been all over the place. Not helped by yet more injuries for Butcher.WRT Dernbach the jury's still out I think, it's easy to forget how young he still is (early 20s I think). I would give him two more seasons and if he doesn't make significant progress it'll be time to find another county.

Good to see Glamorgan's home game going ahead today btw - after all the weather they've had I wondered if the ground might be under water.
 
Richard

Richard

Cricket Web Staff Member
stumpski said:
The batting hasn't been too bad, six batsmen are averaging over 30 I think and Brown, who's just been released, averaged 36 from his six games which isn't too shabby - the problem has been bowling sides out twice. Collins, Ormond, Jordan and Nicholson have all been paying far too much for their wickets - almost makes me want to see the return of Mohammad Akram (no, I wouldn't go quite that far) and team selection has been all over the place. Not helped by yet more injuries for Butcher.
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Yeah I mean had they been able to field Butcher, Newman, Ramprakash, Afzaal, Brown, Batty all season that'd have been a strong top-six. Sadly injuries and inexplicable exclusions (ie, Brown) have disrupted.

Regarding the bowling, I struggle to see the reasons for Salisbury's release, if he wasn't going to retire - and he's bowled better than pretty much anyone bar Woakes at Warwicks this season so you'd have to think Surrey'd have done best to keep him, and as I say I never fathomed why they signed Schofield ITFP. With him in the side Saqlain might have been a bit more effective, and likewise in reverse - they always fed well off one-another. Martin Bicknell obviously couldn't go on forever and finding seamers of his class isn't going to happen every generation, but it now looks extremely unwise to have let Tim Murtagh go. He was never going to be a Bicknell but he was always obviously better than the Dernbachs and Sakers. Ormond (and when he was around Giddins) were never going to be as effective as they were at their previous counties and so it's proved - Ormond's gone steadily downhill in his Surrey career and would've been far best served to have stayed at Leics. And class though Tudor has always possessed, I'm beginning to think it's probably in his best interests to move on from the game after this year too. If he was going to carve himself a niche at any county he'd surely have done it by now.

Collins and Jordan must be wondering if life wouldn't be better in the Caribbean too - I certainly hope they are, as that's IMO where they belong.

Also I have to presume Jewell and Meaker have been injured most of this season else they might as well have been tried more having been tried once.
WRT Dernbach the jury's still out I think, it's easy to forget how young he still is (early 20s I think). I would give him two more seasons and if he doesn't make significant progress it'll be time to find another county.
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Or, hopefully, another job. Nothing worse than seeing someone be utterly woeful at one county and somehow get a contract with another.

And that's the only outcome I see as terribly likely. Dernbach's accuracy is simply woeful. However young you are, rarely does one that bad get better enough to become county-standard.
 
Woodster

Woodster

International Captain
Richard said:
Or, hopefully, another job. Nothing worse than seeing someone be utterly woeful at one county and somehow get a contract with another.

And that's the only outcome I see as terribly likely. Dernbach's accuracy is simply woeful. However young you are, rarely does one that bad get better enough to become county-standard.
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I am not about to strongly disagree with your comments, only offer what I have seen of him this season. Firstly, you talk of his age, and he is young at 22 with plenty of room to improve and plenty to learn. I think he is a much improved bowler this season, this is judging by his limited overs performances I have seen on TV. While he is not currently the most accurate, he has varied his pace, used an excellent slower ball, and generally bowled at a lively speed. Of course it is nothing without accuracy, and this must be improved upon, but I don't believe he is the waste of a place you are portraying him as.
 
bryce

bryce

International Regular
Richard said:
And that's the only outcome I see as terribly likely. Dernbach's accuracy is simply woeful. However young you are, rarely does one that bad get better enough to become county-standard.
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I haven't seen him bowl, but just saw his economy rates and **** me! I used to get pissed off supporting my home domestic team ND because a bloke called yovich used to spray it everywhere, it's so hard when it's your home team and you just feel like tearing your hair out watching them bowl...
 
TT Boy

TT Boy

Hall of Fame Member
Woodster said:
I am not about to strongly disagree with your comments, only offer what I have seen of him this season. Firstly, you talk of his age, and he is young at 22 with plenty of room to improve and plenty to learn. I think he is a much improved bowler this season, this is judging by his limited overs performances I have seen on TV.
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Didn't Jade go for over 100 runs this season in a one day game?
 
Woodster

Woodster

International Captain
TT Boy said:
Didn't Jade go for over 100 runs this season in a one day game?
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Yes, but surely that one game does not mean he has not improved this season ? I believe every cricketer is entitled to a particularly bad day at the office. I tend to look at his performances on the whole, again judging from what I have seen of him, and I believe there has been an improvement.

He has also taken 20 wickets @ 14.30 in the Pro40 competition, and his County Championship return of 21 wickets @ 32.80 is not too shabby wither considering Surrey are struggling as much as they are. However, best to overlook these stats while making a case against him eh?
 
Richard

Richard

Cricket Web Staff Member
Haha, had forgotten that TBH.

Still seems a bit rich to say that's the reason they went down. There are many games in a season, you can always overcome such a small point deduction if you're good enough.

BTW, it's amazing, but there's actually been a good amount of play today, for the first time in about 2 weeks. :-O
 
stumpski

stumpski

International Captain
Hampshire 471-8 at the Oval - hard to say the introduction of Shoaib has been a rip-roaring success. :dry: He hasn't added to the wicket he took yesterday. And Surrey missed out on a third bowling point.

Lancashire in trouble on Sky, have plenty of work to do to make this a game worth watching later. Ealham, now the oldest player on the circuit, looks as if he could go on for a few years yet.
 
stumpski

stumpski

International Captain
So long as it's a better game than the one between Glamorgan and Derbyshire on Monday night ... Derbyshire just pottered along at three an over as if unaware they had to score at over five - ended up needing 70 off the last three.
 
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