***Official*** South Africa in England

[Richard]

Ditto. I'm bed-bound due to my rogue tonsils and now i have nothing to watch all evening

You've explained it before I'm sure but why are you wearing the same Flintoff picture Martyn currently is? Who gave you it?

 

[Richard]

Very weird game. Broad finally showing the potential that i was sure he had.

I don't think he's showing anything today he hasn't shown before - he's bowled like this with a white ball in coloured clothing in one-day cricket before. It's been clear for a while now that he can do that. But he can't still bowl well in Tests with a red ball and white clothing.

You have to ask why he tends to bowl differently in Tests though. It cant just be a stamina thing, he visibly bowls shorter in Tests and tries to be a sterotypical 'fast' bowler, where in ODI's he seems content to just put the ball on a good line/lenght and is much more effective.

I don't think he does bowl terribly differently TBH - it's just bowling in good areas - which he doesn't ALWAYS do - isn't enough in Tests. I'm not sure whether he bowls significantly shorter in Tests, and you'd not be able to find-out for sure without detailed pitchmaps.

 

[zaremba]

Stuck at work today but I have enjoyed the cricinfo coverage. In particular, this:

Nel to Prior, FOUR, spanked. Utterly spanked off the back foot with disdain and he holds the pose

 

[wpdavid]

At the risk of putting the mockers on B & P, how many ODI's have England won by 10 wickets? And how many have SA lost by that margin?

 

[SpaceMonkey]

Ditto. I'm bed-bound due to my rogue tonsils and now i have nothing to watch all evening

Better than us losing at 10pm tonight though!

 

[Richard]

Kinda ridiculous that SA have lost more games than NZ did.

Obviously England are a worse side than either.

 

[Neil Pickup]

At the risk of putting the mockers on B & P, how many ODI's have England won by 10 wickets? And how many have SA lost by that margin?

Now that you're the one who has said that, I can go look at Cricinfo without the inevitable guilt trip.

 

[stumpski]

Can remember England doing it around 2000 (I think Stewart was one of the batsmen). Dunno about S Africa.

 

[SpaceMonkey]

I don't think he's showing anything today he hasn't shown before - he's bowled like this with a white ball in coloured clothing in one-day cricket before. It's been clear for a while now that he can do that. But he can't still bowl well in Tests with a red ball and white clothing.

I don't think he does bowl terribly differently TBH - it's just bowling in good areas - which he doesn't ALWAYS do - isn't enough in Tests. I'm not sure whether he bowls significantly shorter in Tests, and you'd not be able to find-out for sure without detailed pitchmaps.

Well i can only go by my memory which i have to admit is poor But i'm sure he pitches it up much more in ODIs than he does in Tests. What i've liked today is not just that he's up'd his pace but he's done so while keeping his accuracy (or even being more accurate!). If he bowls like this he'll always take wickets. BIG IF

 

[Richard]

Can remember England doing it around 2000 (I think Stewart was one of the batsmen). Dunno about S Africa.

Trescothick and Stewart chased down West Indies off their own bats in the NW Series 2000. Hussain and Knight should have done against South Africa the previous winter too, but Hussain gave away his wicket.

Kinda annoying that Prior didn't even get out in this run-chase. Never mind, another day is another day.

 

[wpdavid]

Can remember England doing it around 2000 (I think Stewart was one of the batsmen). Dunno about S Africa.

Ah yes - Stewart & Tres vs WI. And chasing rather more than 84 iirc.

 

[SpaceMonkey]

Its the first time England have won any ODI by 10 wickets i believe. Not sure if SA have lost by 10 or not in the past though.

 

[Richard]

Well i can only go by my memory which i have to admit is poor But i'm sure he pitches it up much more in ODIs than he does in Tests.

No memory, however good, can possibly hope to certify such a thing. It's impossible to catalogue things like where a bowler has consistently pitched. Only a pitchmap can reveal that.

What i've liked today is not just that he's up'd his pace but he's done so while keeping his accuracy (or even being more accurate!). If he bowls like this he'll always take wickets. BIG IF

But he won't - he took his wickets today because in ODIs batsmen have to play at wide balls. In Tests they can just leave them, and it's highly unlikely the likes of Kallis would often have done anything but to his one.

 

[Neil Pickup]

At the risk of putting the mockers on B & P, how many ODI's have England won by 10 wickets? And how many have SA lost by that margin?

England have done so twice - chasing 170 at Durham against the West Indies in 2000 (Trescothick 87, Stewart 74), and chasing 191 at The Oval against Bangladesh in 2005 (Trescothick 100, Strauss 82).

It's only the second time that South Africa have been, to steal the rugby term, "nilled" - you have to go back to April 1992 in Trinidad (Haynes 59, Lara 86) to find the prior (see what I did there?) instance.

 

[stumpski]

Great news for England, it means South Africa can only win the series 3-2.

And they will come back, hard.

 

[Uppercut]

You've explained it before I'm sure but why are you wearing the same Flintoff picture Martyn currently is? Who gave you it?

Avatar challenge. South Africa lost the first ODI and as a result he got to choose what it changed to, and picked this in order to confuse himself.

 

[Richard]

Great news for England, it means South Africa can only win the series 3-2.

And they will come back, hard.

South Africa since the end of WC99 have had a propensity to perform exceptionally poorly in ODIs in England.

 

[SpaceMonkey]

But he won't - he took his wickets today because in ODIs batsmen have to play at wide balls. In Tests they can just leave them, and it's highly unlikely the likes of Kallis would often have done anything but to his one.

Given the form Kallis has shown with the bat this summer i wouldnt be so sure about that

5th Best ODI bowling figures by an Englishmen by the way. So credit where its due methinks!

 

[Uppercut]

No memory, however good, can possibly hope to certify such a thing. It's impossible to catalogue things like where a bowler has consistently pitched. Only a pitchmap can reveal that.

But he won't - he took his wickets today because in ODIs batsmen have to play at wide balls. In Tests they can just leave them, and it's highly unlikely the likes of Kallis would often have done anything but to his one.

The shocking thing, which i also noticed against New Zealand this summer, is the speed gun when Broad bowls in ODIs. In the tests he was often struggling to even get above 80mph, but with the white ball he broke 90 several times.

 

[Uppercut]

Better than us losing at 10pm tonight though!

Haha, I don't care who wins though. In the tests I had a hefty bet on SA for the series so was supporting them. Right now I just wanted something to do