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If Bradman played in today's era?

How would Sir Donald Bradman go in today's era of cricket?


  • Total voters
    87

vic_orthdox

Global Moderator
As I've brought up a couple of times, its his mental skills that must've been so far ahead of anyone else. I could play against U/16s for the rest of my cricketing career, and I wouldn't average 100, and consistently make those scores, because I'd allow myself to get overconfident, or make a stupid mistake. Bradman didn't let himself do that against the best players in the world at that time. Hence he made such enormous scores.
 

Ikki

Hall of Fame Member
As I've brought up a couple of times, its his mental skills that must've been so far ahead of anyone else. I could play against U/16s for the rest of my cricketing career, and I wouldn't average 100, and consistently make those scores, because I'd allow myself to get overconfident, or make a stupid mistake. Bradman didn't let himself do that against the best players in the world at that time. Hence he made such enormous scores.
Yeah, great post.
 

weldone

Hall of Fame Member
As I've brought up a couple of times, its his mental skills that must've been so far ahead of anyone else. I could play against U/16s for the rest of my cricketing career, and I wouldn't average 100, and consistently make those scores, because I'd allow myself to get overconfident, or make a stupid mistake. Bradman didn't let himself do that against the best players in the world at that time. Hence he made such enormous scores.
Have to agree...That was probably his biggest strength...As once he commented that he has seen many awesome batsmen in his lifetime throwing away their wickets in such a manner which he never would've done...
 

andruid

Cricketer Of The Year
Bradman was supposedly weakest in 2 areas. a) Intimidating bowling and b) Playing on bad wickets and stickys

Now with modern protective equipment and covered wickets his 2 main areas for criticisms no longer exist and are now irrelevant.

Add in new bat technology and his style of playing most balls and he would be near unstopable.

However given his legendary preference for scoring majority of his runs of ground strokes and the subsequent gulf in the quality in ground fielding between then and now I suspect his scoring rate would drop significantly
 

silentstriker

The Wheel is Forever
However given his legendary preference for scoring majority of his runs of ground strokes and the subsequent gulf in the quality in ground fielding between then and now I suspect his scoring rate would drop significantly
But with better bats and other equipment, the effect of improved ground fielding is neutralized, and in fact, gone a lot the other way considering the averages these days.
 

Goughy

Hall of Fame Member
However given his legendary preference for scoring majority of his runs of ground strokes and the subsequent gulf in the quality in ground fielding between then and now I suspect his scoring rate would drop significantly
Ground fielding makes no difference when finding the gaps. A few runs come from misfields etc but its only a tiny proportion
 

Richard

Cricket Web Staff Member
As I've brought up a couple of times, its his mental skills that must've been so far ahead of anyone else. I could play against U/16s for the rest of my cricketing career, and I wouldn't average 100, and consistently make those scores, because I'd allow myself to get overconfident, or make a stupid mistake. Bradman didn't let himself do that against the best players in the world at that time. Hence he made such enormous scores.
Basically, exactly as I said...
What made Bradman special was not an "attitude ahead of his time" as some seem to think, but a skill that no batsman - with the possible exception of WG Grace, but IMO we can't totally compare those two - has ever possessed before or since. David Boon once said (probably not an exact estimate, but you get the drift) that he reckoned bowlers got him out 1 out of 10 dismissals, and himself the other 9. Now of course, there are times when both come into play simualtaneously (ie: getting yourself out would be hitting a nothing ball to mid-wicket; the bowler and yourself getting you out would be chasing a full away-swinger outside off and edging to slip; and the bowler getting you out would be a straight ball which had to be played, was attempted to be defended, that swung away onto the edge and was taken by the wicketkeeper). But what made Bradman special was that this happened with an enormously lesser ratio than anyone else. Where most batsmen played a bad shot, say, every 30 balls on average, Bradman played one maybe every 130. But a realistically unplayable legcutter to him was no different to one to any other batsman.
 

DaRick

State Vice-Captain
It is, as has been pointed out, ridiculous to assess a player whose career ended nearly 60 years ago. There are a whole lot of variables within the game of cricket which have been altered since those seemingly idyllic, almost romantic days. If Donald Bradman played today, this is what I think will be in his favour:

- No sticky wickets
- Flatter pitches
- Better bats
- Smaller boundaries
- Better protective gear (and no Bodyline, to boot)

...plus the fact that he was still dominating net bowlers as a 68-year old.

This is what I think will go against him:

- Timeless Tests (I'm almost certain that they featured in his era; I'm not sure whether he ever had the opportunity to play one)
- Better ground fielding
- Greater professionalism of bowlers (leading to a greater amount of desperation, as a lucrative career is on the line)
- More media pressure (I don't know how he'd react if the media - and by extension, people who read various media - wrote him off after a few relative failures because of his exceedingly high standards)
- More substantial video analysis (allows bowlers to probe for technical flaws, although his supreme discipline would reduce the effect of this - see Justin Langer)

He would probably cope just as well as he did back in the 1930's, but it is impossible to say for sure, so I'm wimping out on this one. :p
 

Richard

Cricket Web Staff Member
Exactly half of Bradman's 52 Tests were timeless games, apparently. UIMM, all pre-WWII international games in Australia were timeless (Sean to confirm). However, by the sounds of things, his scoring-rates tended to be sufficiently quick that time limits would not be an impediment.

As regards video-evidence - this can help batsmen as much as bowlers. Sachin Tendulkar, for example, has always found ways to spot weaknesses in his own game, usually before anyone else has. I'm more than confident Bradman could use video-evidence to his advantage, if anyone were to be able to use it to theirs against him.
 

DaRick

State Vice-Captain
Exactly half of Bradman's 52 Tests were timeless games, apparently. UIMM, all pre-WWII international games in Australia were timeless (Sean to confirm). However, by the sounds of things, his scoring-rates tended to be sufficiently quick that time limits would not be an impediment.

As regards video-evidence - this can help batsmen as much as bowlers. Sachin Tendulkar, for example, has always found ways to spot weaknesses in his own game, usually before anyone else has. I'm more than confident Bradman could use video-evidence to his advantage, if anyone were to be able to use it to theirs against him.
Fair points. However, Timeless Tests would also wear bowlers and fielders down (more psychologically than anything else), which would probably make Bradman's task of scoring runs a touch easier, for mine.
 

silentstriker

The Wheel is Forever
Fair points. However, Timeless Tests would also wear bowlers and fielders down (more psychologically than anything else), which would probably make Bradman's task of scoring runs a touch easier, for mine.
But I dont think his average is any lower in non-timeless Tests. Plus, his scoring rate has been estimated at around 60, which is right up there with Ponting.
 

SJS

Hall of Fame Member
His batting average as well as strike rate would be higher than it was.

He would have scored more runs, more centuries and higher scores in an innings than anyone would ever get close to :)
 

Burgey

Request Your Custom Title Now!
AWTA.

If you want to lower Bradman's average, then you need to lower, by the same proportion, the averages of other greats from that time - Hobbs, Hammond, Sutcliffe, Ponsford, Headley - all of them.
 

weldone

Hall of Fame Member
AWTA.

If you want to lower Bradman's average, then you need to lower, by the same proportion, the averages of other greats from that time - Hobbs, Hammond, Sutcliffe, Ponsford, Headley - all of them.
Hobbs was not of Bradman's time though....yeah others were....
 

Burgey

Request Your Custom Title Now!
Well, they crossed paths in 1928-29 and in 1930, but certainly for the most part they weren't :)
 

weldone

Hall of Fame Member
A bit like Viv Richards and Sachin I would say :)

Edit: This is in reply to the post above :)
 
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Burgey

Request Your Custom Title Now!
Yep. Fascinating to see the juxtaposition of Hobbs and Bradman in some photos from the 1930 tour - with Hobbs clapping as Bradman raises his bat. I wonder what Jack was thinking?
 

SJS

Hall of Fame Member
It is amazing how much we would like to run down those whom we have not seen.

I have heard so many arguments to try and assert why the players of the past were not good enough. For batsmen it is mostly easier to do with sheer statistics (mainly batting average) since these have generally got better after the relatively modest ones of the earlier years. For bowlers, people use the same lower batting averages to prove that wickets were easy to get. Where both dont work we resort to quality of wickets (good if we are trying to run down batsmen and bad if we are tying put down the bowlers), poor batting or bowling depending upon what we are trying to prove, quality of opposition and so on.

Unfortunately, for these people most of these 'attempts at punditry' fail when you come to the one and only , Don Bradman. So dtaggering are his accomplishments with the bat and so mind boggling the stats (the sole criteria by which the average fan is capable of assessing "greatness" and "relative greatness" that we are neatly divide into two groups those (the majority) who think Bradman was the God of batting and there will, probably, never be another like him or those who try even harder to show that he was just lucky to be born at a time when someone of his caliber was more than abundantly rewarded for his great but 'not-that-great' skills.

Bradman is a phenomenon that cricket buffs are alternatively, fascinated and intimidated by but a large number are very reluctant to put him so much above their own more recent heroes. This was the case even when he was playing. To start with those in England refused to accept what they were told by the English tourists of 1928-29 when they came back with tales of this 'boy-wonder'. He will know what batting is all about on our English wickets was the cry.

Bradman came to England and in 3 of the 7 inings that he played in the five tests he scored a total of 23 runs (8, 1 and 14) but around these three innings he played another four in which he scored 131, 254, 334 and 232. Every record that could possibly be broken in a single series was broken by this 22 year old including the world's highest innings score and a still standing 974 runs in the series.

More was to come.

Jardine realised (even if we dont) after just that one series (even if we dont after 75 years) that this man was extraordinary and nothing short of spectacularly extraordinary tactics would stop this phenomenon and bodyline and Larwood became history and part folklore. Richards is gone and Tendulkar is coming to the end of his long innings and no one has been driven to the desperation that the captains around the world were driven by this man and yet we want to undermine his achievements.

Mostly when I read the stuff written in this regard, I smile and beyond a cryptic remark or two avoid getting into a debate but I think there is a need to soberly and logically put Bradman's achievements in perspective for the younger generation.

I have always maintained that it is futile to compare great sportsmen, more so when their is much time separating the two. Its pointless this argument of Warne versus Grimmett or O'rielly or Lilley versus Lindwall. These are great players who would have been great in any era. Of course, we can take delight in chosing our heroes and getting into a debate over a pint of beer over it but we muxt, in our hearts realise that it is a futile excercise and to take it with th seriousness that some people do here is simply not worth it.

Bradman is the exception.

Why?

While you cant compare two greats of different eras, we can and do talk of the greats of an era. Thus most people agree that Lara and Tendulkar are the two premier batsmen of the modern era. That McGrath is the greatest exponent of the new ball in the modern times. We are able to do that, not just because we have seen everyone but because the achievements of thse greats are so overwhelmingly above those of their contemporaries. This is the only, if any, criteria by which a sportsman has to be judged - in comparison to his contemporaries.

This, in the case of Bradman, gives us a tool to measure Bradman against other great batsmen over different eras.

Here is how.

I have taken for this , besides Bradman, Hammond (from more or less his own times), Gavaskar and Richards from the seventies and eighties and Lara from the modern times. I have taken only players whose careers have ended hence Tendulkar is not chosen. If someone insists, I can do that but the results wont disprove what I am about to show.

I have taken the career stats of each of these players and compared it to the rest of the batsmen - in the world - during the exact duration of his career. Thus the batting averages of all the batsmen in the world (put together) during Gavaskar's test career are compared to his. Of course, since Gavaskar is a specialist batsman (and a great one at that) his average will be much higher than the rest of the world average. But this difference (in percentage) by which Gavaskar's average is superior to his contemporaries gives us a factor which can be figured out for each of these great batsmen.
So, if Gavaskar averaged 51.12 in test matches and the rest of the world averaged 30.08 during the same period, Gavaskar's average is 1.70 times or 70% higher than the rest.

Here are the figures for thse great batsmen. I have also included how much they are superior to their own countrymen because that maybe of interest to some.

Code:
[B]Player	% over the world[/B]
Richards	68
Gavaskar	70
Brian Lara	76
Wally Hammond	94
[B][COLOR="DarkRed"]Don Bradman	227[/COLOR][/B]
Code:
[B]Player	% ove countrymen[/B]
Richards	64
Gavaskar	75
Brian Lara	109
Wally Hammond	77
[B][COLOR="DarkRed"]Don Bradman	213[/COLOR][/B]
The difference is staggering. That is why Bradman stands alone atop the tree of great batsmen. Its not because his contemporaries were useless because they included all time greats like Hammond , George Headley , Herb Sutcliffe , Len Hutton , Denis Compton , Bruce Mitchell , McCabe, Hendren , Woodful , Ponsford , Leyland, Bill Edrich, Eddie Paynter, Morris, Brnes, Dempster, Duleepsinhji, Nourse, Jardine, Bill Brown, Hassett. The list is endless and very impressive and yet Bradman averages 3.27 times the world average score per innings ofr the twenty year period.

There is absolutely nothing in cricket that comes even remotely close to the domination exercised by Bradman over his contemporaries over a twenty year period. Thats why EVERY other batsman in the world dwarfs by comparison.

Thats why we can only assume that if we had the great forutne to have had him in our times we would have gone to our graves happily for he would not have missed that three figure mark (for his average) by the nano-whisker that he did in 1948 :)
 
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