Brendon McCullum vs M.S. Dhoni

[Flem274*]

I haven't seen enough of Dhoni really, on recent form I'd choose McCullum but thats a very limited perspective.

McCullum is a talent, not even PEWS, who hates him because he scores fast I imagine, can't dispute that. He burst onto the test scene and looked right at home, averaging in the high thirties which for a keeper of his quality (though his glovework has been poor of late) is very, very handy. Lately he has been in a bit of a slump in tests though now his new method has scored him a couple of fifties, one probably should have been a 100 if he'd had a batting partner. It looks to me as if he's not quite sure how to go about tests as his ODI tactics are not the best option in tests. If he was elevated to number three, which is the rumour, it would be a good learning experience for him.

In ODIs he's batted most of his career at seven, and been quite inconsistent. I was worried about the latest opening stint because the previous stints were rubbish. He's been surprisingly good at opening this season, and in between his big scores he's had quite a few 30s and 40s with a couple of failures which is fine. However much Rich and PEWS talk about his failures he still averages 50 odd, and he's scored against each nation he's played against this summer. He's also played quite smartly and used his brain, which has lacked in other opening stints. The big test though is, will this new method get figured out? The Aussies tried slower balls which worked eventualy in his 96 and quite well in his other innings. The English are firing it down the legside, which IIRC hasn't worked as of yet. I think he'll encounter a few problems as all batsmen do but he's got the ability to get better.

The big test in ODIs starts in the up and coming series, NZ main season is over now so this is the time he'll drop off if its another one season wonder. In tests he's shown he can bat, he just needs to get back to where he was.

 

[Jamee999]

McCullum sucks, you'll never see him making a large innings or changing a match, on a large scale.

 

[GGG]

McCullum better in ODI's of recent, Dhoni at tests and McCullum is a better keeper IMO.

 

[Leslie1]

McCullum sucks, you'll never see him making a large innings or changing a match, on a large scale.

I don't rate McCullum (see prev post) OVER Dhoni, but I've seen him carry an innings ALL by himself and win games. This is all in limited overs formats (see recent IPL) however. His 172 against Auck (Mills and Martin) is one of the best knocks I've seen a wicket keeper play.

I still do not know why he doesn't bat properly in tests lately, going in with one game plan and that is to smash bowlers all over the park not taking into account the game's progress.

Unless he thinks he is Viv Richards.

It's the stupid stance that worries me. That standing out of the crease crap and then walking forward ALA Hayden, so he's in effect 3 metres from his stumps by the time the ball arrives worries every batting side trying to save a test.

He'll get found out by that stance eventually, by having the wicket keeper come up to the wicket and have spinners on. Panesar will own McCullum's wicket in the upcoming test series I'm sure of it.

 

[Craig]

Clearly they do not do brains in his tiny corner of Otago. My jaw dropped in the Hamilton Test when he went in and played a reckless shot of MSP that almost cost New Zealand the match if wasn't for Daniel Vettori late rear guard stand and England shotting themselves in the foot.

 

[Smudge]

Clearly they do not do brains in his tiny corner of Otago.

Dunedin? Not exactly tiny.

 

[_Ed_]

McCullum's been my favourite player for the last 5 years...so I'll go McCullum.

 

[Halfpast_Yellow]

I don't rate McCullum (see prev post) OVER Dhoni, but I've seen him carry an innings ALL by himself and win games. This is all in limited overs formats (see recent IPL) however. His 172 against Auck (Mills and Martin) is one of the best knocks I've seen a wicket keeper play.

I still do not know why he doesn't bat properly in tests lately, going in with one game plan and that is to smash bowlers all over the park not taking into account the game's progress.

Unless he thinks he is Viv Richards.

It's the stupid stance that worries me. That standing out of the crease crap and then walking forward ALA Hayden, so he's in effect 3 metres from his stumps by the time the ball arrives worries every batting side trying to save a test.

He'll get found out by that stance eventually, by having the wicket keeper come up to the wicket and have spinners on. Panesar will own McCullum's wicket in the upcoming test series I'm sure of it.

I believe Jameee999 was being sarcastic after 158*

but who knows...

 

[_Ed_]

I believe Jameee999 was being sarcastic after 158*

but who knows...

You would hope so.

He certainly singlehandedly won that State Shield final.

 

[Days of Grace]

It's the stupid stance that worries me. That standing out of the crease crap and then walking forward ALA Hayden, so he's in effect 3 metres from his stumps by the time the ball arrives worries every batting side trying to save a test.

When was NZ trying to save the test in the last series?? They had so much time on their hands, that a draw was out of the equation in both the 2nd and 3rd tests.

 

[Flem274*]

I don't mind McCullum batting out of his crease-it puts doubt in the mind of the umpire WRT LBWs, its quite a good tactic as IIRC he was quite prone to doing a Taylor and play around his pad. Saying he has no brain is harsh, he's not much in tests but you can't really fault him in ODIs lately. He's in a test form slump atm but he will probably come out of it, spose form is onee of the reasons why its so hard to judge how good a player is until he's retired.

The sideways thing before he goes forward is wierd though.

 

[vastu shastra]

dhoni is better

 

[Flem274*]

dhoni is better

Compelling argument.

Now that I've had a think about it and reflected on what I've seen of both, Dhoni is the better batsman, though he hasn't played as long as McCullum and hasn't had as many ups and downs but I'd back Dhoni to bat better in tests, atm McCullum in ODis off recent form but if thats discounted then Dhoni again.

McCullum is the better wicketkeeper hands down. He's dropped a few lately but generally he's excellent.

 

[Laurrz]

Probably Dhoni id rather in my team

more reliable i feel

though both haven't prospered completely yet

 

[Laurrz]

I don't mind McCullum batting out of his crease-it puts doubt in the mind of the umpire WRT LBWs, its quite a good tactic as IIRC he was quite prone to doing a Taylor and play around his pad. Saying he has no brain is harsh, he's not much in tests but you can't really fault him in ODIs lately. He's in a test form slump atm but he will probably come out of it, spose form is onee of the reasons why its so hard to judge how good a player is until he's retired.

The sideways thing before he goes forward is wierd though.

I hate how he does that tbh, but it is damn effective sometimes..im not sure if that works in test cricket consistently though

 

[chaminda_00]

There is reason why Saha was given the gloves ahead of McCullum in the recent Twenty20 match, cus his keeping isn't that great. He might not drop a lot but either does Dhoni these days. His foot work for a keeper is quite poor, but so is Dhoni. Both aren't great keepers, just better then average.

Batting wise Dhoni is a class above. McCullum has shown recently that he can play match winning innings, but Dhoni has played them more often throughout his career. McCullum still has that reakless aspect to his game, where he throws his innings just when New Zealand need a big partnerships. In the last 18 months I don't think I have ever seen Dhoni throw an innings away, more often then he bats for the team and plays within himself.

McCullum when in form, gets pretty close, but Dhoni is still a better player. Dhoni might not produce another innings in this tournment like McCullum last night. But I back him to be a lot more consistent and contribute to more Chennai wins then McCullum. The same would apply in Internationals as well.

 

[Leslie1]

Batting wise Dhoni is a class above. McCullum has shown recently that he can play match winning innings, but Dhoni has played them more often throughout his career. McCullum still has that reakless aspect to his game, where he throws his innings just when New Zealand need a big partnerships. In the last 18 months I don't think I have ever seen Dhoni throw an innings away, more often then he bats for the team and plays within himself.

McCullum when in form, gets pretty close, but Dhoni is still a better player. Dhoni might not produce another innings in this tournment like McCullum last night. But I back him to be a lot more consistent and contribute to more Chennai wins then McCullum. The same would apply in Internationals as well.

Completely agree and sums up both talents in one go. One's got a better temperament to change his playing style to suit the match situations, the other is just relying purely on his talent. Dhoni when he has the license can easily go out and smash 6s but he held it back to control the innings and make sure his team come out with the best possible contribution from himself. McCullum throws his wicket away.

 

[_Ed_]

Completely agree and sums up both talents in one go. One's got a better temperament to change his playing style to suit the match situations, the other is just relying purely on his talent. Dhoni when he has the license can easily go out and smash 6s but he held it back to control the innings and make sure his team come out with the best possible contribution from himself. McCullum throws his wicket away.

McCullum has played some very mature innings at times though too -
http://content-nz.cricinfo.com/nzvaus/engine/match/251496.html for example. 86* off 91 is an excellent innings in that situation, supporting the guy who was blazing away at the other end.

 

[chaminda_00]

McCullum has played some very mature innings at times though too -
http://content-nz.cricinfo.com/nzvaus/engine/match/251496.html for example. 86* off 91 is an excellent innings in that situation, supporting the guy who was blazing away at the other end.

I wouldn't really call that a great example of mature innings, match winning yes. But he had a licence to go as NZ had nothing to loss, so he just tied off and he came off. A mature innings would be a Test innings to save a draw or something, or massive reguard.

 

[Leslie1]

An interesting question would be,

If the Earth is about to explode and it will require either a McCullum or Dhoni to be picked as a wicket keeper batsman / leader to save Earth, which one would you go with?

McCullum's limited overs' exploits are good lately because of the quality of the bowling opposition (England without Sidebottom isn't much chops). More often than not when he starts the innings off he gifts his wicket to the opposition only to see them spilling a few sitters. The record opening partnership with Jesse Ryder would never have been had England learn how to catch.

Against a better fielding side like South Africa he's a walking duck when it's his turn to bat because he doesn't employ good defense to complement his power hitting. What's baffling is he has all the techniques to play a quarter-like Dravid in terms of defense (and that's all he needs when he can hit it that far), its not like he doesn't have any defensive techniques.

I still shutter when he 'walks' towards a good length ball and the jumps up ALA poor Lara stance to defend that ball. My god, what is that? Footwork is all over the place, and his only saving grace is the ball not deviating from the pitch.