neville cardus
International Debutant
Annoyed at CricketWeb's dearth of historical threads at the moment, I proffer this rather corny one.
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W.G. versus The Don
- Thread starter neville cardus
- Start date
archie mac
International Coach
The Old Man is leading, at least we can say that after three votes
neville cardus
International Debutant
I fear that it won't be that way for long.The Old Man is leading, at least we can say that after three votes
neville cardus
International Debutant
And, indeed, it isn't. All square now.
Lillian Thomson
Hall of Fame Member
There was a Battle of the Legends a few months ago and The Don beat WG in the Final. I wrote at the time that WG stands head and shoulders above everyone else who's ever played the game. As recently as the 1960's - which was long after his death and long after The Don had retired he was still being described as the Father of the Modern Game. It's fair to assume that Bradman was probably the superior batsman but in terms of legacy Grace is beyond comparison.
Richard
Cricket Web Staff Member
It depends, hugely, really. As I've said before, I don't really think one can compare the two as pure batsmen because the game they played was not the same one - cricket in the 1870s and 1930s had things in common, of course, but there was so much that had changed.
In 1870, overarm bowling had only been legalised for 6 years, never mind been commonplace for all that long, and that's only one of the innumerable differences. There was no formally organised County Championship until 1890; there was no real authentic Test-cricket until I think sometime in the 1890s or it may even have been the 1900s (I forget the exact date when England and Australia teams were first chosen by selectors rather than the host club, though I'm sure one or both of the posters so far this thread will know). As for the difference in pitches, well, there was little proper preparation before 1900; by 1930 the proper preparation had been around for years and the wickets had become massively flat pretty well everywhere. That's just a few examples of the differences.
WG Grace is, pretty well beyond doubt for those who know much about the matter, the most influential figure in cricket history. And it's pretty probable that had he played in, say, the 1970s, he'd have been one of the best batsmen around if not maybe even superior to the Greg Chappells and Vivian Richardses. But he didn't. And I think it fruitless to speculate as if he did.
Bradman, of course, was another of the most hugely influential figures, not just in cricket, but in society as a whole, both in Britain and Australia. But his influence on the game probably pales in comparison to The Doc.
As cricketing influence goes, WG Grace. As batsmen, no meaningful comparison can be offered IMO.
In 1870, overarm bowling had only been legalised for 6 years, never mind been commonplace for all that long, and that's only one of the innumerable differences. There was no formally organised County Championship until 1890; there was no real authentic Test-cricket until I think sometime in the 1890s or it may even have been the 1900s (I forget the exact date when England and Australia teams were first chosen by selectors rather than the host club, though I'm sure one or both of the posters so far this thread will know). As for the difference in pitches, well, there was little proper preparation before 1900; by 1930 the proper preparation had been around for years and the wickets had become massively flat pretty well everywhere. That's just a few examples of the differences.
WG Grace is, pretty well beyond doubt for those who know much about the matter, the most influential figure in cricket history. And it's pretty probable that had he played in, say, the 1970s, he'd have been one of the best batsmen around if not maybe even superior to the Greg Chappells and Vivian Richardses. But he didn't. And I think it fruitless to speculate as if he did.
Bradman, of course, was another of the most hugely influential figures, not just in cricket, but in society as a whole, both in Britain and Australia. But his influence on the game probably pales in comparison to The Doc.
As cricketing influence goes, WG Grace. As batsmen, no meaningful comparison can be offered IMO.
Days of Grace
International Captain
And also not that hard to speculate that if W.G. was an Aussie, and the Don an Englishmen, you'd say W.G. was far superior, you biased Aussie git.
Lillian Thomson
Hall of Fame Member
It obviously proved too hard for you as it doesn't mention being the better batsman anywhere.
Richard
Cricket Web Staff Member
Would have to agree with LT... for once.It obviously proved too hard for you as it doesn't mention being the better batsman anywhere.
Goughy
Hall of Fame Member
They are obviously both batsmen, especially when you ignore the 2773 more FC wickets Grace took than Bradman
Athlai
Not Terrible
What about a thread for the legends of the modern era and how they should be remembered many years from now?
Lara should be in there. Reckon the "Did I entertain you?" with his big smile after his final match was a moment I'll always remember.
The legacies players have left or are leaving behind through the eyes of history would be pretty cool IMO as we don't miss them at all until they're gone.
Lara should be in there. Reckon the "Did I entertain you?" with his big smile after his final match was a moment I'll always remember.
The legacies players have left or are leaving behind through the eyes of history would be pretty cool IMO as we don't miss them at all until they're gone.
SJS
Hall of Fame Member
You cant do that Goughy. Thats not fair.They are obviously both batsmen, especially when you ignore the 2773 more FC wickets Grace took than Bradman
Lillian Thomson
Hall of Fame Member
What about a thread for the legends of the modern era and how they should be remembered many years from now?
Lara should be in there. Reckon the "Did I entertain you?" with his big smile after his final match was a moment I'll always remember.
The legacies players have left or are leaving behind through the eyes of history would be pretty cool IMO as we don't miss them at all until they're gone.
It's not quite the same with modern legends because so many hours of footage will still be available for future generations to watch. Part of the joy of the legend of players from the mid-1800's up to the Second World War years is the fact that it's so shrouded in mystery.
neville cardus
International Debutant
Doubtless Bradman was better than Grace (just as Ponting is better than Bradman), but to look at it in such simplistic terms is abominably small-minded. Relativity ... that's the thing, and, relative to his contemporaries and the contemporary game, Grace swabs the floorboards with Sir Donald. Bradman did not revolutionise the game; he merely perfected it. Grace did both.