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***Official*** New Zealand in South Africa

Flem274*

Flem274*

123/5
Somerset said:
Oh I agree, to be honest I believe he has matured of late with his batting and personality especially after Vettori was appointed captain and the retirements of Cairns, Astle and McMillan forced him to step up as a senior member of the team. Quite clearly he is the number one wicket keeper in the country and I can't disagree that he should finish with a great reputation.
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He may feel under pressure for his spot too. Hopkins is already in the side and the likes of Bevan Griggs are scoring prolifically in FC cricket.

And Matt79, I think that after his performances How deserves a decent run in the side. All the batsmen do really apart from Vincent if he keeps this up.
 
Flem274*

Flem274*

123/5
Read two articles in the Heralds online edition about Brendan McCullum (I don't know how to post links so maybe someone else will be nice enough to?) Mark Richardson and Adam Parore both say that McCullum's full potential with the bat has not been realized yet. One of them commented on his hundred at junior level against Aussie and say that he has become more mature about his game and isn't playing the rash shots that get him out as often. I think it was Richardson who wrote that he could easily be as good as Adam Gilchrist. His greatest attribute bar his extreme talent is his sheer bloody mindedness and his hate of mediocrity.

Thoughts?
 
JBH001

JBH001

International Regular
Just copy and paste the links from your web browser dude.

I do agree that McCullum has potential, but like Gilchrist? Gimme a break - just a typical case of the NZ old bum boys getting together again. McCullum lacks the talent and the discipline and the technique of Gilly. I dont mean to suggest that I dont rate his batting, I do. But he is nowhere near Gilly, and neither do I ever see him coming even close.

McCullum will do well though, and better once he learns to cut out the silly shots and to ally some solid batting acumen to his batting skills. He should do well as an ODI opener (though I would still prefer two specialists in that position with McCullum coming in further down the order) and should, if he harnesses his talent become a 30 - 35 avg test keeper batsman.
 
Fiery

Fiery

Banned
It's easy Flem, just copy the web address from the browser up the top of your screen, then in the posting screen click on the icon with the picture of the chain link in front of the globe (hover the mouse over it and it wil say "Insert Link") and paste the address in there. Here they are anyway:

Richardson on McCullum

Parore on the Black Caps
 
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Prince EWS

Prince EWS

Global Moderator
As I said in another thread recently, I think McCullum's talent is vastly over-stated and over-rated in general. He's not very good, and doesn't have the potential to be very good. He's in good form now but he's really not that good IMO.
 
Fiery

Fiery

Banned
Prince EWS said:
As I said in another thread recently, I think McCullum's talent is vastly over-stated and over-rated in general. He's not very good, and doesn't have the potential to be very good. He's in good form now but he's really not that good IMO.
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I'll remember that and call you in 10 years
 
Craig

Craig

World Traveller
Where does this performance rank for NZ this year? Second to New Zealand beating Australia by 10 wickets earlier this year. I mean how many teams beatAustralia by 10 wickets and all that often in the last five or six years?
 
Flem274*

Flem274*

123/5
Cheers for the help guys.:)

Inclined to agree with Fiery here to an extent. Bad batsmen don't score runs, especially under pressure. Not sure where he'll rank on the keeper-batsman list but he has time on his side and some keepers in domestic cricket are scoring big runs so his aforementioned bloody mindedness should come to the fore.

And bad batsmen don't have good form Prince.:p

Richardson's comments that he'll lead the batting are a bit silly IMO. Taylor and Fulton(Fulton forgotten and underrated as usual, could well be the next Roger Twose in terms of being remembered) are the first of a pretty good middle order crop. Ryder should be next followed by Broom then I expect Hay, Nicol and De Grandholmme to smash down the door and yell for selection like Banshee's. That lot will lead the way but McCullum will definitely play a role assuming Bevan Griggs and Kruger Van Wyk don't usurp him.
 
Flem274*

Flem274*

123/5
Craig said:
Where does this performance rank for NZ this year? Second to New Zealand beating Australia by 10 wickets earlier this year. I mean how many teams beatAustralia by 10 wickets and all that often in the last five or six years?
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Probably second though that was an understrength Aussie side so hard to say.
 
Craig

Craig

World Traveller
Flem274* said:
Probably second though that was an understrength Aussie side so hard to say.
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Still was a pretty good effort though. You know the Black Caps can make a mountain out of a mole hill sometimes and to have not lost at least at one wicket was pretty good IMO. That and the NZ bowlers did a lot better then the Australian one who are meant to have a superior strength in depth in pace bowling.
 
Prince EWS

Prince EWS

Global Moderator
Flem274* said:
Bad batsmen don't score runs, especially under pressure.

And bad batsmen don't have good form Prince.:p
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Yes, yes they do. Any decent first class batsman would eventually score runs at international level if you gave them enough chances. What makes someone good is consistently doing it. And it's not just that I think McCullum is "wasting his talent" or "underachieving" like a lot of people do - I just don't think he's very good TBH.

Each to their own though.
 
Fiery

Fiery

Banned
Prince EWS said:
Yes, yes they do. Any decent first class batsman would eventually score runs at international level if you gave them enough chances. What makes someone good is consistently doing it. And it's not just that I think McCullum is "wasting his talent" or "underachieving" like a lot of people do - I just don't think he's very good TBH.

Each to their own though.
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He has played enough match-winning innings to suggest he can be very good. Absolutely carved Aussie up from schoolboy level
 
Flem274*

Flem274*

123/5
Prince EWS said:
Yes, yes they do. Any decent first class batsman would eventually score runs at international level if you gave them enough chances. What makes someone good is consistently doing it. And it's not just that I think McCullum is "wasting his talent" or "underachieving" like a lot of people do - I just don't think he's very good TBH.

Each to their own though.
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James Marshall (when his brother is secretly batting for him)-Very very good FC batsman. Just one fifty in ODIs and stuff all else. Dunno how many games he's played but he's the definition of "Out of his depth" and McCullum is definitely alot better than him. McCullum used to be pretty pathetic but since 2005 has kicked on and is a good batsman nowadays. Highly likely that he won't be great but he sure aint poor.

EDIT: Changed the example to what really must be happening..
 
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NZTailender

NZTailender

I can't believe I ate the whole thing
I tend to agree slightly with Prince. McCullum is slightly overrated, especially by some who think he's a wonder kid. But there are those who also underrate him. I think he is a very fine player, definitely better than his average suggests. But is he the next Gilchrist or Sangers? Not by a bloody long shot. For mine, he's better than Parore, Smith et al who have come before him as wicketkeeper batsmen. In fact, I already think he's the best we've had in terms of pure keeping (which has improved greatly and at times looked brilliant) but his batting is a bit hit and miss.

I think he can perform two valuable roles. He can either be a late order finisher or a top order stroker. NZ cricket and Brendon McCullum himself need to decide which one that want in ODI's so he can focus on that role. Promoting him only to drop him down again will do him no good. Once he has a role, and is guaranteed that role for as long as he can stand on two legs, only then will I think we'll see the best out of Brendon McCullum.
 
NZTailender

NZTailender

I can't believe I ate the whole thing
Flem274* said:
James Marshall-Very very good FC batsman. Just one fifty in ODIs and stuff all else. Dunno how many games he's played but he's the definition of "Out of his depth" and McCullum is definitely alot better than him. McCullum used to be pretty pathetic but since 2005 has kicked on and is a good batsman nowadays. Highly likely that he won't be great but he sure aint poor.
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I lol'd.
 
Prince EWS

Prince EWS

Global Moderator
Flem274* said:
James Marshall-Very very good FC batsman. Just one fifty in ODIs and stuff all else. Dunno how many games he's played but he's the definition of "Out of his depth" and McCullum is definitely alot better than him. McCullum used to be pretty pathetic but since 2005 has kicked on and is a good batsman nowadays. Highly likely that he won't be great but he sure aint poor.
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James Marshall averages under 30 in FC cricket and he's only played 8 ODIs and 5 tests anyway. Poor example really. He's obviously poor as well, but it doesn't make McCullum any better.
 
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