Langer vs Slater, who was the better opening batsman?

[Johnners]

Graeme Smith would come close imo

 

[Richard]

Smith and Ponting have in common their bottom-handed, legside-orientated grips, meaning they often "drag" the ball straighter than most batsmen. Smith, indeed, can hit through mid-off what many would aim through extra-cover.

Ponting, likewise, often plays to mid-on what so many would hit through mid-off. And it works, too.

 

[Richard]

Mark Waugh was so boring to watch. Only batsman who made me want to watch something else in recent times.

 

[Mister Wright]

Serious?? Mark Waugh was a gun. My favourite ever player actually.

Yeah, didn't like Mark Waugh much. Bit of a yawn fest when he was batting. Yes, I know I'm in the minority.

 

[iamdavid]

Smith and Ponting have in common their bottom-handed, legside-orientated grips, meaning they often "drag" the ball straighter than most batsmen. Smith, indeed, can hit through mid-off what many would aim through extra-cover.

Ponting, likewise, often plays to mid-on what so many would hit through mid-off. And it works, too.

Think it's got alot to do with Ponting's shuffle aswell, he covers his stumps in that initial movement and gets a long way across, by the time the ball reaches him he's standing almost on middle stump, so what is a middle and off stump line to someone like Martyn who stands very still is leg stump to Ponting.

 

[vic_orthdox]

Yeah, Ponting's actually got a really strong top hand, which is why you see him meeting the ball out in front of his body with a straight bat all the time.

 

[Richard]

Think it's got alot to do with Ponting's shuffle aswell, he covers his stumps in that initial movement and gets a long way across, by the time the ball reaches him he's standing almost on middle stump, so what is a middle and off stump line to someone like Martyn who stands very still is leg stump to Ponting.

Yep. Inzamam was exactly the same.

And Jack - while Ponting's obviously nowhere near as bottom-handed as Smith, they share the extreme leg-side strength.

 

[Mister Wright]

Yep. Inzamam was exactly the same.

And Jack - while Ponting's obviously nowhere near as bottom-handed as Smith, they share the extreme leg-side strength.

Personally I think it's a myth that Ponting strength is the leg-side. Yes, he does favour the leg-side, but it's no more stronger than his offside play. His cut shot, cover drive, off and straight drives are all superlative (thanks Marc Nicholas for that word), he also has one of the best late cuts in the game (I'm thinking more one day cricket here). I think we're confusing strength with favouring here, as it's hard to find a weakness in any of his shots.

 

[Richard]

I'm not trying to find a weakness. I'm saying that if someone asks you "where do you bowl at Ricky Ponting?" I'd say "stay away from the pads before you do anything else".

Of course he has a magnificent off-side game too, off both front-foot and back. But leg-side is the overwhelmingly obvious strength of his.

 

[Mister Wright]

I'm not trying to find a weakness. I'm saying that if someone asks you "where do you bowl at Ricky Ponting?" I'd say "stay away from the pads before you do anything else".

Of course he has a magnificent off-side game too, off both front-foot and back. But leg-side is the overwhelmingly obvious strength of his.

I disagree. If you're going to get Ponting early your best chance is getting him LBW. Of course, now that he's fully developed his game that slim chance of getting him before he's settled is norrowing by the day. You've got to bowl full to him early before he gets that footwork set. After he's set, it's basically down to luck. However, I think captains could be a little more adventerous with their field placings.

 

[Richard]

I'm not saying it's not. Almost any batsman is vulnerable to the lbw early on, Ponting included. Same way any batsman is vulnerable to the away-swinger any time.

But if you aim for his stumps you're always courting disaster, because unless you're smack on the off you're more likely to pay for it than be rewarded.

Obviously, you never, ever, ever, ever want to bowl short at him. At any stage of his innings.

 

[Mister Wright]

I'm not saying it's not. Almost any batsman is vulnerable to the lbw early on, Ponting included. Same way any batsman is vulnerable to the away-swinger any time.

But if you aim for his stumps you're always courting disaster, because unless you're smack on the off you're more likely to pay for it than be rewarded.

Obviously, you never, ever, ever, ever want to bowl short at him. At any stage of his innings.

Any captain who asks their bowling team to never, ever, ever bowl short to Ponting or any batsman for that matter isn't a good captain. Yes, Ponting is a great player of short bowling, but you can't just simply not ever bowl short to Ponting. You can't just let a player face the same length all the time, that's just stupid bowling and captaincy. You have to vary your length to Ponting and drop the odd short one in. We've seen him be surprised by short ones on occasion. Yes, don't bowl short to Ponting every ball or regularly, but put the odd one in.

 

[Richard]

I can think of no more than 3 or 4 occasions Ponting has been surprised by short deliveries. Notoriously, 1 of these was Andy Caddick who'd just been hooked either for four or six, can't remember, banged the next one in again and had him caught at fine-leg.

You might get Ponting out very, very occasionally by bowling short. Equally, you might get certain players out occasionally by bowling wide outside off. But usually, you'll pay to the tune of several hundred runs for every time you do it.

Bowling full is the best way to almost all batsmen, and Ponting more than most.

 

[Mister Wright]

I can think of no more than 3 or 4 occasions Ponting has been surprised by short deliveries. Notoriously, 1 of these was Andy Caddick who'd just been hooked either for four or six, can't remember, banged the next one in again and had him caught at fine-leg.

You might get Ponting out very, very occasionally by bowling short. Equally, you might get certain players out occasionally by bowling wide outside off. But usually, you'll pay to the tune of several hundred runs for every time you do it.

Bowling full is the best way to almost all batsmen, and Ponting more than most.

He's been surprised by short ones very often, hasn't always got out to them, but as a bowler/captain you want to get doubt in the batsman's mind, even if it's doubts about the pitch or one particular ball that could be coming their way. Yes, you want to bowl a consistent line to ponting and have most of your balls in the one area, but you don't ever want to say to a bowler don't bowl a short one, particularly if they are a very good bowler of the bouncer. You're taking away a bowler's weapon. Especially given Ponting loves to get on the front foot give him a short one now an then to stop him from dominating what's happening on the pitch.

 

[iamdavid]

I can think of no more than 3 or 4 occasions Ponting has been surprised by short deliveries. Notoriously, 1 of these was Andy Caddick who'd just been hooked either for four or six, can't remember, banged the next one in again and had him caught at fine-leg.

You might get Ponting out very, very occasionally by bowling short. Equally, you might get certain players out occasionally by bowling wide outside off. But usually, you'll pay to the tune of several hundred runs for every time you do it.

Bowling full is the best way to almost all batsmen, and Ponting more than most.

The last bowler who really consistenly got the better of Ponting was Shane Bond in 2001/02, and his strategy was to work on Pontings patience (granted this was one day cricket) and bowl full wide outswingers in the hope Ponting would eventually spar at an inappropriate one, it worked several times during that infamous VB series.
I've heard whispers that bowlers fancy him for an lbw early on, I assume because of his shuffle, but never really seen it work on a regular basis.

 

[Richard]

He's been surprised by short ones very often, hasn't always got out to them, but as a bowler/captain you want to get doubt in the batsman's mind, even if it's doubts about the pitch or one particular ball that could be coming their way. Yes, you want to bowl a consistent line to ponting and have most of your balls in the one area, but you don't ever want to say to a bowler don't bowl a short one, particularly if they are a very good bowler of the bouncer. You're taking away a bowler's weapon. Especially given Ponting loves to get on the front foot give him a short one now an then to stop him from dominating what's happening on the pitch.

For me, a short ball (while it might occasionally get an ungainly stroke, unless it goes up and into hands it's no real use) isn't much of a weapon against Ponting. I've seen no evidence he'll stop dominating on the front-foot because he's received one (or two, or three).

No-one's ever realistically going to completely avoid a certain delivery, anyway. But if I'm hoping to get Ponting out and I see a short one go down, I'm never, ever going to hold-out any great hope. That's all.

 

[Jono]

I respect and rate Ponting as a batsman heaps, so don't get me wrong here, but I for the life of me cannot see how anyone could describe him overall as a good batsman to watch.

His pull shot is brilliant, no doubt, no one plays it better. But there are just so many more pleasing on the eye batsman to watch (and yes I realise it comes down to subjective personal taste) I always find it weird when people describe Ricky as good to watch.

Same goes for Inzy as well.

 

[Olwe]

i think the best opinig batmen of all time without a doubbt is Jack Hobbs he has the record which proberly will not get betern of 61,760 first class runs @ 50.70 in 834 games.
scoring 199 centries and 273 half centies with a top score of 316*. he has alos takern over 100 wickets as batsmen with his best at 7 wks for 56. for england his run avrige for engalnd is still over 50 in fact it is 56.94 which is astonising i think.

what is evern more astonising he scored over half of his half centies over 40 yrs old. and became they oldest player to score a test. he has also scored 1000 countey runs on 26 diffrent ocaations when only aa handfull of people have done it once. with Mark Ramprakash doing it twice in a row (last seaon and the seosn which has just finisherd,)

 

[Mister Wright]

For me, a short ball (while it might occasionally get an ungainly stroke, unless it goes up and into hands it's no real use) isn't much of a weapon against Ponting. I've seen no evidence he'll stop dominating on the front-foot because he's received one (or two, or three).

No-one's ever realistically going to completely avoid a certain delivery, anyway. But if I'm hoping to get Ponting out and I see a short one go down, I'm never, ever going to hold-out any great hope. That's all.

Yeah. But, to say never, ever, ever, ever bowl a short one is just ridiculous. Fair enough if the bowler isn't a good bowler of the bouncer - if it's not a weapon don't use it. But, if you are a good bowler of the bouncer you have to use it as it is one of your weapons, no matter how good the batsman is at the other end.

 

[anoop4real]

IMO Langer is the best