***Official*** New Zealand in South Africa

[Prince EWS]

Really? Oops my mistake I'm obviously thinking of someone else then.

As for Oram, what do you gys think his career path should be? Should he keep being what he's doing now, try to improve the bowling but get injured more, or become a specialist batsman? Personally I think he should concentrate on his batting as his bowling is looking worrisome ATM.

Oram does not have anywhere near the skill level or technique to be a specialist batsman at test level IMO. As a batting allrounder at #6 bowling ten overs an innings, his place is justifed, but I'd pick a number of players before him if he couldn't bowl TBH.

 

[Richard]

Bracewell eyes batting role for Hopkins

Played well enough last season, won a couple of games for Otago but I've never been a fan of two wicket-keepers in the same side. Given he's only a very average List A batsman, it's a bad comment to be making and could lead to another poor selection.

Basically he's saying that there are no specialist batsmen better than Hopkins?

 

[Flem274*]

Oram does not have anywhere near the skill level or technique to be a specialist batsman at test level IMO. As a batting allrounder at #6 bowling ten overs an innings, his place is justifed, but I'd pick a number of players before him if he couldn't bowl TBH.

Hmm technique can be changed though. The main problem would be that if he remains a middle order bat from around 3-6 then there's going to be alot of competition for middle order spots shortly and there's a good chance he'd miss out. If I was him I'd try and be an opener as his only competition will be Papps, How and Stewart in the coming years.

 

[sportychic33]

LOL, Oram as an opener would be amusing to watch. They tried him at number 3 in a Warm up game for the Twenty/20's against Australia and he managed to knock himself out, I really can't see it happening and wouldn't like to, but with Bracewell who knows whats going to happen.

 

[Flem274*]

LOL, Oram as an opener would be amusing to watch. They tried him at number 3 in a Warm up game for the Twenty/20's against Australia and he managed to knock himself out, I really can't see it happening and wouldn't like to, but with Bracewell who knows whats going to happen.

If he remodelled his technique and resisted the temptation to whack everything he could be in with a shot as opener, though I agree it would be amusing and unlikely to work.

 

[Prince EWS]

Hmm technique can be changed though.

What's the point of that if there are others around with the technique required? He's simply not as good a batsman as Fleming, Styris, Fulton, Sinclair or even Vincent IMO, regardless of what his test average is so far in his short career. There are probably players in domestic cricket who I've not seen that would be better bets as well. His selection is fine providing he's going to bowl some decent overs as a fifth bowler, but he's not a specialist batsman's rear end.

 

[Perm]

Doesn't Oram have 160 odd as his top score? When was that scored?

Really? Oops my mistake I'm obviously thinking of someone else then.

Hamish Marshall, has a top score in Test cricket of 160.

 

[Perm]

Basically he's saying that there are no specialist batsmen better than Hopkins?

None better at closing the innings, which TBH, isn't that far from the truth. David Houpapa is one option, but has only just burst onto the domestic scene. Obviously Chris Harris is the best closer in New Zealand, but now is unavailable for selection.

 

[Perm]

Anyway, not sure what the issue is with Oram's place in the side. He balances the team, and deserves to be there. If he were to be replace by a specialist batsman, then more of an onus would come onto Styris' bowling, which isn't really in the same league as Oram's. We have to remember that going into the Sri Lankan series in 2006/2007 Oram had only played one FC game as a warmup, which was a big mistake. More deserving of the all-rounders spot than anybody else in the country.

 

[Raghav]

Really? Oops my mistake I'm obviously thinking of someone else then.

As for Oram, what do you gys think his career path should be? Should he keep being what he's doing now, try to improve the bowling but get injured more, or become a specialist batsman? Personally I think he should concentrate on his batting as his bowling is looking worrisome ATM.

It was styris with which you might have confused with. Its in the same test that styris scored 160 along with Oram's 133

 

[Raghav]

Oram does not have anywhere near the skill level or technique to be a specialist batsman at test level IMO. As a batting allrounder at #6 bowling ten overs an innings, his place is justifed, but I'd pick a number of players before him if he couldn't bowl TBH.

I agree with you Prince. There are many players who can perform better than him at that position.He was good two seasons before with the ball. I would really love to see him on the field if he is performing.

 

[Perm]

How earns one-day recall

Squad: Lou Vincent, Jamie How, Ross Taylor, Scott Styris, Brendon McCullum (wk), Gareth Hopkins, Jacob Oram, Daniel Vettori (capt), Kyle Mills, James Franklin, Shane Bond, Mark Gillespie, Jeetan Patel, Michael Mason.

FFS when will our stupid ****ing selectors learn? How is an average batsman, granted he had reasonable success last season but he fills me with no confidence. Michael Papps is a class above and surely deserves a crack. James Franklin is a rubbish ODI bowler. We're going to get slaughtered if we play Mason, Franklin or Gillespie too often. Gareth Hopkins isn't that good either, better options available.

 

[HeathDavisSpeed]

FFS when will our stupid ****ing selectors learn? How is an average batsman, granted he had reasonable success last season but he fills me with no confidence. Michael Papps is a class above and surely deserves a crack. James Franklin is a rubbish ODI bowler. We're going to get slaughtered if we play Mason, Franklin or Gillespie too often. Gareth Hopkins isn't that good either, better options available.

Sigh. That bowling attack (if Bond gets injured) does seem like a recipe for Mrs. Miggins' Patented Pork Pies.

Take a pinch of a James Franklin half-volley
Add a couple of Mark Gillespie full-tosses
Simmer gently, and slowly and steadily add the Michael Mason long-hops.

Watch as the mixture runs over.

Pour the mixture into a Jamie How pie-mould and allow to stand for 50 overs.

You should have a wye-aye Pork Pie.

Goodbye.

 

[Athlai]

All the more reason for an extra splash of Patel in the side.

 

[Perm]

All the more reason for an extra splash of Patel in the side.

Indeed.

Bond
Mills
Oram
Vettori
Patel
Styris

Anything other than that would be madness. Three seamers, two spinners and Styris to releive the pressure if one of our bowlers is being carted. Bond and Patel to have the death duties, with Mills to bowl most of his overs up-front.

 

[Flem274*]

Starting to think NZC recruits selectors from lunatic asylums.

 

[NZTailender]

Starting to think NZC recruits selectors from lunatic asylums.

Insulting to us lunatics TBH.

 

[Raghav]

How earns one-day recall

Squad: Lou Vincent, Jamie How, Ross Taylor, Scott Styris, Brendon McCullum (wk), Gareth Hopkins, Jacob Oram, Daniel Vettori (capt), Kyle Mills, James Franklin, Shane Bond, Mark Gillespie, Jeetan Patel, Michael Mason.

FFS when will our stupid ****ing selectors learn? How is an average batsman, granted he had reasonable success last season but he fills me with no confidence. Michael Papps is a class above and surely deserves a crack. James Franklin is a rubbish ODI bowler. We're going to get slaughtered if we play Mason, Franklin or Gillespie too often. Gareth Hopkins isn't that good either, better options available.

Papps - I dont feel he deserves a place in the NZ side(rightly done by selectors). How > Papps

Franklin, Mason and Gillespie is a better selection IMO. Others selected would even get smashing even more than these. Franklin, even though he gives some runs, he can be handyful on the south african wickets. His batting also gives him an additional advantage. Given Oram being not in the form, he can fill his boots in the coming years.

Gillespie is a good bowler in the death. Mason is good in the south african conditions. I do not have any objections to the selection for this series. All the best Vettori

 

[HeathDavisSpeed]

Papps - I dont feel he deserves a place in the NZ side(rightly done by selectors). How > Papps

Erm... No... just no.

 

[NZTailender]

How earns one-day recall

Squad: Lou Vincent, Jamie How, Ross Taylor, Scott Styris, Brendon McCullum (wk), Gareth Hopkins, Jacob Oram, Daniel Vettori (capt), Kyle Mills, James Franklin, Shane Bond, Mark Gillespie, Jeetan Patel, Michael Mason.

1. Jamie How
2. Lou Vincent
3. Ross Taylor
4. Scott Styris
5. Jacob Oram
6. Brendon McCullum+
7. Daniel Vettori*
8. James Franklin
9. Kyle Mills
10. Shane Bond
11. Jeetan Patel

Is the side I'd use, just quietly.