Most dire player to play international cricket?

[BoyBrumby]

There's probably any number of amateurs who were selected for MCC tours just up from varsity on a bit of a jolly old beano from the pre-war era who would fully justify the "dire" sobriquet.

I hate to pick on any one in particular, but Leland Hone (cricinfo) looks a prime example. Played for England before he'd ever played for a county. IIRC there's a player whose only FC game was a test, but can't recall who he was for the life of me.

 

[Burgey]

Chris Matthews

 

[Langeveldt]

I don't agree with picking Ramprakash and Salisbury, two cricketers who could never convert to test level, but it's obvious they at least had potential and a bit of ability, otherwise they wouldn't have had such success at FC level in England.. Okay it's not test cricket, but at no stage were they entering the realms of being dire professional cricketers.. I remember Mahmood impressing me about six years ago, and as soon as I saw him play for England I knew I had made a fatal error of judgement.. I've never seen anyone look so horrendous at the bowling crease since, whether it be for Lancs or internationally..

 

[shortpitched713]

Akash Chopra

Clearly calling it like it is, tbh.

 

[Perm]

Mohammad Sami
Ajit Agarkar
Rana Naved-ul-Hasan
Sadagoppan Ramesh
Imran Farhat
Faisal Iqbal
Salman Butt
Mark Ramprakash
Laxmipathi Balaji
Shahid Afridi
Kamran Akmal
Ian Salisbury
Akash Chopra
Ata-ur-Rehman
Parthiv Patel
Robert Croft
Abdul Razzaq
Irfan Pathan

Disagree with a fair few of these people TBH.

 

[HeathDavisSpeed]

Disagree with a fair few of these people TBH.

Disagree with the whole list. Clearly, none of those players were the worst to play international cricket. You really have to be scraping the barrel to find truly abysmal players. These guys, not even close.

 

[Perm]

Disagree with the whole list. Clearly, none of those players were the worst to play international cricket. You really have to be scraping the barrel to find truly abysmal players. These guys, not even close.

TBH I think he's just throwing a few names out there of particularly dire players, to generate some discussion.

 

[HeathDavisSpeed]

TBH I think he's just throwing a few names out there of particularly dire players, to generate some discussion.

Fair enough. I will dismiss them out of hand

Chris Kuggle-juggle (as Phlegm calls him) is clearly a cut below that whole list.

What about Alan Wells, Simon Brown, Paul Taylor, Alan Igglesden or Richard Illingworth?

Frankly, given England's massive player turnover, there's gotta be a few candidates from their 90s team (though not Ronnie Irani, Robert Croft or Derek Pringle who all had their limited successes)

 

[HeathDavisSpeed]

Maybe we need to refine this debate somewhat... How's about...

1. Worst batsman selected primarily as a batsman
2. Worst batsman full stop (hard to go past Chris Martin in this one)
3. Worst bowler selected primarily as a bowler (Kuggle-juggle)
4. Worst bowler full stop
5. Worst keeper
6. Worst fielder
7. THE GRAND CRICKET WEB AWARD FOR WORST ALL ROUND INTERNATIONAL CRICKETER OF ALL TIME.

 

[Athlai]

Maybe we need to refine this debate somewhat... How's about...

1. Worst batsman selected primarily as a batsman
2. Worst batsman full stop (hard to go past Chris Martin in this one)
3. Worst bowler selected primarily as a bowler (Kuggle-juggle)
4. Worst bowler full stop
5. Worst keeper
6. Worst fielder
7. THE GRAND CRICKET WEB AWARD FOR WORST ALL ROUND INTERNATIONAL CRICKETER OF ALL TIME.

Remember the Tsunami matches and the whole Kiwi squad had a bowl? Didn't someone have a bowl (McCullum?) And threw a few lollipops and quite a few wide wide wides?

Worst bowling, it was great.

 

[Matt79]

What-his-name Croft, the English "spinner". He was a pretty bad bowler and an embarrassing batsman. He batted at 9 or 10, but I remember clearly him refusing a single from the non-strikers end, leaving the number 11 on strike because he didn't want to face Lee (IIRC). One of the few times I've seen an international cricketer obviously display his fear on the field. I'm sure any batsman with a shred of brains feels the fear when they're on strike to someone of Lee's pace, but showing it and dropping your apparently weaker batsman of a teammate in it because of it was pretty unedifying viewing.

 

[Swervy]

One of the few times I've seen an international cricketer obviously display his fear on the field. I'm sure any batsman with a shred of brains feels the fear when they're on strike to someone of Lee's pace, but showing it and dropping your apparently weaker batsman of a teammate in it because of it was pretty unedifying viewing.

hehehe...did you ever see Tufnell bat?

 

[Perm]

What-his-name Croft, the English "spinner". He was a pretty bad bowler and an embarrassing batsman. He batted at 9 or 10, but I remember clearly him refusing a single from the non-strikers end, leaving the number 11 on strike because he didn't want to face Lee (IIRC). One of the few times I've seen an international cricketer obviously display his fear on the field. I'm sure any batsman with a shred of brains feels the fear when they're on strike to someone of Lee's pace, but showing it and dropping your apparently weaker batsman of a teammate in it because of it was pretty unedifying viewing.

Robert. Also, he's Welsh IIRC.

 

[thierry henry]

Remember the Tsunami matches and the whole Kiwi squad had a bowl? Didn't someone have a bowl (McCullum?) And threw a few lollipops and quite a few wide wide wides?

Worst bowling, it was great.

That was the third match in Hamilton, it wasn't actually the official match but a "10/10" match they had afterwards for a laugh because the first match was so dire

McCullum stunk it up iirc and Daryl Tuffey bowled left arm spin wearing Dan Vettori specs

Then I went out on the town afterwards and met pretty much every player from both teams, was awesome

 

[Richard]

What-his-name Croft, the English "spinner". He was a pretty bad bowler and an embarrassing batsman. He batted at 9 or 10, but I remember clearly him refusing a single from the non-strikers end, leaving the number 11 on strike because he didn't want to face Lee (IIRC). One of the few times I've seen an international cricketer obviously display his fear on the field. I'm sure any batsman with a shred of brains feels the fear when they're on strike to someone of Lee's pace, but showing it and dropping your apparently weaker batsman of a teammate in it because of it was pretty unedifying viewing.

Robert Croft played just 1 Test against Lee and never batted at a time when Lee was in mid-spell. Nor did he bat with the number-eleven, at all (and the two below him that Test were Caddick and Gough, mugs neither).

I think you probably have the wrong player in your above scenario. He played just 1 Test in Australia, too, and his only innings (of 23) came in its entirity in partnership with Mark Ramprakash. Looking at scorecards from 1997, there's only 1 possible occasion something of such ilk could conceivably have happened, with Mike Smith at Headingley, and the bowler would have been either McGrath, Reiffel or Gillespie. I don't think it likely though.

Also, Croft was not merely no coward, but was also a very decent fingerspinner, who averaged 24.65 in Tests outside England. In time, I'm confident it'll be realised MSP isn't really that much better than him, and Croft certainly offers far more with the bat.

 

[Richard]

Fair enough. I will dismiss them out of hand

Chris Kuggle-juggle (as Phlegm calls him) is clearly a cut below that whole list.

What about Alan Wells, Simon Brown, Paul Taylor, Alan Igglesden or Richard Illingworth?

Frankly, given England's massive player turnover, there's gotta be a few candidates from their 90s team (though not Ronnie Irani, Robert Croft or Derek Pringle who all had their limited successes)

Nah, there weren't that many awful players in the 1990s. Brown and Taylor would probably be thought-of higher had they not played their single Tests, and I rather wish they hadn't. Alan Wells was a most unfortunate player - his only Test came long after his prime, as he had been completely ignored for a number of years, and eventually decided (presumably in frustration) to take the rebel-tour route, which ruled him out for longer still. When he did play, he should never have done so.

Igglesden was an 80s player, and Richard Illingworth I'm pretty confident would have been a decent spinner on uncovered wickets, and there have certainly been far worse ones to play for England, very recently (in Dawson and Batty).

The worst England player of the 1990s would have to be one of Martin McCague, Mark Lathwell or Joseph Benjamin. Or possibly Mike Watkinson. Or maybe even Chris Read, who should never, ever have been anywhere near the side in 1999, regardless of his later credentials, which became far stronger.

 

[pup11]

The one and only Mickey Lewis!!

 

[Goughy]

Hard to (if not imposible) to go past Martin as the worst batsman.

Though Tufnell and Malcolm would run him close.

Note on an earlier post, Croft was not a bad batsman at all. In fact he was useful. A fact shown in that he has more List A 100s than Vaughan (4 to 3).

 

[Matt79]

Robert Croft played just 1 Test against Lee and never batted at a time when Lee was in mid-spell. Nor did he bat with the number-eleven, at all (and the two below him that Test were Caddick and Gough, mugs neither).

I think you probably have the wrong player in your above scenario. He played just 1 Test in Australia, too, and his only innings (of 23) came in its entirity in partnership with Mark Ramprakash. Looking at scorecards from 1997, there's only 1 possible occasion something of such ilk could conceivably have happened, with Mike Smith at Headingley, and the bowler would have been either McGrath, Reiffel or Gillespie. I don't think it likely though.

Also, Croft was not merely no coward, but was also a very decent fingerspinner, who averaged 24.65 in Tests outside England. In time, I'm confident it'll be realised MSP isn't really that much better than him, and Croft certainly offers far more with the bat.

I'll be very red-faced if I'm wrong about it being Croft. I'm quite prepared to concede it might not have been Lee - I think it was, but I'm not sure. I'll have a look and be prepared to come back and say I was wrong if I can't find it (although its not the kind of thing that's immediately apparent from a score card).

 

[Tomm NCCC]

Mick Lewis was, and still is awful. Mohammed Sami was never that great either