All time England ODI XI

[Pratters]

No English player seems to be making the all time ODI XI.. What would your All time England ODI XI be?

 

[Mr Mxyzptlk]

Gooch, Stewart, Fairbrother, Hick, Ealham, Gough. I'd have Mullally in there too. Names that come to mind immediately.

EDIT: Botham, Broad, DeFreitas - more names that just came to mind.

Flintoff, of course. Lots of bowlers there. Hmmm.

 

[Mr Mxyzptlk]

Willis, Dilley, Underwood, Marks (!), Lamb, Robin Smith, Trescothick, Pietersen.

And how could I forget Nick Knight!

 

[Prince EWS]

1. Nick Knight
2. Marcus Trescothick
3. Allan Lamb
4. Graeme Hick
5. Kevin Pietersen
6. Alec Stewart
7. Andrew Flintoff
8. Ian Botham
9. John Emburey
10. Darren Gough
11. Alan Mullally

 

[BoyBrumby]

BBC's pre-empted us. Link here.

Their XI:

Graham Gooch
Marcus Trescothick
Robin Smith
Kevin Pietersen
Allan Lamb
Andrew Flintoff
Ian Botham
Alec Stewart
Darren Gough
Bob Willis
Derek Underwood

 

[Mr Mxyzptlk]

1. Nick Knight
2. Marcus Trescothick
3. Allan Lamb
4. Graeme Hick
5. Kevin Pietersen
6. Alec Stewart
7. Andrew Flintoff
8. Ian Botham
9. John Emburey
10. Bob Willis
11. Alan Mullally

One questions whether Graeme Hick deserves his place ahead of Robin Smith.
And Gough is England's most success ODI bowler. How can he not be there?

 

[Mr Mxyzptlk]

BBC's pre-empted us. Link here.

Their XI:

Graham Gooch
Marcus Trescothick
Robin Smith
Kevin Pietersen
Allan Lamb
Andrew Flintoff
Ian Botham
Alec Stewart
Darren Gough
Bob Willis
Derek Underwood

No Nick Knight? A farce!

 

[Prince EWS]

One questions whether Graeme Hick deserves his place ahead of Robin Smith.
And Gough is England's most success ODI bowler. How can he not be there?

I can't believe I left Gough out. I had actually thought of him while putting the team together and somehow forgot to include him. I'll cut Willis for him.

Smith may have a slightly higher average than Hick, but Hick scored twice as many half centuries, one more century and scored his runs at a significantly quicker rate.

 

[Mr Mxyzptlk]

I can't believe I left Gough out. I had actually thought of him while putting the team together and somehow forgot to include him. I'll cut Willis for him.

Bob Willis - 80 wickets at 24.60 with an economy of 3.28.
He MUST be there. Emburey misses out IMO.

Smith may have a slightly higher average than Hick, but Hick scored twice as many half centuries, one more century and scored his runs at a significantly quicker rate.

Given that Smith played a significant number less in terms of matches, I'd say his record is pretty much even pace with Hick. Also, Hick played the tail-end of his career in an era of higher batting SRs. The only reason I'd consider Hick ahead of Smith is his useful bowling.

 

[Prince EWS]

Given that Smith played a significant number less in terms of matches, I'd say his record is pretty much even pace with Hick. Also, Hick played the tail-end of his career in an era of higher batting SRs. The only reason I'd consider Hick ahead of Smith is his useful bowling.

Yeah, it's a pretty even call. The fact that Hick played more matches shouldn't count against him a great deal though IMO - it means he had a more significant impact on the side.

Bob Willis - 80 wickets at 24.60 with an economy of 3.28.
He MUST be there. Emburey misses out IMO.

I really wanted to include a spinner, and I didn't want to cut Mullally. Given Emburey is so inferior compared to the rest though, I guess we have no other options. So I'd agree.

 

[Poker Boy]

OK my all-time England ODI XI:
Gooch (captain)
Trescothick
Hick
Fairbrother
Pietersen
Stewart(WK)
Botham
Flintoff
De Freitas
Gough
Willis

Hick pips Smith on the basis of his bowling. IMO no spinner demands inclusion so you play to your strength and use Hick and/or KP to do the spinning (worked perfectly well for 80's Windies). Fairbrother is there as the nearest thing we had to a Bevan, as well as for his fielding. De Freitas might surprise but he's in our top four ODI wicket takers gives the team batting to No 9 and more athleticism in the field (remember you can't "hide" anyone in ODIs.) As for the captain it has to be the man under who we were favourites to win in '92 (and we've never said that about England before or since).

 

[NZTailender]

Knight
Trescothick
Gooch*
Hick
Fairbrother
Stewart+
Flintoff
Botham
Gough
Willis
Hendrick

 

[Richard]

For the umpteenth time...

70s\80s ODIs CANNOT BE EQUATED to 90s\2000s ones.

A 70s\80s XI:
Gooch
Amiss
Broad
Lamb
Gower (debatable)
Botham
Knott (wkt)
Old
Hendrick
Willis (c)
Underwood
Surprise surprise, mostly Test players...

And a 90s\2000s XI (much more interesting):
Trescothick
Knight
Hick (c)
Fairbrother
Stewart (wkt)
Pietersen
Flintoff
Caddick
Gough
Fraser
Mullally
Long tail, yes, but some serious bowlers in there. The captaincy, too, is a difficult thing - Stewart OOTQ with his wicketkeeping, Fairbrother OOTQ as he could never captain anyone without getting so stressed he pulled a hamstring twice a week, Trescothick... just no... Thorpe... read the same... Flintoff... hmm, I wonder now... and I don't pick a bowler as captain. Therefore Hick and Knight, reasonable county captains both, have a toss-up. I went for Hick because he's older than Knight.

 

[PhoenixFire]

For the umpteenth time...

70s\80s ODIs CANNOT BE EQUATED to 90s\2000s ones.

A 70s\80s XI:
Gooch
Amiss
Broad
Smith
Fairbrother (just about qualifies)
Botham
Knott (wkt)
Old
Hendrick
Willis (c)
Underwood
Surprise surprise, mostly Test players...

And a 90s\2000s XI (much more interesting):
Trescothick
Knight
Hick (c)
Fairbrother
Stewart (wkt)
Thorpe
Flintoff
Caddick
Gough
Fraser
Mullally
Long tail, yes, but some serious bowlers in there. The captaincy, too, is a difficult thing - Stewart OOTQ with his wicketkeeping, Fairbrother OOTQ as he could never captain anyone without getting so stressed he pulled a hamstring twice a week, Trescothick... just no... Thorpe... read the same... Flintoff... hmm, I wonder now... and I don't pick a bowler as captain. Therefore Hick and Knight, reasonable county captains both, have a toss-up. I went for Hick because he's older than Knight.

Ever heard of Kevin Pietersen?

 

[Saqqy Mush]

May as well make a topic debating the top 10 tallest midgets in the history of Billy Smart's Big top Circus.

 

[PhoenixFire]

May as well make a topic debating the top 10 tallest midgets in the history of Billy Smart's Big top Circus.

Welcome back BLE, it's been a time

 

[Richard]

Ever heard of Kevin Pietersen?

 

[wpdavid]

A 70s\80s XI:
Gooch
Amiss
Broad
Smith
Fairbrother (just about qualifies)
Botham
Knott (wkt)
Old
Hendrick
Willis (c)
Underwood
Surprise surprise, mostly Test players...

Gower should be in the side - he played some terrific oneday knocks, although he didn't particularly enjoy that form of the game. Allan Lamb should certainly be in the XI -ask Courtney Walsh & Bruce Reid. I can't imagine Robin Smith played many games in the 80's, and, without checking, I don't recall Fairbrother being outstanding until the early 90's.
Not sure about Broad, either. Maybe Randall, if only for his exceptional fielding (cue a oneday average of about 12 when I get round to checking). Arguably Emburey ahead of Underwood in this form of the game. Maybe DeFreitas instead of Old or Hendrick.

And a 90s\2000s XI (much more interesting):
Trescothick
Knight
Hick (c)
Fairbrother
Stewart (wkt)
Pietersen
Flintoff
Caddick
Gough
Fraser
Mullally

Glad you remembered Pietersen
I'd play a spinner, probably Giles, who's rather under-rated in this form of the game.
If the game was being played in Asia, I'd consider Reeve ahead of one of the quicker guys.

EDIT
Oh, and I forgot - Thorpe vs Fairbrother ?

 

[Mr Mxyzptlk]

I don't recall Fairbrother being outstanding until the early 90's.

IIRC Fairbrother averages under 25 in the 80s, then was recalled in 1991 and started to get on track.

 

[Richard]

Gower should be in the side - he played some terrific oneday knocks, although he didn't particularly enjoy that form of the game. Allan Lamb should certainly be in the XI -ask Courtney Walsh & Bruce Reid. I can't imagine Robin Smith played many games in the 80's, and, without checking, I don't recall Fairbrother being outstanding until the early 90's.
Not sure about Broad, either. Maybe Randall, if only for his exceptional fielding (cue a oneday average of about 12 when I get round to checking). Arguably Emburey ahead of Underwood in this form of the game. Maybe DeFreitas instead of Old or Hendrick.

True about Lamb - forgot him, should beyond all question be in ahead of Fairbrother or Smith who indeed didn't play much in the 80s, were more 90s players. I did check Randall and his ODI record's poor (like so many other reasonable Test players, the Gattings and the like).

The only thing I remember about Gower is him saying he hated one-dayers because he hit his cover-drive and usually only got 1. Only averaged 30 in ODIs, too.

No way would I go for Emburey ahead of Underwood. Underwood was the perfect one-day spinner - lovely and fast, lovely and flat. Emburey might've been a bit similar, but Underwood's speed is legendary.

And weren't Old and Hendrick commonly recognised to be the best line-and-length bowlers in the country, along with Geoff Arnold? (Who I would've had as first-reserve seamer) Not too sure about DeFreitas, was always too inconsistent for mine.

Glad you remembered Pietersen
I'd play a spinner, probably Giles, who's rather under-rated in this form of the game.
If the game was being played in Asia, I'd consider Reeve ahead of one of the quicker guys.

No way, Jose. Good seamers are good seamers on all surfaces, you don't need a spinner or a trickster IMO, wherever you're playing.