Rank these 5 Test openers in order ( Boycott, Greenidge, Hayden, Sehwag, G Smith )

[shortpitched713]

Rank the non Gavaskar modernish Test openers, in order of greatness.

 

[Coronis]

Boycott
Smith
Greenidge
Hayden
Sehwag

imo.

 

[BazBall21]

Boycott
Smith
Greenidge
Hayden
Sehwag

imo.

My only difference is Greenidge ahead of Smith.

 

[ma1978]

Greenidge
Smith
Sehwag
Hayden
Boycott

You have to win matches for your country to be great: can’t recall when Boycott actually did that

 

[OverratedSanity]

Greenidge
Smith
Boycott
Sehwag
Hayden

 

[shortpitched713]

So there's 2 things that brought this on, the first is a bit of a gripe at the CW "consensus", and in particular about a certain cricketer who grinds my gears, Geoff Boycott. How can we downgrade the accomplishments and abilities of Kallis, a player with incredible longevity and basically impeccable record in a variety of conditions, as being a "slow" player? Then at the same time rate Boycott is rated at or even above ( he's above all of these 4 if you go by the last 2 Vanillaish drafts, looking at you @Line and Length , and @Bitmap ) all non Gavaskar modernish (like Sobers and after basically, played a majority of their careers after the early 60s) openers? This is a guy who got run out by his own teammate, and generally rubbed his own side the wrong way, unlike Kallis who teammates have defended throughout his career as a rock of their order, regardless of what we the peanut gallery say.

So yeah, the other thing is I was trying to make a consensus CW XI out of said "modernish" players, and the only really wild card spot is the second opener. The rest of the team shakes out thusly:

01. Gavaskar
02. ??
03. Lara / S. Smith
04. Tendulkar / S. Smith
05. V. Richards / S. Smith
06. Sobers
07. Gilchrist
08. Hadlee / Khan
09. Marshall
10. Warne/Murali
11. McGrath

My pick is Hayden of course, but I'm not going to pretend there's a consensus on this. Looks like Greenidge is leading for now, but I think the spot certainly has competition.

 

[shortpitched713]

My own order for these 5:

Hayden
Sehwag
G. Smith
Greenidge
Boycott

Boycott, on a team with the spineful leadership required to get him to play for the team, could be a solid opener. Could average low 40s in a typical modern era maybe. Luckily for him he got away with playing a career for himself and his precious average.

 

[flibbertyjibber]

Greenidge
Hayden
Boycott
Smith
Sehwag

 

[Coronis]

So there's 2 things that brought this on, the first is a bit of a gripe at the CW "consensus", and in particular about a certain cricketer who grinds my gears, Geoff Boycott. How can we downgrade the accomplishments and abilities of Kallis, a player with incredible longevity and basically impeccable record in a variety of conditions, as being a "slow" player? Then at the same time rate Boycott is rated at or even above all non Gavaskar modernish (like Sobers and after basically, played a majority of their careers after the early 60s) openers?

Because many people here are inconsistent with their opinions and use SR as a crutch to downgrade players they don’t like.

 

[trundler]

Kallis is a lot better than Boycott though. He's almost universally considered such. There's no CW consensus suggesting otherwise. Kallis's slow scoring was somewhat of a limitation but he was still a great batsman whereas Boycott's was actively detrimental to his team. Qualitative difference between the two. That said, scoring rate not mattering at all is an utterly nonsensical take.

 

[shortpitched713]

I don't like Boycott, definitely not as a player, and his "alleged" odious actions off the field don't help.

But my dislike of him as a player isn't down to a sole reason like "low strike rate bad". It's because he was seen as selfish both by his teammates and opponent peers. Players have perceptions of each other, but it usually takes quite a bit for them to actually voice something as negative as that, so there's clearly something there.

 

[shortpitched713]

I think the only thing propping up his reputation, is that he was a straightforward, sometimes insightful commentator. Otherwise I think he would likely have faded away, as not much more than an unpleasant memory.

 

[trundler]

I don't like Boycott, definitely not as a player, and his "alleged" odious actions off the field don't help.

But my dislike of him as a player isn't down to a sole reason like "low strike rate bad". It's because he was seen as selfish both by his teammates and opponent peers. Players have perceptions of each other, but it usually takes quite a bit for them to actually voice something as negative as that, so there's clearly something there.

But there's no dual standard whereby Kallis gets penalised and Boycott doesn't though? I am one of Boycott's biggest detractors possibly and I would have Kallis top 15 as a batsman.

 

[shortpitched713]

Kallis is a lot better than Boycott though. He's almost universally considered such. There's no CW consensus suggesting otherwise. Kallis's slow scoring was somewhat of a limitation but he was still a great batsman whereas Boycott's was actively detrimental to his team. Qualitative difference between the two. That said, scoring rate not mattering at all is an utterly nonsensical take.

Not saying Boycott is directly rated above Kallis as a bat. I just cringe that he is in danger of making a "modern" CW consensus team.

 

[BazBall21]

But there's no dual standard whereby Kallis gets penalised and Boycott doesn't though? I am one of Boycott's biggest detractors possibly and I would have Kallis top 15 as a batsman.

Because we're on openers, would you consider Gooch over Boycott due to these concerns? Or is Boycott's consistency enough here.

 

[PlayerComparisons]

Boycott seems to be rated a lot higher on CW than he is in the rest of the cricketing world

 

[shortpitched713]

Greenidge pulling away here, which I'm okay with. Just don't know why he doesn't draft well though...

 

[ma1978]

What test match win of significance has Boycott contributed to?

The other four have all been responsible for very meaningful victories

 

[BazBall21]

England won a series-levelling test at QPO in 1974. It's wicket that's supportive to spin and Boycott took Gibbs down in a tight low-scoring Test with scores of 99 and 112. If it wasn't for his 221 runs, England would have lost the series.

At the same ground, Boycott actually scored 80* in a successful day 5 run chase believe it or not after Sobers' generous declaration. He top-scored in the innings as England got home in the final over. This was a series-clinching effort.

When he scored his hundredth hundred in an Ashes test match back in 1977, England won and he was the only played that scored a hundred in the game.

His 142* at Sydney in the 70/71 Ashes shut the door on Australia and set the game up for John Snow to complete. England 1-0 up and went on to win the series.


Boycott has his problems thus I have switched to Greenidge here, but think to suggest he never contributed to meaningful victories is disingenuous.

 

[a massive zebra]

Boycott
Greenidge
Smith
Sehwag
Hayden