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Hanif Mohammad vs Vijay Hazare

Hanif Mohammad vs Vijay Hazare

  • Total voters
    19
capt_Luffy

capt_Luffy

Cricketer Of The Year
Best Asian 50s cricketer. I think they were pretty similar in quality and are both kinda underrated. Hanif has a legendary 337 in West Indies and has played almost twice as many matches as Hazare. He has a magnificent average against West Indies, but quite a glaring one against England. Hazare averages slightly more, and has one of the best performance by a batsman in a losing cause, when he scored 116 and 156 against Australia in the Adelaide test. He has a more balanced career, scoring runs in almost every country he played in but West Indies. Hazare was an useful medium pacer (has taken Don's wicket thrice) but nothing much to boast there while Hanif had played a single test as a designated keeper; but was replaced after that.
 
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P

Patience and Accuracy+Gut

State Vice-Captain
capt_Luffy said:
Best Asian 50s cricketer. I think they were pretty similar in quality and are both kinda underrated. Hanif has a legendary 337 in West Indies and has played almost twice as many matches as Hazare. He has a magnificent average against West Indies, but quite a glaring one against England. Hazare averages slightly more, and has one of the best performance by a batsman in a losing cause, when he scored 116 and 156 against Australia in the Adelaide test. He has a more balanced career, scoring runs in almost every country he played in but West Indies. Hazare was an useful medium pacer (has taken Don's wicket thrice) but nothing much to boast there while Hanif had played a single test as a designated keeper; but was replaced after that.
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Hazare got Bradman Twice in international and once in Tour Matches. Albeit two of them came in when Bradman had already done the damage, scoring 185 and 201. One of the dismissal came at 13 though which Hazare mentioned as his greatest cricketing accomplishment.

Hazare actually wanted to be a bowler before Grimmett transformed him to a batsman saying he would never do much as a bowler.
 
Coronis

Coronis

International Coach
Patience and Accuracy+Gut said:
Hazare got Bradman Twice in international and once in Tour Matches. Albeit two of them came in when Bradman had already done the damage, scoring 185 and 201. One of the dismissal came at 13 though which Hazare mentioned as his greatest cricketing accomplishment.

Hazare actually wanted to be a bowler before Grimmett transformed him to a batsman saying he would never do much as a bowler.
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Grum actually saving Bradman from more embarrassment despite him ending his test career. What a bloke.
 
P

peterhrt

U19 Captain
Before the county championship opened its doors to overseas players in the late 1960s, batsmen from the sub-continent were sometimes judged on how they handled unfamiliar conditions in England and, with far fewer opportunities, in Australia. First-class records below.

Hanif in England: 3749 runs @ 37.49. 8 hundreds. Includes matches for Rest of the World.
Hanif in Australia: 402 @ 134.00. 2 hundreds.

Hazare in England: 2546 @ 39.78. 4 hundreds. Includes matches for Commonwealth XI.
Hazare in Australia: 1056 @ 48.00. 4 hundreds.

In 1949 Hazare enjoyed a remarkable season for Rawtenstall in the Lancashire League, becoming one of only four men ever to complete the league double, while heading both batting and bowling averages by edging out Weekes and Dooland respectively.

Some other batsmen for comparison:

Merchant in England: 4130 @ 62.57. 10 hundreds. Highest average in England after Bradman and Headley, including English players.
Umrigar in England: 3514 @ 51.67. 10 hundreds.
Vijay Manjrekar in England: 1814 @ 47.73. 4 hundreds.

Saeed Ahmed in England: 2925 runs @ 32.50. 6 hundreds. Includes matches for MCC and Rest of the World.
Saeed Ahmed in Australia: 353 @ 50.42. 1 hundred.

Mankad in England: 1572 @ 31.44. 4 hundreds. Includes matches for Commonwealth XI.
Mankad in Australia: 889 @ 38.65. 3 hundreds.

Lala Amarnath in England: 1413 @ 27.70. 5 hundreds.
Lala Amarnath in Australia: 1162 @ 58.10. 5 hundreds.

All who played in both England and Australia averaged higher in Australia.

Alec Bedser reckoned Merchant was the best overseas batsman from anywhere on rain-damaged English pitches and a superior batsman overall to Gavaskar. He also said that Hanif's defensive technique was similar to Gavaskar's but more watertight.
 
M

ma1978

International Debutant
peterhrt said:
Before the county championship opened its doors to overseas players in the late 1960s, batsmen from the sub-continent were sometimes judged on how they handled unfamiliar conditions in England and, with far fewer opportunities, in Australia. First-class records below.

Hanif in England: 3749 runs @ 37.49. 8 hundreds. Includes matches for Rest of the World.
Hanif in Australia: 402 @ 134.00. 2 hundreds.

Hazare in England: 2546 @ 39.78. 4 hundreds. Includes matches for Commonwealth XI.
Hazare in Australia: 1056 @ 48.00. 4 hundreds.

In 1949 Hazare enjoyed a remarkable season for Rawtenstall in the Lancashire League, becoming one of only four men ever to complete the league double, while heading both batting and bowling averages by edging out Weekes and Dooland respectively.

Some other batsmen for comparison:

Merchant in England: 4130 @ 62.57. 10 hundreds. Highest average in England after Bradman and Headley, including English players.
Umrigar in England: 3514 @ 51.67. 10 hundreds.
Vijay Manjrekar in England: 1814 @ 47.73. 4 hundreds.

Saeed Ahmed in England: 2925 runs @ 32.50. 6 hundreds. Includes matches for MCC and Rest of the World.
Saeed Ahmed in Australia: 353 @ 50.42. 1 hundred.

Mankad in England: 1572 @ 31.44. 4 hundreds. Includes matches for Commonwealth XI.
Mankad in Australia: 889 @ 38.65. 3 hundreds.

Lala Amarnath in England: 1413 @ 27.70. 5 hundreds.
Lala Amarnath in Australia: 1162 @ 58.10. 5 hundreds.

All who played in both England and Australia averaged higher in Australia.

Alec Bedser reckoned Merchant was the best overseas batsman from anywhere on rain-damaged English pitches and a superior batsman overall to Gavaskar. He also said that Hanif's defensive technique was similar to Gavaskar's but more watertight.
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shows what a unique batsman Merchant was. Definitely warrants a place amongst the premodern greats. His career arc was uniquely affected by the war as well
 
P

peterhrt

U19 Captain
Merchant probably missed 3 Tests due to the war. They were scheduled during the winter of 1939-40. England picked a weak touring squad with only Bob Wyatt, age 39, having much Test experience. None of the team who played in the last home Test of 1939 were selected, nor anyone else likely to be needed in Australia the following winter.

The 1946 series in England would probably have been brought forward a couple of years. Pre-independence India only arranged international matches against England and Ceylon. Merchant missed the post-war series against Australia and West Indies through injury.

He actually scored more runs during the war in first-class cricket than anybody apart from rival Hazare: 3821 @ 141.81 with 16 centuries.

Indian players of this generation need to be judged on wider criteria than the occasional "official" Test matches available to them.
 
a massive zebra

a massive zebra

International Captain
Hanif's Test record in England is shocking. With the exception of one great innings, he made 399 runs @ 18.13 with one fifty in 22 innings. Hazare's record is much more well rounded.
 
Kenneth Viljoen

Kenneth Viljoen

International Regular
M

ma1978

International Debutant
Coronis said:
Yes but how was this “unique” the war affected many cricketers this way, e.g Nourse
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you like to specifically mince words and miss intent, I get it. It’s an online forum and people type fast. I’m sure there were others in the same boat but the point is the war was exactly during what would have been his statistically prime years
 
Coronis

Coronis

International Coach
ma1978 said:
you like to specifically mince words and miss intent, I get it. It’s an online forum and people type fast. I’m sure there were others in the same boat but the point is the war was exactly during what would have been his statistically prime years
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The intent from “uniquely affected” seemed pretty clear to me.

I’m not responsible if you post something you didn’t mean to, nor is it up to me to magically decipher your mistakes.
 
M

ma1978

International Debutant
Coronis said:
The intent from “uniquely affected” seemed pretty clear to me.

I’m not responsible if you post something you didn’t mean to, nor is it up to me to magically decipher your mistakes.
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its an online forum about cricket, you take this way too seriously
 
P

peterhrt

U19 Captain
a massive zebra said:
Hanif's Test record in England is shocking. With the exception of one great innings, he made 399 runs @ 18.13 with one fifty in 22 innings. Hazare's record is much more well rounded.
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A few batsmen with low Test averages in England during the 1950s and 1960s. Minimum 10 innings.

34 - Walcott
33 - Morris, Weekes
32 - McGlew
31 - Harvey
30 - Saeed Ahmed
29 - McLean, Waite
28 - Bill Edrich, Willie Watson
26 - Barber, Close, Congdon, Hanif Mohammad, Manjrekar
24 - Parks
23 - Trevor Goddard, Miller
22 - McDonald, Bert Sutcliffe
19 - Reid
18 - Knott, Umrigar
16 - Borde

Only two overseas batsmen averaged fifty. Eric Rowan (57) during one series in 1951 and leading run-scorer Sobers with 1514 @ 50.46.
 
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