England - A rabble?

[pasag]

Number of concerts in Australia - 4:
U2
Robbie Williams
Kylie
Elton John

Number of wins in Australia - 0

Coupled with the poor preparations, do England really have their priorities straight? Perhaps going to all these concerts has helped them reduce nerves and stress, but it certainly doesn't appear that way watching them play. Being a hard professional unit doesn't include going to see Elton John, perhaps this was the fundamental difference between the English team and Australian team who went on a military style boot camp in the lead up to the ashes. If this is Flintoff's style of captaincy, that they are a group of mates who hang out together at night with the plan that somehow it will translate into a team on the field, well, it's clearly not working and Brisbane and Adelaide showed us that.

Maybe I'm just angry at the low level of cricket England have brought to Australia this summer. This series has been the most eagerly anticipated ever in Australia and instead of rising to the challenge like the supposed 2nd best team they are, they have showed it serious disdain by having one of the worst preparations in recent memory and an even poorer showing once the series has started. Maybe I'm totally wrong and this is just a dire rant, but I think Australian fans, cricket fans and especially English fans have the right to be pissed of at the way the English team is being handled from top to bottom.

Thoughts?

 

[FaaipDeOiad]

Haha, that boot camp was even more stupid. Why does Stuart MacGill need to carry tanks of water through the desert? How about a net session instead?

England have had a pretty poor tour, but I don't think the preperation or anything is to blame. They've just been outclassed, and the loss of Simon Jones has hurt as it has exposed Harmison and Giles and removed the crucial ability to "hide" a bowler in the five man attack that England had last series. Australia on the other hand are playing with better discipline, the team has improved rather than gotten worse with the inclusion of Hussey and Clark and the improvement of Lee and Clarke, and they are in home conditions. Blaming going to concerts for England's poor performance is just as silly as blaming the selections or blaming Australia being too "friendly" last time.

 

[marc71178]

How exactly was the first 2 and a bit days of the 2nd Test a "poor showing"

If that Giles catch had been taken, then Australia 4 down for less than 100 whilst facing 551 isn't the worst position England have been in.

 

[Complicated]

Yeah I'd agree England made a better showing in the second test.

However there was an article I read somewhere, talking about all the social / public commitments Flintoff had, and how busy it was keeping him. Maybe you're right in that England have allowed to many distractions to get in the way of performing on the field.

I think it's more that there are some chronically out of form players, who have been given to many chances, which is really costing England.

 

[greg]

Ashley Giles said that his response to the first test defeat (and implicit preparation for the second) was to get himself rat-arsed.

He's also been to see Borat at least two times.

For all the talk of how wonderful Australia have been (and their general approach, preparation and attitude has been world class), the fact is that they were there for the taking. Half their batting line-up are severely stuttering, and with better application from the England batsmen their bowling could have been labouring as well. Most of England's problems are clearly those of their own making.

 

[greg]

Yeah I'd agree England made a better showing in the second test.

However there was an article I read somewhere, talking about all the social / public commitments Flintoff had, and how busy it was keeping him. Maybe you're right in that England have allowed to many distractions to get in the way of performing on the field.

I think it's more that there are some chronically out of form players, who have been given to many chances, which is really costing England.

Damned right. For Christ's sake he even had to go to a couple of evening functions for his benefit year!!!

 

[Jono]

I don't think its got too much to do with it, but those a few too many concerts for my liking. Reminds me a little of the Saints in the AFL going for a movie together (I think it was The Day After Tomorrow) in 2004 instead of training after they had won 10 games on the trot or something. They proceeded to lose the next week, and only won like 50-60% of the rest of their games.

 

[vic_orthdox]

Nah, no big deal. When on tour, you have so much spare time. If they weren't at a concert, they'd probably just be stuffing around till late at the hotel anyways.

 

[howardj]

What a silly beat-up.

If they'd been winning, people would say "the concerts have been really relaxing for the lads, it's taken the pressure off them and allowed them to unwind."

People just twist things to suit their own agenda.

 

[pasag]

People just twist things to suit their own agenda.

And what agenda would that be?

 

[PY]

And what agenda would that be?

Pom-bashing?

 

[howardj]

And what agenda would that be?

Don't take that personally.

Was just a general comment.

I'm just saying, England are 2-0 down, so it's fashionable to beat up on them and cast around for something to tonk them over the head with.

 

[pasag]

Haha, not pom bashing at all. I feel sorry for all the poms on this board and if I wanted I'd rub things in a fair bit, but I don't think you all deserve it (despite the gloating for the past year and a half).

Although I wrote the first post not totally believing it myself (just wanted to start some discussion), it has grown on me. Australia won both tests because they totally outplayed and outclassed to opposition. Not to take away anything from the Australia, but it has been clear from day one that England’s preparation has been sub-standard. The talent and class of a side can only get you so far, but it's the work and effort that get you through the pressure situations, IE day one at Brisbane and day five at Adelaide. The work (mentally and physically) wasn’t put in and England came unstuck in those two vital situations. As a result they have lost the Ashes (probably).

Now only an idiot would say that going to concerts has caused England to lose the Ashes, that's not what I'm saying. What I'm talking about a general mindset that going to a concert is a by-product of. I'm sure there are plenty of other signs as well, but one thing is clear, the fire and passion to beat Australia at all costs that was evident in '05 is gone this series, replaced with a side that celebrates perhaps their greatest ever loss with a Robbie Williams concert just hours later.

Again it's not the concerts that concern me and perhaps I'm abit upset about going to the MCG for a dead rubber, but it's just a general mentality of the England camp that needs to be looked at, imo.

 

[Matt79]

How exactly was the first 2 and a bit days of the 2nd Test a "poor showing"

If that Giles catch had been taken, then Australia 4 down for less than 100 whilst facing 551 isn't the worst position England have been in.

The good work put in and credibility gained by the English team in the first half of that test has rightfully in my view been voided by the pathetic capitulation on the fifth day. I don't think it would do the English team any good to dwell on the fact that "oh well, we were competitive for a couple of days" school of thought either - it's a bit too close to the "we aim to be competitive" statements of the Atherton/Hussain years. The team in England last year wasn't aiming to be competitive. They weren't playing hoping for a win either. They went out there, having planned to win, and TOOK the wins. They were a seasoned outfit, having played and won a lot of tests as a cohesive unit, who had a clear goal in mind. This current team doesn't appear to be any of those things.

They should, by all means, focus on what they did well in Adelaide, and consider how they can apply those successes for the rest of the tour, and let it flow into a confidence in their own games, but they certainly shouldn't derive any satisfaction or comfort from one of the worst test match defeats in recent memory.

It might be bashing them while they're down, or casting around for popcorn psychology theories, but the fact is England is too good a team to have lost the two matches thus far in the manner they have. It may well have more to do with individual absences or form than any team zeitgeist, but maybe one flows from the other to a degree as well.

 

[greg]

It might be bashing them while they're down, or casting around for popcorn psychology theories, but the fact is England is too good a team to have lost the two matches thus far in the manner they have. It may well have more to do with individual absences or form than any team zeitgeist, but maybe one flows from the other to a degree as well.

Well quite, although frankly it's debateable whether this England team (with allowances made for fitness) is "too good..."

I'm still shaking my head in disbelief, and have been for weeks, that England have managed to take the side from last summer that beat Pakistan, add Flintoff to it, and weaken it in every basic area of the game - captaincy, batting, team morale and cohesion, and, IMO (because some will point to Harmison's poor form as the decisive factor) bowling.

Whereas bringing in Flintoff for Mahmood, should have strengthened us significantly, in both batting and bowling.

 

[Mr Mxyzptlk]

and the improvement of Lee and Clarke

Not sure exactly how much of a benefit Brett Lee has been to Australia in this Ashes series to date. He may have bowled effectively over the past year, but he certainly isn't doing the same in this series. Average of 64.60 with best match figures of 3-174?

 

[FaaipDeOiad]

Not sure exactly how much of a benefit Brett Lee has been to Australia in this Ashes series to date. He may have bowled effectively over the past year, but he certainly isn't doing the same in this series. Average of 64.60 with best match figures of 3-174?

Not saying he's had a good series, merely that the team is stronger with him post-2005 Ashes than pre-2005 Ashes, which is what I meant. The Australian team is better today than it was 18 months ago, whereas you can't say that about England.

Incidentally, Lee had a hand in the second test win and bowled pretty well in the second innings, so he's not been an abject failure. Needs to bowl well more than one innings out of four, though.

 

[Langeveldt]

I don't think the preparation has been to blame, England just aren't nearly as good as aus and 2nd place in the world flatters them without players like Vaughan and Simon Jones..

 

[The Baconator]

If they have to to concerts, couldn't they go to better ones?

 

[cover drive man]

I don't think the preparation has been to blame, England just aren't nearly as good as aus and 2nd place in the world flatters them without players like Vaughan and Simon Jones..

I agree, also Monty should be playing Giles can only get a couple of wickets every couple of matches Monty seems more bowling consistent (He's a rubish batter and fielder though.) but he can take wickets.