Changes required for the Indian odi side

[Pratters]

I have been thinking about this or quite a while. Most Indian batsmen are above 30 and will be older in two years. Ganguly, Laxman, Dravid and Tendulkar that is. If whole some changes are made just before the World Cup, it would be too late.

If India want to stand of having a chance in the cup, they need to find younger players wihout running the risk of old junkies in 2007. S. Waugh was dropped before 2003, Taylor (never a great odi player) before 1999.

Australia moved from Bevan precisely for this reason. India have removed Laxman but I doubt he will not make the team when its announced next time as the official statement is that he is rested.

And when the team does try new players and lose, why are they scared to persist with the younger or newer lot? I ound it baffling that India had to play their supposedly 'best' side in the last match vs Bangladesh. No player will make the cut if there is no confidence in the newer players shown for a long time. Why does AA get recalled EVER?

What are the changes required in the Indian ODI side?

IMO Ganguly, Laxman should be removed from the side while Dravid and Tendulkar should stay on till 2007 for experience.

Possible Indian XI

Sehwag
Tendulkar
Dravid
Yuvraj
Kaif
Another player to be found before the World Cup (maybe Mongia, Sriram but not sure)
Dhoni/Katrhik/Any other keeper
Pathan
Kumble (for experience)
Karthik/Bhajji
Another faster bowler to be found before the world cup

So there are possibly three players to be found in two years. Changes wouldnt be too radical at this stage. At a later time, it would be too late.

 

[Richard]

If you'd really prefer Mongia or Sriram to Ganguly then sorry, you've lost it!
How many times must Mongia be shown-up as woefully substandard at ODI-level before he gets discarded for good? Why does he keep on getting recalled?
Unless there is someone obvious, meanwhile, you can't just say "someone needs to be found" - you can say that about any spot any time. "If we had four bowlers better than Murali we'd not pick Murali".
You can pick only what is available. As long as Balaji, Pathan, Khan and Nehra are the best India have there's not much you can do about it.
I read a good article on Kumble in ODIs recently, too - can he ever return to these glory-days? There are valid things to suggest not.
Brilliant as he used to be, there's no disputing that this is not a good record at all, and it's over quite some time now.

 

[Pratters]

If you'd really prefer Mongia or Sriram to Ganguly then sorry, you've lost it!
How many times must Mongia be shown-up as woefully substandard at ODI-level before he gets discarded for good? Why does he keep on getting recalled?
Unless there is someone obvious, meanwhile, you can't just say "someone needs to be found" - you can say that about any spot any time. "If we had four bowlers better than Murali we'd not pick Murali".
You can pick only what is available. As long as Balaji, Pathan, Khan and Nehra are the best India have there's not much you can do about it.

Sriram and Mongia v/s Mongia is not some thing I am considering. Its who should comprise the side in 2007.

Bevan was not totally over the hill when he was dropped. Australia have considered how they want their side to be in 2007 and accordingly made changes. Also dropping Harvey in the same spirit though he doesnt compare with Bevan.

If you dont try out players who are promising, you will never find players for 2007. Ganguly has been struggling and Laxman has thrown his wicket on a lot of occasions. You need to make some brave changes to a side at some point of time. I believe its the right time for India right now with two years to go before the World Cup to make some changes.

Pakistan I believe has a good chance in 2007 though they wouldnt win the cup if its played right now because changes have been made in their side. Plainning with 2007 in mind has to be made for the one day teams. Else the players playing then wont have adequate experience.

 

[Richard]

Harvey was dropped because he's never been an ODI-standard player and really has done very little in his ODI-career of a number of years. One of the most overrated bowlers - especially over here - I've ever seen.
I'm not saying Ganguly hasn't been struggling - I'm just saying that if you drop him, you do not replace him with Sriram or Mongia.
If someone's promising enough, he'll make himself un-ignorable before too long. But anyone thinking Ganguly won't be around in 2007 is a little delusional IMO - he's proven class in ODIs and has done it all time and again.
Pakistan's ODI side is better than it was maybe 6 months ago (Salman Butt and Shoaib Malik finally getting picked in the right positions has been one of the main contributions) but we all know with Pakistan that 2 years is one hell of a long time. Anything, absolutely anything, can happen in 2 years. The side could quite conceivably be almost totally different.

 

[cricket player]

I would pick mongia over sirram(spelling)because mongia has done a great job in domestic level and he also did well in county level strike rate around %80s average of 40%.he surely deserves a place in the indian batting line up.In world cup be batted at number 6 that is a awful position for any batsman and i thought he did well at that position.

 

[Richard]

No, he does not deserve a place in the Indian team.
Yes, he's better than Sriram, but he's been given chance after chance in ODIs and failed time after time.
He's had far too many chances already.

 

[Arjun]

Don't we already have another thread with a similar name? This is the third of the series!

India have removed Laxman but I doubt he will not make the team when its announced next time as the official statement is that he is rested.

They have dropped the axe on their own feet. Nobody, absolutely nobody who has played ODI cricket regularly for India comes close to Laxman when it comes to skills. He also has very good cricketing intelligence, which is badly needed in the team. In fact, he should be the captain of the side.

Why does AA get recalled EVER?

They just like their has-beens a little too much.

And when the team does try new players and lose, why are they scared to persist with the younger or newer lot?

How often, when young players should get an opportunity, these players found wanting get another chance? VVS Laxman was found wanting when the World Cup side was picked, but he gets a spot in the A-team! Same with SS Das.

IMO Ganguly, Laxman should be removed from the side while Dravid and Tendulkar should stay on till 2007 for experience.

You are one of a kind, if some of the e-mails from your city on Fair & Lovely Fourth Umpire as well as ESPN's StreetTalk are to be believed.

Possible Indian XI

There must be regularity in bowling options. That four-man combination must be replaced by one bowler among them for every match, and that should be Sehwag, given how he bats.

There is nothing wrong in picking players over 25, as long as they're not coming close to 40. Andy Caddick performed well in the World Cup despite his age. You can pick a batting all-rounder such as Jai Prakash Yadav as a sixth bowling option, to cut out overs from less penetrative bowlers- Paksitan often go in with six bowling options. The younger Reetinder Sodhi and Sunny Singh may be tried out, once they finish a full season of domestic cricket. Otherwise, you can try one of many specialist batsmen, but that player has to be a very good fielder and runner between wickets- that's what counts in ODI's.

No point trying Bhajji or Karthik. The left-arm spinner no-balls FAR too often. Bhajji has only had one 5-wicket haul in the ODI's he has played, and he bowls too defensively when runs are scored off him quickly. Ramesh Powar, on the other hand, makes the batsman play, varies his pace and tries harder to take wickets. He's not the most talented spinner, but he's good as a support act for Kumble and he can score lots of runs.

Joginder Sharma must finish the Ranji season with his team and take them to victory, then perform in the Duleep, Deodhar and Challenger series. He's in good form as a seam bowler, but ODI's are never easy for seamers to make their debut, which is why he must play more FC cricket. He can hit the ball hard, and he is an intelligent batsman, which gives him an advantage over a certain L Balaji.

Another faster bowler to be found before the world cup

Let him be a REALLY fast one. How fast is Ranadeb Bose? Cricinfo lists him as RFM. Swapnil Hazare from Mumbai is another RFM, but a rookie journalist told me he's not that fast. Then again, everyone knows how accurate their classifications are- Vasbert Drakes is still Right Arm Fast.

 

[Arjun]

No, he does not deserve a place in the Indian team.
Yes, he's better than Sriram, but he's been given chance after chance in ODIs and failed time after time.
He's had far too many chances already.

You're absoutely right there. He's a terrible choice in limited-overs matches. Batsmen from top teams look for singles and run them at every opportunity. He just taps the ball, waits and watches, then walks if there is any need. This is why he's a weak link in the ODI side.

About Sriram, he's not as good in the first 15 overs as in the middle overs. He just taps the ball and runs, plays the odd defensive shot and then improvises at some stage in his innings. That mix-up was needless, but he's not a bad choice in ODI's, and one of India's best ODI batsmen of all tiem would agree. Sachin Tendulkar won the Man of the Match award in the Challenger final in 2003, but he shared it with Sriram because of that intelligent innings he played in the middle overs, which went on to the final 5.

he also did well in county level strike rate around %80s average of 40%.

The grounds must have been as small as Taunton's, and the field placings, not the best. He'd struggle to score runs in MCG.

 

[amit_s]

a few changes -

get in gambhir
tendulkar should stay only if he scores quickly at over 90 strike rate. not at 74 he has shown after the 2003 wc.
yuvraj needs to play some domestic cricket
ganguly should be dropped and sehwag/dravid be captain
a regular wicket-keeper dhoni needed in odis and dinesh kartik in tests
a all-rounder like ramesh powar needed

team should look like -

sehwag (c)
gambhir
dravid
tendulkar - if only he scores QUICKLY
kaif
yuvraj
dhoni (w)
powar
pathan
harbhajan
zaheer

 

[marc71178]

I can't believe anyone is criticising SRT and suggesting he's dropped.

 

[Richard]

I can believe the first and not the second.

 

[Pratters]

I cant refute or debate with any one right now because I have exams on the 1st and 8th. Would like to speak on things written by Richard, Arjun. Apologies for not being able to till 8th..

 

[sledger]

i think the exclusion of ganguly is ridiculous for a start.

personally i dont rate yuvraj although i think kaif may well have matured into a very decent player by the time the world cup comes around.

personally i dont think a lot will differ between he batting line up now and that in 2007 unless some sort of prodigy is found,

it would seem to me that it is the bowlers that india really need to concentrate on getting through, laksmipathy balaji i believe has genuine talent as does irfan pathan, kumble and harbijhan would suffice th spin attck but out in the west indies india will need another seamer, agarkar and nehra are not upto the job of world class pacemen. if india are to achieve sucess they need to find a new young pace bowler who can really attack batsmen and take wickets.

 

[Richard]

Do not fall for the misguided notion that West Indian wickets offer help to seamers.

 

[sledger]

i'm not,

but realistically they offer more to seamers than to spinners. and besides that is irrelevant regardless if they did or did not, india require a world class seamer which they currently lack.

 

[Richard]

And have always lacked since about 1950 - even the best (Kapil Dev and Srinath) have ended with moderate records.
More West Indian wickets offer turn than seam-movement.

 

[Pratters]

I do not think Ganguly cannot make the Indian side right now. But oul he the best option as a batsman two years down the line? Laxman is a talented player but has he shown any level of discipline by throwin ghis wicket so easily in so many matches over the years?

Its two years to go for the World Cup and atleast one of these two players has to be replaced and other players have to be tried to find the right players for the team by 2007.

Many teams have found their teams to be too old in a specific cup in the name of experience and struggled. Pakistan 1996 is the best example. Most teams bar the top notch teams who were easily the best team in the tournament like Australia in 2003, Windies in 1979 and Sri Lanka in 1996, have had young teams. Its time some chopping is done and the best ompbination keeping 2007 in mind is worked upon right from now.

 

[Richard]

You can't look at that and say they've all been successful with young teams.
The best bet - by far - is to pick the best side full-stop.

 

[Pratters]

You can't look at that and say they've all been successful with young teams.
The best bet - by far - is to pick the best side full-stop.

I would say the best bet is to pick a side which is likely to perform the best in 2007.

 

[Arjun]

Laxman is a talented player but has he shown any level of discipline by throwin ghis wicket so easily in so many matches over the years?

What have the lesser ODI specialists done to be let off the hook? Dinesh Mongia, for instance, has just 4 scores of over 50. Laxman as 6 scores of over 100, one more than that of all the ODI regulars pt together. When he gets a start, he usually makes a big score. In fact, this year, he has been the team's best ODI batsman, averaging over 40, with 4 100's. To add, he is a terrific slip-fielder, while Dinesh is an average outfielder.

Its time some chopping is done and the best ompbination keeping 2007 in mind is worked upon right from now.

How about a change in strategies as well? Player positions must be optimised.