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Curtly Ambrose vs Sunil Gavaskar

Curtly Ambrose vs Sunil Gavaskar

  • Total voters
    23
OverratedSanity

OverratedSanity

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kyear2 said:
Curly Ambrose.

He's a top 5 fast bowler.

Sunny us a top 10, 11 batsman.
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No need to just limit it to fast bowlers imo. Overall as a bowler, I'd put Ambrose around 8-9. About the same as Gavaskar who for me is around 10 as a batsman (and that's because Bradman exists).

If Ambrose is a top 5 fast bowler, I'd say Gavaskar is a top 3 opener. Find the latter more impressive personally because it's a more difficult job.
 
DrWolverine

DrWolverine

International Debutant
kyear2 said:
Curly Ambrose.He's a top 5 fast bowler.

Sunny us a top 10, 11 batsman.
Click to expand...

Sunny is up against Jack Hobbs who made his debut in 1908, Wally Hammond who made his debut in 1927 and Len Hutton who debuted in 1937.

When people talk about greatest bowlers, the list of bowlers usually start from 1970 onwards. We don’t talk about Spofforth or Lohmann who played in 1880s, Charlie Turner who played in 1890s, Sydney Barnes who played in 1900s or Bill OReilly who played in 1930s.
 
Johan

Johan

International Captain
DrWolverine said:
When people talk about greatest bowlers, the list of bowlers usually start from 1970 onwards. We don’t talk about Spofforth or Lohmann who played in 1880s, Charlie Turner who played in 1890s, Sydney Barnes who played in 1900s or Bill OReilly who played in 1930s.
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actually the last two are often mentioned
 
sayon basak

sayon basak

Cricketer Of The Year
DrWolverine said:
Sunny is up against Jack Hobbs who made his debut in 1908, Wally Hammond who made his debut in 1927 and Len Hutton who debuted in 1937.

When people talk about greatest bowlers, the list of bowlers usually start from 1970 onwards. We don’t talk about Spofforth or Lohmann who played in 1880s, Charlie Turner who played in 1890s, Sydney Barnes who played in 1900s or Bill OReilly who played in 1930s.
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Barnes and O'Reilly are definitely top 10 bowlers, and should be mentioned in the conversation.
 
kyear2

kyear2

International Coach
OverratedSanity said:
No need to just limit it to fast bowlers imo. Overall as a bowler, I'd put Ambrose around 8-9. About the same as Gavaskar who for me is around 10 as a batsman (and that's because Bradman exists).

If Ambrose is a top 5 fast bowler, I'd say Gavaskar is a top 3 opener. Find the latter more impressive personally because it's a more difficult job.
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So you rate Warne, Murali and O'Reilly above Ambrose. Fine I guess.

I vary if I rank Ambrose and Steyn above or below the two spinners and the last time I just split the difference. I rank O'Reilly just behind.

At best that places him 4/5, at worst 7.

Sunny I rank 4th among openers, but to be fair, since from before the 2nd WW it's a position that the best batsmen gravitate away from and we've had a paucity of great openers.

The ranking for great fast bowlers is far more competitive and hence to achieve a top 5 ranking is far more difficult and impressive, wouldn't you say?
 
Johan

Johan

International Captain
Marshall. McGrath. Hadlee. Barnes. Steyn/Ambrose. Steyn/Ambrose. Warne. Murali. O Reilly. Imran.

my current top 10 in order
 
kyear2

kyear2

International Coach
DrWolverine said:
Sunny is up against Jack Hobbs who made his debut in 1908, Wally Hammond who made his debut in 1927 and Len Hutton who debuted in 1937.

When people talk about greatest bowlers, the list of bowlers usually start from 1970 onwards. We don’t talk about Spofforth or Lohmann who played in 1880s, Charlie Turner who played in 1890s, Sydney Barnes who played in 1900s or Bill OReilly who played in 1930s.
Click to expand...
We do include O'Reilly who I have borderline if not in the top 10. We also include Lindwall and Trueman in said conversations, so we are going back to the 30's with Tiger and to the 40's with Lindwall and 50's with Trueman and the 60's with Davidson.

So I'll respectfully disagree with you on this one.
 
subshakerz

subshakerz

Hall of Fame Member
kyear2 said:
So you rate Warne, Murali and O'Reilly above Ambrose. Fine I guess.

I vary if I rank Ambrose and Steyn above or below the two spinners and the last time I just split the difference. I rank O'Reilly just behind.
Click to expand...
Ambrose above Warne and Murali makes no sense to me now honestly.
 
OverratedSanity

OverratedSanity

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kyear2 said:
So you rate Warne, Murali and O'Reilly above Ambrose. Fine I guess.

I vary if I rank Ambrose and Steyn above or below the two spinners and the last time I just split the difference. I rank O'Reilly just behind.

At best that places him 4/5, at worst 7.
Click to expand...
I have Warne, Murali, Marshall, McGrath, Hadlee, Steyn, Imran above Ambrose.

Sunny I rank 4th among openers, but to be fair, since from before the 2nd WW it's a position that the best batsmen gravitate away from and we've had a paucity of great openers.
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That just makes it more impressive that doesn't it. He's the best player at his position over the last 70 years of the sport imo.
 
kyear2

kyear2

International Coach
Johan said:
Marshall. McGrath. Hadlee. Barnes. Steyn/Ambrose. Steyn/Ambrose. Warne. Murali. O Reilly. Imran.

my current top 10 in order
Click to expand...
Not mine, but fair enough.

I'm working on my new order and Tiger is higher.

I do struggle with if Steyn / Ambrose are above or below the spinners. They're just so much less conditions dependent and more efficient and destructive. Especially of the top order.
 
subshakerz

subshakerz

Hall of Fame Member
kyear2 said:
I do struggle with if Steyn / Ambrose are above or below the spinners. They're just so much less conditions dependent and more efficient and destructive. Especially of the top order.
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How is Ambrose much less condition dependent than Murali or Warne exactly? Pretty much untested in Ind and SL and mixed bag in Pakistan.

36 wickets in 12 tests outside Au,s, Eng and WI.
 
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