Southgate resigns

[Ali TT]

Not unexpected. Sport is mostly a results business and that goes both for and against in terms of the evaluation of his tenure. He goes having ultimately failed to secure a trophy while at the same time having a tournament record that far exceeds any prior England manager and, tbh, most international ones.

What may get lost over time is how he changed the culture in the English set up and made the side likeable.

 

[Molehill]

What may get lost over time is how he changed the culture in the English set up and made the side likeable.

That's the key bit to me. He took over when we'd been beaten by Iceland in 2016 and then the Allardyce fiasco....we were at rock bottom. He may have had some favourable draws along the way, but he largely made the most of them. No doubt he's been blessed to get the role at the same time as the most talented bunch of English football players in a generation (perhaps since '66) rocked up. But the environment he's created has allowed talented players to excel. That we went into this tournament as favourites (and not stupidly so) was quite the progression.

He leaves the role in a great place for someone with hopefully a more strategic mind to take over....

 

[sledger]

He's a nice man. I hope he ends up managing Man Utd.

 

[Uppercut]

Results are a bit deceiving I think. He did a reasonably good job for his first 3 tournaments, but a very poor one for his last. Should be looked back on as one of the better England managers, but it was definitely time to go.

 

[flibbertyjibber]

God knows who we get in but Potter is bookies favourite with Carsley and Howe just behind

 

[Jumno]

Hopefully someone strategically better can take over.

No doubt he has created a great atmosphere and genuinely a nice man. He has progressed like no other England manager.

 

[Red_Ink_Squid]

At the weekend I was helping clear out my parents' garage and found an autographed photo of Southgate from his Villa days I got as a kid. Nice guy.

Agree with the collective take above, think he's done a very good job and by England manager standards probably a great one. But he was better as the guy to inherit the team in a state and turn it around than as the guy to get the best out of the current, talented crop. So I'm glad he's standing down, but thanks for some great memories.

 

[social]

KP will never win a popularity contest

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1813157147502374991

 

[Furball]

The 'favourable draws' thing is such a weird stick to beat Southgate with.

In the decade prior to Southgate's first tournament, England had the following 'favourable draws':

Euro 2008: DNQ because England couldn't beat Macedonia at home or Israel away.

World Cup 2010: couldn't win a group with USA, Algeria and Slovenia in it because of a failure to beat the former 2 nations. Ended up with a last 16 tie against Germany rather than Ghana as a result.

Euro 2012: to be fair, can't knock this one. Won their group which had France in it, then lost to Italy in the quarters on penalties.

World Cup 2014: couldn't win a game in a group with Costa Rica in it.

Euro 2016: couldn't beat Slovakia or Russia to win the group then lost to Iceland.

 

[Furball]

I'd actually forgotten how genuinely rubbish the decade between Sven going and Southgate taking charge was.

2014 and 2016 in particular are results I'd be raging about Scotland getting (if we were good enough to qualify in the first place.)

 

[Molehill]

I'd actually forgotten how genuinely rubbish the decade between Sven going and Southgate taking charge was.

2014 and 2016 in particular are results I'd be raging about Scotland getting (if we were good enough to qualify in the first place.)

It's worth looking at that 2016 team that Southgate inherited. The team that lost to Iceland included Danny Rose at left back, Cahill and Smalling in the centre, a midfield of Alli, Dier and Rooney (no really), with Sturridge one of the top 3. It's no surprise we were shite then and had been for close on a decade. Only Walker, Kane and Sterling from that team would go on to have decent careers under Southgate, the rest largely discarded for any number of reasons. You could give that team any kind of draw you wanted, it just wasn't very good.

But there's no doubt for the last 6 years we've started to see some real talent come through, from the moment Foden led the U17's to that World Cup you knew things were likely to change. Southgate has nurtured it well without ever quite getting the max, hopefully his successor will.

 

[Ali TT]

The 'favourable draws' thing is such a weird stick to beat Southgate with.

In the decade prior to Southgate's first tournament, England had the following 'favourable draws':

Euro 2008: DNQ because England couldn't beat Macedonia at home or Israel away.

World Cup 2010: couldn't win a group with USA, Algeria and Slovenia in it because of a failure to beat the former 2 nations. Ended up with a last 16 tie against Germany rather than Ghana as a result.

Euro 2012: to be fair, can't knock this one. Won their group which had France in it, then lost to Italy in the quarters on penalties.

World Cup 2014: couldn't win a game in a group with Costa Rica in it.

Euro 2016: couldn't beat Slovakia or Russia to win the group then lost to Iceland.

Can go further back than that too.

2006 with a very strong squad we limped through a rubbish group and Ecuador before barely putting up a shot at goal against Portugal and losing on penalties. That was a really strong squad too that hugely under-performed.

2002 - beat the Argies but couldn't beat Sweden or Nigeria. Winning one of those and we'd have had Senegal then Turkey in the next 2 rounds and faced Brazil in the SF not the QF and in the evening humidity rather than the baking day time heat.

1998 - lost to a good but beatable Romania. In fact a draw would've seen us avoid Argentina in R2. Still, we'd have faced Croatia, who were ace, but a game we'd have fancied and after that a rubbish German side, so who knows?

 

[Pothas]

I'd actually forgotten how genuinely rubbish the decade between Sven going and Southgate taking charge was.

2014 and 2016 in particular are results I'd be raging about Scotland getting (if we were good enough to qualify in the first place.)

Yeah they were easily the worst times I can remember from England. The players were just nowhere near as good as what came before after.

 

[Uppercut]

They had some decent pieces in 2014, particularly the core of the Rodgers Liverpool side minus Suarez. I get that that’s not exactly a small difference, but they had enough to be a bit better (and a lot more fun) than they were. Shoehorning Rooney in really held them back.

 

[BoyBrumby]

Klopp or Poch, please.

Think Southgate will be fondly remembered when the dust settles; saw a stat today that he's won 9 KO games in four tournaments; for perspective between 68-16 we won six in total.

 

[Uppercut]

It’s tough to take over a team that’s just had a run of terrible performances but good results. Whoever steps in will take the blame for a decline in results that would have happened anyway.

 

[Silver Silva]

I think Southgate can be proud of his work, the second greatest England manager of all time.

 

[Silver Silva]

Klopp or Poch, please.

Think Southgate will be fondly remembered when the dust settles; saw a stat today that he's won 9 KO games in four tournaments; for perspective between 68-16 we won six in total.

He created a club atmosphere in the national team

 

[wpdavid]

KP will never win a popularity contest

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1813157147502374991

Nor an IQ contest.

 

[Molehill]

It’s tough to take over a team that’s just had a run of terrible performances but good results. Whoever steps in will take the blame for a decline in results that would have happened anyway.

I'm not sure results will necessarily decline. There's a strong nucleus of players under 24 - Foden, Bellingham, Saka, Gueye, Palmer, Wharton etc, not to mention the U21 team that recently won the Euros.