Sachin Tendulkar vs Malcolm Marshall

[h_hurricane]

In Richie Benaud’s Greatest XI he doesn’t even include Marshall as a contender for Fast Bowling don’t know why.

Benaud had a scuffle with @kyear2 back in the 80s. Kyear wanted all the 9 fielders placed in the cordon on a specific occasion. Benaud vehemently disagreed and thought it was against the spirit of the game.

 

[kyear2]

Benaud had a scuffle with @kyear2 back in the 80s. Kyear wanted all the 9 fielders placed in the cordon on a specific occasion. Benaud vehemently disagreed and thought it was against the spirit of the game.

It wasn't pretty.

 

[Coronis]

I think this thread has shown why rating players out of 100 is an idiotic measure…

 

[subshakerz]

I think this thread has shown why rating players out of 100 is an idiotic measure…

Nah. I think it gets to the heart of how we as individual posters measure.

 

[Slifer]

Marshall. There was a stretch where MM took something like 20 plus wickets in 7 straight series. The 8th, a 3 test series in Pakistan he took 16 at 16 on the same wickets Lillee cried over. Impactful series check, great average, sr, wpm and consistency across teams especially in Asia: check. And this inspite of having ridiculous competition for wickets and having to force himself into the WI team.

Sachin has longevity but in terms of being great vs the best he faced, I already showed numerous times how he struggled vs Donald, the Ws and McWarne. He did well vs Steyn that's it. He had an amazing peak but none of that included really hammering any of the great attacks of the 90s over the course of a series.

 

[CricketFan90s]

Marshall. There was a stretch where MM took something like 20 plus wickets in 7 straight series. The 8th, a 3 test series in Pakistan he took 16 at 16 on the same wickets Lillee cried over. Impactful series check, great average, sr, wpm and consistency across teams especially in Asia: check. And this inspite of having ridiculous competition for wickets and having to force himself into the WI team.

Sachin has longevity but in terms of being great vs the best he faced, I already showed numerous times how he struggled vs Donald, the Ws and McWarne. He did well vs Steyn that's it. He had an amazing peak but none of that included really hammering any of the great attacks of the 90s over the course of a series.

you missed a point Sachin was the only player to score 2 centuries in Cape Town facing the likes of 90s Donald, 90s Pollock and 2010s Dale Steyn.

 

[Slifer]

you missed a point Sachin was the only player to score 2 centuries in Cape Town facing the likes of 90s Donald, 90s Pollock and 2010s Dale Steyn.

How much did he average over 4 series (2 at home 2 away) vs Donald? 30 odd. That's not good enough. And I already acknowledged that he did well vs Steyn.

 

[Sunil1z]

How much did he average over 4 series (2 at home 2 away) vs Donald? 30 odd. That's not good enough. And I already acknowledged that he did well vs Steyn.

I will ask this question in reverse , exactly which ATG batsmen did Marshall trouble?
Sunny averaged 50 vs him despite being an opener, never bowled to Viv , never bowled to Greg Chappell ( or did he ? ) . So which great batsman did he master exactly?

 

[kyear2]

I think this thread has shown why rating players out of 100 is an idiotic measure…

It really is.

 

[HouHsiaoHsien]

Marshall. There was a stretch where MM took something like 20 plus wickets in 7 straight series. The 8th, a 3 test series in Pakistan he took 16 at 16 on the same wickets Lillee cried over. Impactful series check, great average, sr, wpm and consistency across teams especially in Asia: check. And this inspite of having ridiculous competition for wickets and having to force himself into the WI team.

Sachin has longevity but in terms of being great vs the best he faced, I already showed numerous times how he struggled vs Donald, the Ws and McWarne. He did well vs Steyn that's it. He had an amazing peak but none of that included really hammering any of the great attacks of the 90s over the course of a series.

agree with first part completely

 

[CricketFan90s]

How much did he average over 4 series (2 at home 2 away) vs Donald? 30 odd. That's not good enough. And I already acknowledged that he did well vs Steyn.

In 90s Sachin scored 443 Runs in 12 Innings and Lara scored 310 runs in 10 Innings - In South African Green Pitches. Its tougher for an Asian player to adjust to South African pitches as they are naturally habituated to playing on pitches with low bounce and less Swing. But Sachin could adept well due to Superior Batting Technique to South African conditions better than many other Non Asian Players including Lara.

 

[Slifer]

I will ask this question in reverse , exactly which ATG batsmen did Marshall trouble?
Sunny averaged 50 vs him despite being an opener, never bowled to Viv , never bowled to Greg Chappell ( or did he ? ) . So which great batsman did he master exactly?

Gavaskar, Border and not atg but the best from Eng Gooch. You say Gavaskar averaged 50 but you very well know that was mainly down to the Marshall debut series in '78. Still none of this changes the fact that Marshall was the excellence of execution (love Brett hart) vs all.

Fwiw, rating Sachin above Marshall is fine and all I just happen to disagree.

 

[kyear2]

I will ask this question in reverse , exactly which ATG batsmen did Marshall trouble?
Sunny averaged 50 vs him despite being an opener, never bowled to Viv , never bowled to Greg Chappell ( or did he ? ) . So which great batsman did he master exactly?

That 50 average was greatly inflated by the first series, feel free to look it up.

He got Gooch, Sunny, Border, Miandad, Gower etc. You can take a look at batsmen he dismissed the most.

 

[kyear2]

I really need to read through before I respond sometimes @Slifer

 

[Slifer]

In 90s Sachin scored 443 Runs in 12 Innings and Lara scored 310 runs in 10 Innings - In South African Green Pitches. Its tougher for an Asian player to adjust to South African pitches as they are naturally habituated to playing on pitches with low bounce and less Swing. But Sachin could adept well due to Superior Batting Technique to South African conditions better than many other Non Asian Players including Lara.

Sachin struggled at home vs Donald and co as well. And who even mentioned Lara. Focus.

 

[Slifer]

I really need to read through before I respond sometimes @Slifer

No worries, it happens to the best of us.

 

[kyear2]

Gavaskar, Border and not atg but the best from Eng Gooch. You say Gavaskar averaged 50 but you very well know that was mainly down to the Marshall debut series in '78. Still none of this changes the fact that Marshall was the excellence of execution (love Brett hart) vs all.

Fwiw, rating Sachin above Marshall is fine and all I just happen to disagree.

Yeah Brett was the best of that era and still probably my favorite of all time. Roman, Rock, HHH comes close.

 

[Sunil1z]

That 50 average was greatly inflated by the first series, feel free to look it up.

He got Gooch, Sunny, Border, Miandad, Gower etc. You can take a look at batsmen he dismissed the most.

So first series shouldn’t count ? Tendulkar was ranked no.1 at the age of 21 years , but you want me to not count Marshall’s first series ?

 

[Sunil1z]

Gavaskar, Border and not atg but the best from Eng Gooch. You say Gavaskar averaged 50 but you very well know that was mainly down to the Marshall debut series in '78. Still none of this changes the fact that Marshall was the excellence of execution (love Brett hart) vs all.

Fwiw, rating Sachin above Marshall is fine and all I just happen to disagree.

Why first series shouldn’t count ? When he is being compared to a guy who is the youngest player to score overseas century in AUS , SA and ENG ?

 

[Sunil1z]

This was Gavaskar’s last first class match vs Marshall in 1987. Marshall got him out in 2nd innings on 0 . So , overall 94 average in last first class match . So , I think if Gavaskar had faced Marshall solo he would aced it . You can’t take on 3 ATG bowlers at once as opener .