Is Ravichandran Ashwin an ATG test bowler?

[Xix2565]

The problem is that they don't realise how their deranged fanboy groupthink reflects on them and frankly diminishes respect for their own individual opinions. At least be your own person rather than join a herd.

Pot meet Kettle please. Considering you still enjoy not properly responding to me, I can only assume you too are similarly deranged and herdlike in thought.

 

[subshakerz]

Pot meet Kettle please. Considering you still enjoy not properly responding to me, I can only assume you too are similarly deranged and herdlike in thought.

Nah. I'm actually original, agree or disagree with my views.

 

[kyear2]

Looking like time to close this.

The level of toxicity is actually palpable.

 

[Line and Length]

Mods, please consider closing this thread. It's got out of hand.

 

[PlayerComparisons]

Calm down guys

 

[Line and Length]

Calm down guys

Who?
The protagonists or those wanting the thread closed?

 

[honestbharani]

The two who keep posting even though its clear what the consensus is, both in CW and in the cricketing world.

A Pak fan who hates Indian cricket and cricketers, how original.

 

[honestbharani]

 

[OverratedSanity]

Only wimps would want this thread closed. It's not even that toxic, who cares if there's like 3 people fighting.

 

[Arachnodouche]

Yeah, I just want to check how many pages it piles up every few hours. It's sort of like watching P2P downloads complete on 56Kbps modems in the 90s.

 

[RossTaylorsBox]

*pushes glasses on nose* technically 62.8% isn't a consensus

 

[Xix2565]

I mean I don't mind this thread closing or staying open, as long as people don't consistently dodge me when I want to discuss something and generally get sidetracked for no reason. Maybe there should be some self-reflection on their part. It would be very nice.

 

[centurymaker]

100 Tests
516 wickets
23.7 average

His sub 24 average + volume of wickets is enough to make him a borderline ATG. And let's not forget about his batting as well. Add that to the equation and he becomes an 'ATG Test Cricketer'.

 

[Daemon]

Insane levels of stamina on display in this thread. I’d liken it to a marathon but it’s more like race walking - difficult feat but looks funny and slightly embarrassing for all involved.

 

[HouHsiaoHsien]

Subz, where would you rank Ashwin as a spinner, in the spinners list?

 

[Line and Length]

Only wimps would want this thread closed. It's not even that toxic, who cares if there's like 3 people fighting.

So registering disapproval of a thread where insults are traded and arguments go round in repetitive circles makes one a wimp. You, like this thread, are tiresome.

 

[_00_deathscar]

So registering disapproval of a thread where insults are traded and arguments go round in repetitive circles makes one a wimp. You, like this thread, are tiresome.

Ok boomer

 

[Spark]

Even the posts complaining about personal attacks have devolved into personal attacks ffs.

I'll leave it open for now on the condition that the attacks stop, as do the suggestions of ulterior motives (which are, to me, also personal attacks). Debate the topic in good faith or not at all.

 

[capt_Luffy]

I can't speak for Subz, but Lillee for me is that last category because he doesn't have the complete record of some of the others, but a lot of that was because he was injured.
He wasn't intentionally left out of matches and primarily failed when he wasn't. But that aside and the factor that pushed over the line, WSC...

Like Chappell that seals it for me, additionally also the rest of the world matches that were tests at the time. He had epic performances against the best in the world where everyone else disappeared. Lillee, I. V. A., Chappell and to a lesser extent Barry cemented their greatness in possibly the most intense cricket in history. You don't have to agree, but that matters for me.

I don't necessarily disagree on that. But there are some things to consider, namely almost every bowler in WSC was successful and the pitches were very in favour of high pace bowling. Even outside of other greats like Roberts, Holding, Imran, Garner even Croft; Australian pacers like Ray Bright, Max Walker and even to an extent Len Pascoe was also successful. It was a batsman's final ground, not a high pacers largely. But my main complain was with Subs scrutinizing every bit of Ashwin's record and saying he can't be an ATG, while being completely fine with rating Laker as one (despite similar issues of home dominance) and ignoring the fact that in Test matches, Lillee only delivered anything close to ATG worthy against England and no one else. He was simply good against WI, and decent against Pakistan. If you play 3 top countries regularly, 2 almost solely in your backyard made for your type of bowling (ex- 1976 WI tour); then that's an issue comparable to Ashwin in SENA. Honestly, I haven't dug up Lillee's record so much until recently and now I have to re-evaluate that whether it's enough to rank him in Top 10 bowlers of mine.

 

[capt_Luffy]

May I ask your criteria or is it based on the eye test or feel?

Well roundedness of record mostly. The ones with nearly spotless for their time are in tier 1, the mine with some hick ups are in 2nd tier (which you really can divide into 2 sub tiers, the first containing Steyn, Ambrose, Wasim and Imran; and the rest of Holding, Garner, Lindwall, Trueman, Donald, Davidson and Lillee in the 2nd. Might move Donald up in the upper sub tier). And in 3rd tier are bowlers with some major hickups, but who have done still good enough to be an ATG.