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Bowling speeds

Cricnerd

Cricket Spectator
I'm fascinated by bowling speeds. This short film illustrates how hard it is to compare era by era
Thomson and Lillee, along with the West Indian quicks, were timed at the WACA in 75-76 series. All four quicks were comfortably bowling at over 90 mph. Then when they were filmed for the "fastest bowler" competition using the same equipment, they were on average at least 10kph slower.
It would be interesting to compare speed guns of the 70s with the modern version. No idea how you do this mind!

90 mph + seems to have been the sign of true express pace bowling since at least the 30 when Larwood was supposed to bowl at between 90-100 mph.
But are bowlers today quicker than their forbears?
On one side, it's arguable the true quicks are only marginally quicker today than say 40-50 years ago. Look at Brett Lee and Shoaib, bowling 20 years ago and no one has bowled quicker since. Then there's Thomson bowling nearly 50 years ago at 100 mph (if the speed guns then were correct).
Brian Statham was timed at 90mph in New Zealand, nearly 70 years ago.
Yet on the other side, any modern bowler who bowls in excess of 95 mph can only really manage it for very short spells before breaking down. Cummins and Starc bowled throughout most of the recent Ashes series at less than 90 mph and I suspect this was why they managed to stay the course for the entire series.

If we go even further back, then Ted MacDonald was seen as the quickest bowler in the early 20s. Yet commentators of the time thought Knox, Cotter and Jones, who bowled less than 20 years earlier, were at least as fast, while Kortright, was seen as faster than any of them. But could he really have been that fast? He generally bowled spells of more than 10 overs (sometimes 20 over + in a row), and he was rarely if ever injured. Plus there's one memorable quote from the period, of how he knocked a stump out of the ground which flew back bouncing over the keeper's head, who was standing fully 12 yards back. 12 yard is around 8-10 yards less than a modern quick.

I'm not sure where this ends but would love to know what people think
 

Tom Flint

International Regular
I saw Miguel Cummins bowl 97 in a cpl match. That was enough for me to know to take them all with a pinch of salt.
Lee and Akhtar were clearly bowling a good bit quicker than anyone regularly playing tests back in that era. Unless I've forgotten anyone
 

TheJediBrah

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Lee and Akhtar were clearly bowling a good bit quicker than anyone regularly playing tests back in that era. Unless I've forgotten anyone
I don't think I've seen anyone bowl quicker than those guys since, other than the odd short-term hit like Shaun Tait. Definitely not one with a decent career.

I saw when Mitchell Starc was suppsoedly hitting 160kph and I don't believe it for a second. Speed guns are garbage and I'm 99.9% sure get deliberately turned up for certain games and tournaments (*cough* BBL *cough*)
 

social

Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
I played at the same Brisbane club as Thommo, the keeper was still playing & he showed me where he used to stand

“No fkn way”

Keep in mind that I had played with & against test quicks in Sydney

So one day, Thommo turns up at the nets in a tshirt, shorts and thongs with a beer gut because he’s long retired

Had a bowl in bare feet and it was frightening for reasonable club cricketers

Tait, Lee, Shoaib etc would be the same
 

social

Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
Btw, if you don’t think that Starc is quick then go to a ground & see how far the keeper is back

Miles

As a friend of mine said, you know you’re in trouble when the closest people to you are the umpires
 

peterhrt

U19 Captain
Kortright, was seen as faster than any of them. But could he really have been that fast? He generally bowled spells of more than 10 overs (sometimes 20 over + in a row), and he was rarely if ever injured. Plus there's one memorable quote from the period, of how he knocked a stump out of the ground which flew back bouncing over the keeper's head, who was standing fully 12 yards back. 12 yard is around 8-10 yards less than a modern quick.
Kortright apparently never bowled short. He just concentrated on hitting the stumps. Might account for the keeper standing closer than expected.
 

Starfighter

Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
@Cricnerd there were no 'speed guns' in the seventies measurements, it was done using photogrammetry.

Kortright apparently never bowled short. He just concentrated on hitting the stumps. Might account for the keeper standing closer than expected.
A word on technique is needed. Keepers stood much more upright, not doing the deep squat modern ones do. You can blurilly see Jim Kelly in action here to Cotter, and note how high he looks to gather the ball. You can also see a scrappy demonstration in the same video. Keepers came from backgrounds of keeping mostly up to all but the fastest bowlers. The position of halfway between the stumps and slips was a default to faster bowlers pretty much up to WWII.

The earliest keeper I've seen to use the modern technique of squatting with the gloves on the ground is Ames - Carter was one of the primary popularisers of squatting but he kept the gloves higher, as did his successor Oldfield. So its's perhaps not surprising you only see the modern spacing post WWII when the modern technique became universal then.
 

Chin Music

State Vice-Captain
I mentioned a few weeks ago that I was surprised at Gus Atkinson being timed at 95mph when I was at the Oval. Not saying that the guy isn’t quick, but I couldn’t help thinking it was a little too convenient for the competition, I.e. the hundred.
 

Migara

International Coach
Thomson and Lillee, along with the West Indian quicks, were timed at the WACA in 75-76 series. All four quicks were comfortably bowling at over 90 mph. Then when they were filmed for the "fastest bowler" competition using the same equipment, they were on average at least 10kph slower.
It would be interesting to compare speed guns of the 70s with the modern version. No idea how you do this mind!
They used a camera as well as a grid of the back ground and some differentiation to calculate the speed out of hand. So those measurements are likely to be the most accurate since it was direct measurement, rather than radar, which may change with atmospheric conditions.
 

Cricnerd

Cricket Spectator
It's possible that speeds are made up but I suspect more likely that outlier speeds are more to do with tech or human errors. What's the benefit of lying about Atkinson - why not lie about a load of others as well? And if you're lying about Atkinson, why are some bowlers seen to not be box office enough to fib about? Also, with anything like this (and I work with corporates on communication), there's a chain of communication. To lie and go to the huge effort of covering up etc means the rewards have to be incredible to make it worth while. It only needs one disgruntled minion in the chain of command to reveal the truth and essentially loads of very high up people lose their jobs etc. Can of worms duly opened 😊
 

Line and Length

Cricketer Of The Year
Frank Tyson was the fastest bowler ever in some experts' opinions.

Don Bradman called him “the fastest bowler I have ever seen.” His opinion was shared by Richie Benaud.

Dickie Bird, the famous England umpire, wrote "he was certainly the quickest bowler I had ever seen through the air, and on one occasion the quickest bowler I never saw through the air".

Mind you, looking at this picture, he would have been 'no-balled" under today's law. He had an enormous back foot 'drag'.

 

Chin Music

State Vice-Captain
It's possible that speeds are made up but I suspect more likely that outlier speeds are more to do with tech or human errors. What's the benefit of lying about Atkinson - why not lie about a load of others as well? And if you're lying about Atkinson, why are some bowlers seen to not be box office enough to fib about? Also, with anything like this (and I work with corporates on communication), there's a chain of communication. To lie and go to the huge effort of covering up etc means the rewards have to be incredible to make it worth while. It only needs one disgruntled minion in the chain of command to reveal the truth and essentially loads of very high up people lose their jobs etc. Can of worms duly opened 😊
Why WPL's Claim That Ellyse Perry Smashed The Fastest Ball Record In Women’s Cricket Is Almost Certainly Nonsense (wisden.com) Here's one from the Women's IPL where there was considerable dispute over the alleged speed recorded.
 

the big bambino

International Captain
It's possible that speeds are made up but I suspect more likely that outlier speeds are more to do with tech or human errors. What's the benefit of lying about Atkinson - why not lie about a load of others as well? And if you're lying about Atkinson, why are some bowlers seen to not be box office enough to fib about? Also, with anything like this (and I work with corporates on communication), there's a chain of communication. To lie and go to the huge effort of covering up etc means the rewards have to be incredible to make it worth while. It only needs one disgruntled minion in the chain of command to reveal the truth and essentially loads of very high up people lose their jobs etc. Can of worms duly opened 😊
I think Chin Music is right though. The shorter formats have a demographic that like high octane whiz bang including bowling speeds. Not so prevalent this past season but prior to it, even fast medium bowlers like Siddle were "timed" at 150ks in the BBL. :blink:
 

Ali TT

International Vice-Captain
I think Chin Music is right though. The shorter formats have a demographic that like high octane whiz bang including bowling speeds. Not so prevalent this past season but prior to it, even fast medium bowlers like Siddle were "timed" at 150ks in the BBL. :blink:
And I can run much faster over 100m than I can over 10k.
 

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