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The Greatest ODI Innings of All Time

ankitj

ankitj

Hall of Fame Member
subshakerz said:
I am flabbergasted by this logic. The WC semifinal and final has the added mental challenge regardless of the pitch or match conditions for every player involved.

You don't think chocking is a real phenomenon, that certain teams falter in knockout games because they feel the pressure of the moment?
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So your base expectation from a world cup final is that no batter will score quick and no bowler will bowl economically? No batter will last long and no bowler will take wickets? They are mutually contradictory expectations.

Pressure is real, chocking is real. But it doesn't mean that you simultaneously hold that scoring a hundred is as good as scoring a double hundred AND taking 2 wickets is as good as taking 5 wickets in a pressure game. Mutually contradictory. It's simple logic. Our emotions cloud our reasoning ability.

Also, some teams choke which by corollary makes job of their opponents easier. It's easier to beat SA in a world cup semi-final (they never reach final lol) than in league round of world cups.
 
S

subshakerz

Hall of Fame Member
ankitj said:
So your base expectation from a world cup final is that no batter will score quick and no bowler will bowl economically? No batter will last long and no bowler will take wickets? They are mutually contradictory expectations.

Pressure is real, chocking is real. But it doesn't mean that you simultaneously hold that scoring a hundred is as good as scoring a double hundred AND taking 2 wickets is as good as taking 5 wickets in a pressure game. Mutually contradictory. It's simple logic. Our emotions cloud our reasoning ability.

Also, some teams choke which by corollary makes job of their opponents easier. It's easier to beat SA in a world cup semi-final (they never reach final lol) than in league round of world cups.
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Strawman. We are just saying that the same top performances in WC finals/semis are valued more than if they were in random games.

You are taking it to extremes. International players are still expected to deliver certain levels of performance regardless but added pressure can potentially curb your best performance.

The argument is quite simple - all the players involved feel the weight of the occasion, so those that perform have done so despite the added mental pressure.

DeSilva could have scored the exact same knock in a random tournament game against Australia, but his knock in the final is given more value because he had to play knowing that a WC was on the line.
 
G

Godard

U19 Vice-Captain
What’s the best knock in a WC final? Viv, Dhoni, De Silva or Lloyd? Lloyd’s was in the first innings and has some support, same for Viv(however Lloyd faced a better attack and was the main aggressor), De Silva’s was while chasing but a smaller target and was had very good support. Dhoni’s was under the maximum pressure, Sachin’s last WC, WC final at home, Sachin and Sehwag gone with lots to do, had good support in Gambhir but he had to take the job of the main aggressor. Also coming above Yuvraj(Player of the tournament), to take the responsibility of neutering Murali was a tactical master stroke. And the six to finish it, so had some good drama around it too and t he first team to win on home soil. Perhaps between Lloyd(cause the first WC, support but minor, very good attack, main aggressor) and Dhoni which are the two best for me, I will go marginally for MS.
 
S

subshakerz

Hall of Fame Member
Godard said:
What’s the best knock in a WC final? Viv, Dhoni, De Silva or Lloyd? Lloyd’s was in the first innings and has some support, same for Viv(however Lloyd faced a better attack and was the main aggressor), De Silva’s was while chasing but a smaller target and was had very good support. Dhoni’s was under the maximum pressure, Sachin’s last WC, WC final at home, Sachin and Sehwag gone with lots to do, had good support in Gambhir but he had to take the job of the main aggressor. Also coming above Yuvraj(Player of the tournament), to take the responsibility of neutering Murali was a tactical master stroke. And the six to finish it, so had some good drama around it too and t he first team to win on home soil. Perhaps between Lloyd(cause the first WC, support but minor, very good attack, main aggressor) and Dhoni which are the two best for me, I will go marginally for MS.
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This would be a great separate thread actually. Dhoni, Lloyd, DeSilva, Viv and Gilly all have great claims.
 
G

Godard

U19 Vice-Captain
Sunil1z said:
Gilchrist 149 is the greatest knock in WC finals .
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Didn’t how i missed that. But maybe. But he did bat first and didn’t have that much pressure. Still it is one of the most explosive innings and came against a very good attack.
 
0

_00_deathscar

International Regular
Batting first shouldn’t take you out of the running - especially when those knocks are like Ponting and Gilchrist which basically finish the game after the first innings.
 
Burgey

Burgey

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Godard said:
What’s the best knock in a WC final? Viv, Dhoni, De Silva or Lloyd? Lloyd’s was in the first innings and has some support, same for Viv(however Lloyd faced a better attack and was the main aggressor), De Silva’s was while chasing but a smaller target and was had very good support. Dhoni’s was under the maximum pressure, Sachin’s last WC, WC final at home, Sachin and Sehwag gone with lots to do, had good support in Gambhir but he had to take the job of the main aggressor. Also coming above Yuvraj(Player of the tournament), to take the responsibility of neutering Murali was a tactical master stroke. And the six to finish it, so had some good drama around it too and t he first team to win on home soil. Perhaps between Lloyd(cause the first WC, support but minor, very good attack, main aggressor) and Dhoni which are the two best for me, I will go marginally for MS.
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There's a number of them worth a shout, and if you're going to go through that exercise it would be remiss not to bring Ponting's 2003 WC final knock into the discussion too. I think Lloyd's, Aravinda's and Dhoni's were better, but that 143 belongs in the argument too.

Then again, four years later Gilchrist ended the WC final as a contest inside a dozen overs, so there's something to be said for that too I suppose.
 
G

Godard

U19 Vice-Captain
I know but batting second is always tougher. And Ponting’s knock wasn’t completely a one man effort either.
_00_deathscar said:
Batting first shouldn’t take you out of the running - especially when those knocks are like Ponting and Gilchrist which basically finish the game after the first innings.
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G

Godard

U19 Vice-Captain
Burgey said:
There's a number of them worth a shout, and if you're going to go through that exercise it would be remiss not to bring Ponting's 2003 WC final knock into the discussion too. I think Lloyd's, Aravinda's and Dhoni's were better, but that 143 belongs in the argument too.

Then again, four years later Gilchrist ended the WC final as a contest inside a dozen overs, so there's something to be said for that too I suppose.
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Ponting cause of the support(good start by openers, Damien Martin) and the mediocre Ind bowling attack, a little below Dhoni, Aravinda, Gilchrist, Lloyd. Gilchrist clearly on the same level since he played more explosively, against a pretty good attack, and was more of a single man show than Ponting.
 
Burgey

Burgey

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Boon was very good for his time. He and Marsh were integral to that Aus set up back in the 80s, but great is probably a bridge too far
 
honestbharani

honestbharani

Whatever it takes!!!
Burgey said:
Boon was very good for his time. He and Marsh were integral to that Aus set up back in the 80s, but great is probably a bridge too far
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He is my favorite Aussie player of that generation but like you said, I think Jones from his era would be a better fit as a great ODI player than him.

I suppose you can see they were all great cricketers except Faulkner but format greatness is a better measure, I feel.
 
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