*Official* England in NZ 2023

[ataraxia]

Releasing Sodhi is fine imo (with the assumption that he'll never be selected over Sir Michael); he was only ever going to play at the Bay and no spinner at the Basin is hardly a horrible situation to end up in.

 

[CricAddict]

So nicholls stays...

Hope Young can come in for him.

Latham-Conway-Kane-Young-Mitchell-Blundell-Bracewell-Kugglein ugh-Henry-Tickner-Southee looks better on paper.

 

[_Ed_]

I really wish I hadn't googled that. I suggest people don't. Ignorance is sometimes a good thing

Wise words.

Unfortunately I read Ed's post:



And was onto it before I read down to your sage advice.

I'm really not any happier for knowing any of that.

Yeah, sorry about that - should have given you a bit of a warning.

 

[SteveNZ]

Not sure what the rationale behind this, I thought they would have kept Duffy and released Kuggs. Maybe there is a plunkett shield game coming up for Otago and Canterbury. Makes sense to release Ish if you they are not going to play him.

Stead said Henry would replace Jacob Duffy in the squad while leg-spinner Ish Sodhi had also been released.

“I don’t think it’s unfair to say we are lacking a bit of that confidence at the moment, but I can assure you the faith is still with this group of guys,” he said.

“We believe these are our best cricketers. Won’t make wholesale or snappy changes when all of our top order struggled.

“We want to go out and throw some punches back at England and I thought through this (first) test we did that really, really well at times.”

I mean, what world is Scott Kuggeleijn a better bowler than Jacob Duffy...not this one, so we can only surmise that Kuggeleijn is in the squad as an all-rounder. Pretty weak when that's the case.

God it gets boring quickly as a fan to hear rubbish like the thought that we did really, well at times. Two guys with the bat did (once) and you could probably say a couple of people bowled OK at times, but nothing of any substance. I thought we lost by 267 runs and were ridiculously outplayed, but hey I'm not trying to save face and potentially my job.

 

[Fuller Pilch]

I mean, what world is Scott Kuggeleijn a better bowler than Jacob Duffy...not this one, so we can only surmise that Kuggeleijn is in the squad as an all-rounder. Pretty weak when that's the case.

Indian allrounders
Jadeja: batting av 36.88; bowling av 23.82
Ashwin: batting av 27.46; bowling av 23.98
Axar: batting av 31.30; bowling av 15.45

Australian allrounder:
Green: batting av 35.04; bowling av 29.78

England allrounder:
Stokes: 36 & 32.02

Bangladesh allrounder:
Shakib: 39 & 31.32

WI allrounders:
Holder: 29.09 & 29.17
Mayers: 35.8 & 19.29

NZ "allrounders"
Bracewell: batting av 23.33; bowling av 42.62
Kuggleijn: batting av 11; bowling av 40.25



One of these things is not like the others.

 

[Blain]

The fact we picked one swing bowler, in a pink ball test, for a wicket covered for days prior to the match, shows where our strategy/planning is at. Then to bowl absolute short and wide rubbish for 2 innings was so bad to watch.

NZ cricket needs a wake up call, Wagner ball + relying on Southee/Boult with the new ball days are dead. They haven't worked for several years, and now our best bowler isn't playing. The lack over forward thinking and planning is clear to see.

 

[thundaboult]

So what is our best pool of available/not-injured test (or potential debut) bowlers?

Southee
Duffy
Henry
Tickner
Lister
Doug bracewell
Shipley

Hmm I actually quite like that mix...Swing, pace, bounce, left arm variation in there as well. For the test 11 I'd go with Southee and Lister to open up. Tickner and Shipley as 3rd and 4th. Doug would be nice but looking to build for the future with Shipley.

Wags clearly past it and kuggs time was 4-5 years ago.

 

[CricAddict]

Indian allrounders
Jadeja: batting av 36.88; bowling av 23.82
Ashwin: batting av 27.46; bowling av 23.98
Axar: batting av 31.30; bowling av 15.45

Australian allrounder:
Green: batting av 35.04; bowling av 29.78

England allrounder:
Stokes: 36 & 32.02

Bangladesh allrounder:
Shakib: 39 & 31.32

WI allrounders:
Holder: 29.09 & 29.17
Mayers: 35.8 & 19.29

NZ "allrounders"
Bracewell: batting av 23.33; bowling av 42.62
Kuggleijn: batting av 11; bowling av 40.25



One of these things is not like the others.

tbf, Jamieson averages 20 with both bat and ball which are on par with the others in that list.

 

[_Ed_]

Henry will come into the eleven for someone, probably (hopefully) Kuggs. Will be a long tail though.

I honestly have more confidence in Henry's batting (averaging 22 in tests with three 50s) than the other bloke, so I'm not too worried about that.

 

[nzfan]

How's this not good enough for an all rounder of quality?

 

[Fuller Pilch]

How's this not good enough for an all rounder of quality?

If only he'd been the ex NZ wicketkeeper's son/grandson...

 

[vandem]

The fact we picked one swing bowler, in a pink ball test, for a wicket covered for days prior to the match, shows where our strategy/planning is at. Then to bowl absolute short and wide rubbish for 2 innings was so bad to watch.....

Agree.

I understand that sometimes you over-think based on pitches from previous games at a ground (like picking 2 spinners in Sydney on last tour), but deciding to play an extra T20 / all-sorts bounce bowler (who perhaps might make an extra 10-20 runs at #8) instead of a 2nd new ball specialist in a d/n game was bizarre.

 

[The Hutt Rec]

The fact we picked one swing bowler, in a pink ball test, for a wicket covered for days prior to the match, shows where our strategy/planning is at. Then to bowl absolute short and wide rubbish for 2 innings was so bad to watch.

NZ cricket needs a wake up call, Wagner ball + relying on Southee/Boult with the new ball days are dead. They haven't worked for several years, and now our best bowler isn't playing. The lack over forward thinking and planning is clear to see.

We also seemed totally unprepared for batting under lights … had we even considered it? Were there any open wicket practices to get our batsmen up to speed again?

Surely if we had it in our thoughts we’d have selected Duffy?!

Everything to do with NZC is just so half assed and “that’ll do” these days.

 

[Blain]

We also seemed totally unprepared for batting under lights … had we even considered it? Were there any open wicket practices to get our batsmen up to speed again?

Surely if we had it in our thoughts we’d have selected Duffy?!

Everything to do with NZC is just so half assed and “that’ll do” these days.

Agree, NZ Cricket is stuck in 2021 World Test Championship mindset. "Worked then, why not now?" Despite being without Boult, De Grandhomme, Watling, Jamieson, Taylor. Then you have an aging Wagner and Southee. Williamson's run production has fallen away big time also, and Nicholl's has finally lost his shine (I'm amazed he's done as well as he has considering his technique). Do we have a succession plan for any of those guys? Clearly not.

 

[Fuller Pilch]

Agree, NZ Cricket is stuck in 2021 World Test Championship mindset. "Worked then, why not now?" Despite being without Boult, De Grandhomme, Watling, Jamieson, Taylor. Then you have an aging Wagner and Southee. Williamson's run production has fallen away big time also, and Nicholl's has finally lost his shine (I'm amazed he's done as well as he has considering his technique). Do we have a succession plan for any of those guys? Clearly not.

They've been incredibly lucky that Conway moved here and that Blundell and Mitchell have so been freakishly successful. Otherwise it could have been MUCH worse.

 

[Flem274*]

I've found a positive.

We picked two guys who average 30+ and would be the 3rd or 4th best bowler for their provinces over their careers and they bowled test class spells. That wouldn't happen in 2009.

 

[Prince EWS]

I've found a positive.

We picked two guys who average 30+ and would be the 3rd or 4th best bowler for their provinces over their careers and they bowled test class spells. That wouldn't happen in 2009.

Yeah Tickner and Macewell both bowled decent spells.

 

[Moss]

God it gets boring quickly as a fan to hear rubbish like the thought that we did really, well at times. Two guys with the bat did (once) and you could probably say a couple of people bowled OK at times, but nothing of any substance. I thought we lost by 267 runs and were ridiculously outplayed, but hey I'm not trying to save face and potentially my job.

 

[The Hutt Rec]

Apparently an actual quote from Stead:

“We want to go out and throw some punches back at England and I thought through this test we did that really, really well at times.”

https://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/crick...-in-black-caps-for-second-test-versus-england (End of the article)

 

[Zinzan]

Jamieson southee?

Jamieson hasn't been on the field, & Southee has been trash in the last 12 months averaging over 50 with the ball in 7 tests.

I still have no idea how he was given the Test captaincy and how if KW was going to drop 1 or 2 of the forms it should have been 1 or 2 of white-ball forms, especially considering everyone except Stead and KW himself know he should be nowhere near out T20 side.

Our selectors have gone from fairly good 2-3 years back, to poor 12 months ago & to beyond embarrassing today.