England test tour of Pakistan December 2022

[slow deck]

The England hype is beyond me. What with Nasser Hussain calling them a "very good team". How can you have a a team be "very good" when only 2 of them (just 1 before Harry Brook) averages over 37 with the bat. But all of the hype online on reddit etc is where you really see it. BazBall scrambles brains?

Why are they bowling your bowlers into the ground? Stokes is dangling a pretty big carrot here. More like a box of christmas chocolates.

The problem with vibes over numbers is that it fits right into playing a team like Pakistan (how did Pak lose the world cup final? vibes over numbers) who the easiest way to beat is by playing 'actually smart cricket'.
If Pakistan don't chase this it will take a mental collapse I reckon.

 

[ashley bach]

How many overs are they losing a day? If its around 15ish I think it's an ok declaration.

Not too sure about this, the door is wide open for Pakistan and there's every chance it'll end up looking very foolish from Baz/Ben.
Has any team ever scored over 900 runs and lost a test? Certainly history beckons here.

 

[BazBall21]

It may well look foolish, but they have said repeatedly that they are prepared to risk losing to win, have backed that up now.

 

[GIMH]

It may well look foolish, but they have said repeatedly that they are prepared to risk losing to win, have backed that up now.

It was backed up when we declined an easy draw against NZ when 1-0 up in the series. Not sure why there was any doubt since.

 

[Kirkut]

Not sure if it's a wise move..

 

[slow deck]

There are better ways to dare to win. A similar score could have been presented or slightly higher but with more time sucked out of the game for example. At this rate, Pakistan should have about 250 to get tomorrow.

 

[GIMH]

The England hype is beyond me. What with Nasser Hussain calling them a "very good team". How can you have a a team be "very good" when only 2 of them (just 1 before Harry Brook) averages over 37 with the bat. But all of the hype online on reddit etc is where you really see it. BazBall scrambles brains?

Why are they bowling your bowlers into the ground? Stokes is dangling a pretty big carrot here. More like a box of christmas chocolates.

The problem with vibes over numbers is that it fits right into playing a team like Pakistan (how did Pak lose the world cup final? vibes over numbers) who the easiest way to beat is by playing 'actually smart cricket'.
If Pakistan don't chase this it will take a mental collapse I reckon.

I presume the good team shout is based on beating NZ, India and SA over the summer. But there’s a long way to go for this team yet, for sure.

 

[greg]

It’s seems to me that there’s an indirect problem with this approach by England. It’s not that such an approach can’t be admired in many respects. It is that it will encourage opposing sides in future to deliberately prepare pitches like this on the basis that England will take enormous risks to try and manufacture a win, even where objectively they haven’t actually got a great chance. So opponents may basically see pitches like this as not guaranteed draw, but pitches which allow two realistic results - with England victory a large outsider. And that’s not good for test cricket as entertainment.

People are talking about England “dangling a carrot” - but do Pakistan even need todo more than bat normally?

 

[Howe_zat]

It may well look foolish, but they have said repeatedly that they are prepared to risk losing to win, have backed that up now.

My complaint isn't about that at all. They haven't given themselves the best chance they could of winning because they haven't used all the sessions available to try and win the game.

 

[MW1304]

Not giving your premier new ball bowler ever the new ball so you can throw them halfway down the wicket definitely is dumb though.

 

[Shady Slim]

It’s seems to me that there’s an indirect problem with this approach by England. It’s not that such an approach can’t be admired in many respects. It is that it will encourage opposing sides in future to deliberately prepare pitches like this on the basis that England will take enormous risks to try and manufacture a win, even where objectively they haven’t actually got a great chance. So opponents may basically see pitches like this as not guaranteed draw, but pitches which allow two realistic results - with England victory a large outsider. And that’s not good for test cricket as entertainment.

People are talking about England “dangling a carrot” - but do Pakistan even need todo more than bat normally?

i suppose the argument does rightly run that if you batted out the day and left them 400 to get in a day they'd probably just shut up shop for day five looking to play no shots and on a dead pitch you can't take ten wickets against a team who does that

we've got an interesting day five ahead though and that's what's important unless there's a pak lollapse

 

[Howe_zat]

Stokes taking the new ball instead of Anderson. OK ......

And both openers deciding to use the new ball to test out the middle of the wicket. I'm sorry, but this is probably a complete waste of the new cherry.

Stuart Broad claims on Twitter that they are trying to scuff the ball as fast as possible and aim for reverse rather than conventional swing.

It's a bit of a reach but I'm prepared to put a bit of faith in it.

 

[Sunil1z]

This is a real Steve Waugh style declaration

Steve Waugh had a bowling line up of McWarne+ Gillespie + Lee.

This English team has a bowling line up of spin quartet of Root, Livingstone, Jacks and Leach. This is extremely foolish decision.

 

[Shady Slim]

It seems such a basic analysis to think 'how long would they need to chase this total' instead of 'how long do we want to bowl them out' because declaration only becomes relevant when you stop trying to defend runs and start being against the clock.

As it is they will be measuring the wickets against runs and not time for the entire rest of the test, so it's a bad declaration. This seems... really simple to understand? But it'll only be talked about as a bad call if they lose.

Anyway, hopefully it doesn't matter. It normally doesn't matter very much, like every other captaincy decision, compared to how well they play.

howe's right here though that if they bowl like deadshits it doesn't matter if they have four sessions, three sessions and more runs or three runs and no sessions, they won't get the result. all down to the execution, and then all of the talking heads will retcon the genius or otherwise the decision on that lol

 

[greg]

Not giving your premier new ball bowler ever the new ball so you can throw them halfway down the wicket definitely is dumb though.

Maybe Anderson just fancied a rest. At the end of the day England have just spent two days in the field and only had a break for a session.

 

[MW1304]

Lol it worked.

 

[Shady Slim]

Maybe Anderson just fancied a rest. At the end of the day England have just spent two days in the field and only had a break for a session.

and that's the beauty of pakistan's approach as compared to the aggressive approach!
conversely there's the argument that the man hours in the field when you're chasing leather all day like england made pakistan do are harder than man hours that pakistan made england do with less chasing. the thrills! the tactics! the humanity!

 

[TheGreatest]

Good decision to declare by England. Pakistan will now play their trademark foolish cricket and mess it up.

 

[Howe_zat]

Hope Shafiq understands what he's done there. He gets a hundred when they pitch it up and holes out when they bounce him.

That's like giving a new dog a treat for pissing on the carpet. The rest of his series is going to be getting peppered.

 

[TheGreatest]

I sense an English win here. McCullum and Strokes definitely know Pakistani batting history quite well.