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CW's Top 50 Test Batsmen. 2022 Results

Line and Length

Cricketer Of The Year
I can't say I agree with the placement or even inclusion of some on that list.. in which universe could Boycott be higher than Kohli, Smith, Root :laugh:
Or Hobbs above Viv, Tnedulkar, Lara :blink:

BUT, the sheer amount of organisation by OP and the cricketing discussions that I read through were great...and it just goes to show how subjective a lot of this is. Great job!

And yes, one day I'll put my money where my mouth is and compile a list of 50 batsmen.
Please don't. Why should an opinionated individual's list be put up for a comparison with a CW Members' survey?
 

The Sean

Cricketer Of The Year
Bradman obviously stands head and shoulders above the rest and then we have a large number of players averaging over 50. It isn't until we reach #29 that we come across a sub 50 batting average, but I'm not going to deny Boycott's worthiness for his place.

After that averages in the 40s are more common with Trumper and Hill the only batsmen with sub 40 averages.

When the voting closed for the 51st position, there were more debates than votes but multiple votes had been received for Yousuf Youhana (Mohammad Yusuf) and Bruce Mitchell while others were ranking Hashim Amla highly. This trio could be regarded as unlucky not to make the final cut.

From my perspective, there are some interesting questions that can be posed. In most cases players had careers lasting many Tests but I find it interesting that George Headley (22 Tests) and Graeme Pollock (23 Tests) are ranked 11 and 15 respectively yet Adam Voges (averaging 61.88 in 20 Tests) and Eddie Paynter (59.23 in 20 Tests) were almost entirely overlooked. Why?

It is common for voters to ignore current players yet Steve Smith makes the Top 10 while Kane Williamson, with a superior average to those ranked around him, is only ranked 39th.

Players that were around over a century ago have a certain mystique legendary status and this might explain Trumper's ranking yet W.G.Grace and Ranjitsinhji didn't rate a mention in voting. The latter, with an average of 44.95, wouldn't have looked out of place in the list.

Some places on the list are self-explanatory but worthy of comment. Shivnarine Chanerpaul's longevity and performances suggest a higher ranking, but he has been criticised for being selfish and for batting too low. The fact that he was not out in over a quarter of the Tests he played seems to support this.

I could go on, and will add my occasional comment, but I am interested in seeing comments and critiques - especially from cricket followers who may not have been involved in the voting thread.

I hope to add similar threads for the Pace bowlers, spinners and all-rounders when voting wanes and a nice round number on the list is achieved.
A handful of my observations, for what they're worth.

No issue with MoYo, Mitchell and Amla being the next three in line - all are more than deserving. As for others who I'd be voting for imminently, well I'm a bit of a sucker for weight of runs from the top of the order so I reckon I'd be finding a spot for both Cook and Gooch sooner rather than later. Herbie Taylor definitely worth a shout too, and it's interesting that while Bob Simpson is rated very highly in these parts, I don't think his great partner Bill Lawry has even gotten a single vote (or even a single mention?) yet. His style of batting may have had something to do with that...there are a load of other outstanding openers who you could argue for as well.

Outside of openers, I'd say that all of Walters, Gilchrist, Cowdrey, Gower, Pietersen, Hazare, Viswanath, Laxman and Jayawardene would be there or thereabouts in upcoming voting. I'm sure I'd remember others along the way.

As for why, for example, Trumper got in but Grace and Ranji didn't - well I can only speak for myself but I was specifically excluding blokes who played all or most of their career in the 19th century, I suppose to make things easier for myself. Grace and Ranji I have no problem at all calling two of the greatest batsmen of all time, but they are hard to judge as Test players. Grace had a pretty impressive record for his time, but his Test numbers didn't reflect his dominance over the game that his status did - though it's worth noting that he was already 32 by the time he played his first Test!

Ranji I find even more difficult to accurately judge. His Test record is very good for his time but it was quite brief (just 15 Tests from 1896-1902), and incredibly front loaded (42% of his total runs came in his first three Tests!). Consider this breakdown of Ranji's Test record:

Tests 1-3 - 418 runs at 104.50
Tests 4-8 - 409 runs at 45.44
Tests 9-15 - 162 runs at 18

He pretty much dropped off a cliff in the second half of his (short) Test career, and was finished as a Test player by the age of 29. This isn't to cast doubt on his (undeniable) greatness, but more to strengthen my cowardly position of excluding him as being too hard to judge!
 

jayjay

U19 Cricketer
Please don't. Why should an opinionated individual's list be put up for a comparison with a CW Members' survey?
Bit cranky are we?

This is a forum, in case you hadn't noticed so people present their views...kind of the whole point. I'm happy for you to avoid my future threads as you don't like opinions :laugh:
 

Line and Length

Cricketer Of The Year
Bit cranky are we?

This is a forum, in case you hadn't noticed so people present their views...kind of the whole point. I'm happy for you to avoid my future threads as you don't like opinions :laugh:
I enjoy opinions, but if every member decided to post their own extensive list on threads such as this, it would be very hard to internalise. When a thread provides a list through votes, I believe it is more interesting to read opinions and analytical contributions rather than individual lists that are often given without comments, reasoning or justification. :)
 

CricAddict

Cricketer Of The Year
I enjoy opinions, but if every member decided to post their own extensive list on threads such as this, it would be very hard to internalise. When a thread provides a list through votes, I believe it is more interesting to read opinions and analytical contributions rather than individual lists that are often given without comments, reasoning or justification. :)
Agreed. And there is always the ATG discussion thread where everyone posts their own lists. Do not have to disrupt other threads or create other threads for individual lists.
 

Burgey

Request Your Custom Title Now!
I can't say I agree with the placement or even inclusion of some on that list.. in which universe could Boycott be higher than Kohli, Smith, Root :laugh:
Or Hobbs above Viv, Tnedulkar, Lara :blink:

BUT, the sheer amount of organisation by OP and the cricketing discussions that I read through were great...and it just goes to show how subjective a lot of this is. Great job!

And yes, one day I'll put my money where my mouth is and compile a list of 50 batsmen.
Boycott should be higher than Gavaskar ffs.
 

HookShot

U19 Vice-Captain
A handful of my observations, for what they're worth.

No issue with MoYo, Mitchell and Amla being the next three in line - all are more than deserving. As for others who I'd be voting for imminently, well I'm a bit of a sucker for weight of runs from the top of the order so I reckon I'd be finding a spot for both Cook and Gooch sooner rather than later. Herbie Taylor definitely worth a shout too, and it's interesting that while Bob Simpson is rated very highly in these parts, I don't think his great partner Bill Lawry has even gotten a single vote (or even a single mention?) yet. His style of batting may have had something to do with that...there are a load of other outstanding openers who you could argue for as well.

Outside of openers, I'd say that all of Walters, Gilchrist, Cowdrey, Gower, Pietersen, Hazare, Viswanath, Laxman and Jayawardene would be there or thereabouts in upcoming voting. I'm sure I'd remember others along the way.

As for why, for example, Trumper got in but Grace and Ranji didn't - well I can only speak for myself but I was specifically excluding blokes who played all or most of their career in the 19th century, I suppose to make things easier for myself. Grace and Ranji I have no problem at all calling two of the greatest batsmen of all time, but they are hard to judge as Test players. Grace had a pretty impressive record for his time, but his Test numbers didn't reflect his dominance over the game that his status did - though it's worth noting that he was already 32 by the time he played his first Test!

Ranji I find even more difficult to accurately judge. His Test record is very good for his time but it was quite brief (just 15 Tests from 1896-1902), and incredibly front loaded (42% of his total runs came in his first three Tests!). Consider this breakdown of Ranji's Test record:

Tests 1-3 - 418 runs at 104.50
Tests 4-8 - 409 runs at 45.44
Tests 9-15 - 162 runs at 18

He pretty much dropped off a cliff in the second half of his (short) Test career, and was finished as a Test player by the age of 29. This isn't to cast doubt on his (undeniable) greatness, but more to strengthen my cowardly position of excluding him as being too hard to judge!
I think that your stats ‘paint the wrong’ picture. Ranji played in 4 series and failed in only one of them - the famous 1902 series against Australia.

The reason for this is that he had to return to India toward the end of 1901 to prevent personal bankruptcy and didn’t make it back to England until May 1902. Consequently he entered the Ashes series horribly underdone, mentally worn-out and played in only 3 of the 5 Tests.

Incidentally Hugh Trumble was the top wicket taker for Australia and dismissed him twice.


SeriesMatInnsNO100s50s0sHS RunsAvgS/RCaSt
2​
4​
1​
1​
1​
0​
154*​
235​
78.33​
2​
0​
5​
10​
1​
1​
3​
0​
175​
457​
50.78​
3​
0​
5​
8​
2​
0​
2​
1​
93*​
278​
46.33​
8​
0​
3​
4​
0​
0​
0​
1​
13​
19​
4.75​
0​
0​
Overall (4)​
15​
26​
4​
2​
6​
2​
175​
989​
44.95​
13​
0​
 

Lillian Thomson

Hall of Fame Member
I wouldn't place Boycott above Gavaskar. Kohli is more subjective. I wouldn't necessarily accuse anyone (except sledger) of trolling. But to put laughter emojis at the prospect of Boycott above Kohli in one thread and then in another thread produce a post War top 30 cricketers with Michael Holding at 19 and Dale Steyn not even in it is certainly like something out of the disciples kitchen. :tooth:
 

Fuller Pilch

Hall of Fame Member
I think Tom Graveney received a fairly severe blow on the head at some point in his career.
This is an All Time World XI he selected in 1984.

1. Sunil Gavaskar
2. Bobby Simpson
3. D. Vengsarkar
4. Kim Hughes
5. Imran Khan
6. Farokh Engineer
7. Ray Lindwall
8. Rodney Marsh
9. Dennis Lillee
10. Michael Holding
11. Lance Gibbs
All time??? Wow!
Quality openers and bowling attack, but if you get the openers early I don't see many runs in that side.
 

Fuller Pilch

Hall of Fame Member
Anyway excellent work. Very interesting. I also think it would be good to do a separate list for openers as discussed.
 

Line and Length

Cricketer Of The Year
Anyway excellent work. Very interesting. I also think it would be good to do a separate list for openers as discussed.
I see @gftw has jumped in and started one from scratch. Well done - I'll follow it closely.
I believe the first 4 or 5 are quite predictable but I will leave him to conduct the votes. I hope he doesn't let it slide like the wicket-keeper batsmen voting (no votes for 3 days, I did a vote count 4 days but no input from gftw for over a week).
 

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