NZ's 2nd greatest test bowler.

[Flametree]

I voted Cowie, but I'm a sucker for the older players who didn't get the opportunities of today's players.

I also pick Dempster in my all-time kiwi xi, (and I kind of want to pick Donnelly at 5 as well, but Taylor's done just enough...).

 

[Burgey]

I would love it to be Cunis, if for no other reason than John Arlott's summary of his bowling in one match which he described as "much like his name, neither one thing or the other."

 

[Fuller Pilch]

Only 1 vote for Boult from 48 votes. 5 or 6 years ago he would have had lots of votes.

 

[harsh.ag]

Southee > Bumrah > Zaheer

Bumrah > Southee > Zaheer

 

[Athlai]

I reckon it'll end up that way tbf

 

[_00_deathscar]

Zaheer's good patch(es) was about the length (in tests) of Bumrah's entire career once he started making Indian ATG sides (and Bumrah was on about 15-20 tests when that happened) plus he has 300 wickets to his name. Likewise Ishant since getting gud was keeping pace statistically with Southee for a fair bit there (I'm unsure what injury and loss of form has done since 2020).

Srinath and Shami also exist, and together with Ishant and Zaheer they are easily in the Boult league once you adjust for era. Zaheer would love a bowl today.

Zaheer also had large patches of awful form. Even today he would blow very hot and cold. Bumrah while he hasn't been at his best for a while is still an absolutely incredible bowler.

Ishant was only keeping pace with Southee in terms of raw average numbers. Have a look at his actual wickets or WPM. It's very, very low.

I think you're either massively underrating Southee/Boult here or massively overrating Bond. Assuming you think Bond is probably about Bumrah level (or thereabouts), surely you don't think Southee/Boult = Zaheer/Ishant/Srinath level?

 

[honestbharani]

I wont agree that Ishant has not been good.. His low WPM is also due to the competition as much as anything. I think he has very much been those levels since 2016 or whenever. That said, would still not put Bond over Boult/Southee/Wagner etc. I rate career than potential.

 

[_00_deathscar]

I wont agree that Ishant has not been good.. His low WPM is also due to the competition as much as anything. I think he has very much been those levels since 2016 or whenever. That said, would still not put Bond over Boult/Southee/Wagner etc. I rate career than potential.

I think he's been a very useful bowler for sure - but even in his peakiest of peak forms he simply wasn't a dude who took a lot of wickets. In fact his WPM never really wavered throughout his career. His average dropped massively.

Yes there was more competition, but at home that would have been true anyway (Ashwin/Jadeja and then Axar), and away you had Shami, Bumrah etc. He benefited as much from their rise as the reverse.

He was a bowler who built up pressure - he was very good at keeping it tight. Even in his late career I wouldn't pick him over Southee/Boult, not in any way.

 

[honestbharani]

I think he's been a very useful bowler for sure - but even in his peakiest of peak forms he simply wasn't a dude who took a lot of wickets. In fact his WPM never really wavered throughout his career. His average dropped massively.

Yes there was more competition, but at home that would have been true anyway (Ashwin/Jadeja and then Axar), and away you had Shami, Bumrah etc. He benefited as much from their rise as the reverse.

He was a bowler who built up pressure - he was very good at keeping it tight. Even in his late career I wouldn't pick him over Southee/Boult, not in any way.

The games he ran through sides for us, in SL we won, in India we won and in England and NZ we screwed up. He does take more time to get his wickets compared to a Bumrah or a Shami but that is just his role in the side and style of bowling. I think he has been as much a matchwinner as anyone in this period.

 

[Flem274*]

Ishant was world class for a good 5-6 years. He definitely has a strong case for 3rd seamer donkey work in Indias atg side SENA conditions.

 

[Howsie]

It’s Tim Southee and it isn’t even close. I mean I get the Shane Bond love and everything obviously, but he only took 80 test wickets

You can break Southee’s career record down twice, mid 2012 through till the end of 2014 where he takes 80 odd test wickets @ 21, with some monster performances in Asia. Then 2019 through till now where hes’s taken 100 odd wickets @ 23 again with some big performances overseas and contributing to us becoming the best test team in the world.

I don’t hold the start of his career against him, there hasn’t been many 19-22 year old quirks that have done well in test history. He obviously dropped away for a few years between 15-18 but 180 odd wickets @ 23/24 with notable performances overseas and in Asia, if that was his career he’d be look at way above Bond IMO.