Final: England v Italy (In London, England)

[Burgey]

In an intense pressure situation like that I think it really a question of "How big are your balls?/how tight is your aris?".

It's not just a question of technique or one of our least technically gifted players wouldn't have (successfully) taken our second.

Maguire obviously fancied one and others perhaps didn't. No shame in that.

Maguire's penalty was the best of the shootout from either side imho. The love child of Oliver Kahn and Gordon Banks wouldn't have saved that.

 

[Red_Ink_Squid]

Mount was utter ****e. And I guess it feels harsh to say this because of his heroic saves but Pickford's lack of ability to ping a pass meant England's ability to counterattack was seriously limited.

Grealish should have been brought on for Mount waaaay earlier than he was. Thought Mount played well vs Denmark but anonymous the rest of the tournament (obviously he missed a couple of the games).

 

[flibbertyjibber]

Gutting but the better side won it on the night. Think Southgate made 2 big errors in not getting Grealish on earlier and making the subs for the penalties so late. Italians were terrible in opening half hour and we should have finished them then when we had acres down the right to exploit. Sadly the early subs he made didn't work out as Saka had his worst game of the tournament and Henderson was totally useless. As for the penalties, feel so sorry for them and it was all too easy to predict we would wake up today to a torrent of abuse on social media for them.

Southgate has done a superb job, maybe needs to learn to go for it more with so much attacking flair on the bench.

Oh and big shout out to Pickford who has been brilliant in this tournament, if I was Benitez i'd sell him now when he can get a huge fee as he is usually crap at club level.

 

[Furball]

Grealish is fast taking on mythical status here.

 

[Lillian Thomson]

That’s always the way after failure. The ones not given the opportunity to fail are considered to potentially be the difference.

 

[flibbertyjibber]

Grealish is fast taking on mythical status here.

He probably is, but it would have been nice to find out. His impact on earlier games was big and nobody can deny that.

 

[Uppercut]

Grealish is very good, the delusion is in thinking that swapping him for another very good player would transform the whole team. Football doesn’t really work that way.

 

[dontcloseyoureyes]

People think Mount was anonymous because Southgate literally has him out there as a one man forward press. The gameplan is ****ing dire, I don't care if it got you to the final with a piss easy draw. Dogshit coach.

 

[grecian]

I am not really buying we didn't achieve anything, as it's boringly the first final we have reached in my interminable lifetime. Yet Gareth ****ed up the final, double pivot plus wing backs left us bereft of creativity, and he could have seen it wasn't working and changed it much earlier, I think the rest of it saw that, Saka and Henderson seemed odd types to change it, Sancho, Grealish surely would have been the better options, to stretch the aging Italian defence.

As for pens, meh all Gareths science for it, and in the end it matters naught when the pressures on, not saying that we still shouldn't try a measured approach, but it ain't guaranteed, and I certainly think give Rashford and Sancho five minutes to get into the match, they may have surprised Italy. I actually think Sancho worse treated by Gareth than Grealish this tournament.

Yet again though as everyone says better team on the night won, and I would say well done to the Italians here, but that would be a tad pointless. Don't much want to say well done to the ABE, as it's mot an healthy way to be, he says as he supports mainly Exeter and anyone playing the green slime next season....

 

[mr_mister]

The penalties are what they are. I’m more disappointed with the nigh on two hours we spent creating nothing and an inability to even keep the ball for a handful of passes and to get out of own half. Seven of this team started against Croatia three years ago and were hailed as Southgate’s brave new world, but the whole thing has gone nowhere. It’s all reverted to type, but a lot of people get excited because the players are younger.

Making semi finals and finals at major tournaments is pretty decent progress from what they've done at other cups in my life time

 

[Burgey]

Making semi finals and finals at major tournaments is pretty decent progress from what they've done at other cups in my life time

Yeah but the problem is it just has a sense of de ja vu to it all. It's like yet another generation of England players and fans is condemned to being heroic and pretty spectacular failures. I mean, up til yesterday the England penalty meme from as far back as 90 and 96 was still talked about so often it was ridiculous. That's now going to be this generation's lot as well.

God I love it.

The treatment of those kids who missed the penalties though. FMD the poor buggers. Someone posted yesterday it would have been kinder had Italy ended it in normal or extra time. I know the players would obviously rather get the chance to decide it on penalties than lose earlier in the game, but fmd it's just so, so cruel. Magnificent theatre, of course, but just a cruel lottery.

 

[mr_mister]

i know it's pretty normal to do tricky **** when taking a penalty, but when Rashford did all that stutter step fancy rubbish i remember thinking '**** you wouldn't want to miss this'. i get he wasn't showing off and was trying to put the keeper off to increase his chance of scoring, but i bet he wish he just walked up and talk a normal shot now

 

[Dendarii]

Rashford's penalty was one of those things that looks really clever if it comes off but woe betide you if it doesn't as you're going to look like an absolute plonker.

 

[Red_Ink_Squid]

Rashford's penalty was one of those things that looks really clever if it comes off but woe betide you if it doesn't as you're going to look like an absolute plonker.

Yeah, fortunately for Rashford those stuttered run up penalties are at least we'll established now (if not necessarily universally accepted). At the last Euros an Italian player, Zaza, did a similar run up then missed the target and it was instant meme stuff. He'd also been brought on at the end just to take a penalty too.

 

[Burgey]

Yeah, fortunately for Rashford those stuttered run up penalties are at least we'll established now (if not necessarily universally accepted). At the last Euros an Italian player, Zaza, did a similar run up then missed the target and it was instant meme stuff. He'd also been brought on at the end just to take a penalty too.

I think Socrates went for, if not a stuttered approach then a casual walk up to the spot for his penalty at the 82 WC and hit the bar. Looks so bad when it doesn't come off.

Then again, Socrates was pretty much as great as a player could get, so he probably gets a pass.

Edit: think my recollection is wrong here - he took a penalty in the 82 WC which he made of a shortened approach.

 

[sledger]

I really hate the stuttering run up thing. If I were a coach I'd ban it.

 

[OverratedSanity]

The stutter technically worked as intended tbf, donarumma dived early.

 

[Uppercut]

It’s just the best technique if you master it. A great conventional penalty taker like Kane has scored around 85% of his pens. Hazard and Jorginho are on 87-88% and Bruno 93%.

 

[Pothas]

Ivan Toney. No run up at all.

 

[Burgey]

Bruno 93%.

Yeah but Tyson KO'ed him easily.

Thinking about these stats, are these guys making good numbers because of the stuttering approach, or does their clarity of thought (which I think from a very amateurish POV is the key to taking them well) mean stuttering in their approach doesn't bother them? Clunky way of asking whether it's the approach that gets their numbers higher, or whether they would be that high anyway? Suppose there's no way of knowing.