Would Kevin Pietersen Have Made the SA Team?

[Tom Flint]

Why cant KP alma ab and kallis all play in the same team batting 3 - 6

 

[trundler]

Amla would bat 3.

 

[flibbertyjibber]

Why cant KP alma ab and kallis all play in the same team batting 3 - 6

Because KP wouldn't have made it as a test player had he not come to England and stopped trying to be an all rounder.

 

[Tom Flint]

I doubt that

 

[flibbertyjibber]

Would he have got the amount of cricket in SA with the quota system? He hardly had a great record before he came over here.

 

[Tom Flint]

Of course he would have. He just needed to be more patient. There were a lot worse white players playing in domestic teams then.

 

[wpdavid]

KP the batsmen from 2004 onward would have been selected into any side in the world...

... would KP the batsmen have existed in 2004 if he had not left SA to go to England is another question. I think the move to England gave him the drive to succeed, and focus on batting which he would not necessarily have done in SA. If he had stayed in SA likely he would have been asked to focus as much on his bowling as his batting, in an allrounder role, and probably not become anywhere near as good. When playing for Natal he did not perform very well with either the bat or ball. Was clearly talented but was not a focus of future SA team at the time, as there was clearly other batting talent around. I think he needed that extra 4 years to grow in England.

And that is such a good point. iirc he was an off-spinner who could bat when he left SA Given how good he later became, it's hard to imagine that he wouldn't have been in the frame for a middle order place by the mid 2000s, but moving to England was certainly a factor.

 

[Dendarii]

Would he have got the amount of cricket in SA with the quota system? He hardly had a great record before he came over here.

It wasn't the quota system that prevented him from getting game time, but rather him not being as good at the time as he thought he was (and would later become).

 

[ataraxia]

WI had Worrell, Weekes, Walcott and Sobers for a while in the 50s, although as none of them were at their peak this was a much stronger side on paper than in practice.

For a brief period there, Kanhai was there as well.

 

[ImpatientLime]

It wasn't the quota system that prevented him from getting game time, but rather him not being as good at the time as he thought he was (and would later become).

maybe in my old age the time lines are getting muddled but i'm pretty sure he came to england and gunned it from the word go.

 

[Howe_zat]

maybe in my old age the time lines are getting muddled but i'm pretty sure he came to england and gunned it from the word go.

Yeah. Checking the figures, in his first season in 2001 he averaged 57 and hit 4 tons including a double aged 20. Even better the year after.

 

[StephenZA]

maybe in my old age the time lines are getting muddled but i'm pretty sure he came to england and gunned it from the word go.

He did in Eng, but his first couple of seasons for Natal was terrible... I think he still credits Graham Ford from high school days for his batting though. He was not happy here in SA and he blamed it on quotas. But it was more his attitude and unhappiness that got him in trouble. Same as for Nottinghamshire, Hampshire and England!

 

[Dendarii]

In the season prior to his departure, Pietersen averaged 10.75 in the four matches he played.

http://static.espncricinfo.com/db/ARCHIVE/1999-2000/RSA_LOCAL/SSS/STATS/RSA_SSS_AVS_KZN.html

And not too many non-white players on that list.

 

[ImpatientLime]

what did notts see that natal missed? or was it just a case of natal having a settled batting order? was he seen as too bothersome to give extra responsibility to?

 

[OverratedSanity]

what did notts see that natal missed? or was it just a case of natal having a settled batting order? was he seen as too bothersome to give extra responsibility to?

Its pietersen, so I wouldnt be surprised if it was just personality issues

 

[ImpatientLime]

yeah fair.

 

[wpdavid]

what did notts see that natal missed? or was it just a case of natal having a settled batting order? was he seen as too bothersome to give extra responsibility to?

I think that Pietersen came highly recommended by Clive Rice, who has something of a legendary status at Nottinghamshire, having been a highly successful captain there during the 1980s. I have no idea whether Notts were in D1 or D2 at the time, but either way it's feasible that standards in the CC weren't quite what they were in the SA domestic system. Plus all the personal issues that have already been documented here.

EDIT
Looking it up, Rice was actually the coach at Notts when KP was recruited. Obviously Rice also had plenty of contacts in SA and may even have been involved in the SA domestic game during the English winter.

 

[Tom Flint]

In the season prior to his departure, Pietersen averaged 10.75 in the four matches he played.

http://static.espncricinfo.com/db/ARCHIVE/1999-2000/RSA_LOCAL/SSS/STATS/RSA_SSS_AVS_KZN.html

And not too many non-white players on that list.

Who was ah amla?

 

[ma1978]

Ahmed Amla, Hashims older brother

 

[Magrat Garlick]

captained the Durban Dolphins for a bit