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The ATG Teams General arguing/discussing thread

honestbharani

Whatever it takes!!!
I generally Ambrose to be the overall better bowler, but when it comes to bowling at the best batsman, McGrath is really unparalleled in my time of watching the game. Like how Nadal always seems to play Federer well, he just took his game up a notch against the best of the opposition.
 

pardus

School Boy/Girl Captain
lol, that bloody video title. man knew how to rile up people
LOL... I just looked at the number of dislikes on that video. Allan Donald's All-time XI video on YouTube too similarly suffers from a huge number of dislikes (and that too without any clickbaity title).
Recently there was an ESPN interview of McGrath on YouTube where he rated Lara slightly ahead of Tendulkar, Surprisingly (and thankfully) ESPN didn't use a negative clickbait title to
get more views.
 

Daemon

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Speaking of decent seeds: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zn7bbsfoz7I

Cummins to me is a slightly shorter and faster version of McGrath. Gets some really awkward bounce and moves the ball both ways at pace. He's something special.
Interesting to see that his wickets against England were mostly from either surprising them with slightly shorter stuff or getting it to come into both the left and right handers. But then against India and SL it's mostly getting the outside edge. Wonder if it was a change in his line of attack or whether it's just the respective weaknesses of the batting sides.
 

Burgey

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Interesting to see that his wickets against England were mostly from either surprising them with slightly shorter stuff or getting it to come into both the left and right handers. But then against India and SL it's mostly getting the outside edge. Wonder if it was a change in his line of attack or whether it's just the respective weaknesses of the batting sides.
It's probably the latter and the line they planned to bowl at the different sets of batsmen. He, Haze and Starc have got to the point now where they just give you nothing. Starc getting on board with that way of bowling, along with Haze being about 5% better than he was a couple of years back is what's made them so good atm. Though it was interesting inthat Test doco one of the quicks - may even have been Cummins - said Lyon was the best and most important bowler in the side by a mile. I can get where he's going with that, because if he's capable of bowling long tight spells even on day one, it lets the quicks go about it from the other end pretty much as they please.

If India wants to win out here this summer (assuming it happens) they need to go after Lyon and make Paine get him out of the attack. Chances are they'll be chasing a lot more than they were last time they toured, so Lyon will be very important if they are to win (personally expecting 3-0 or 4-0 to Australia, but who knows)

Edit: Not that Daemon is here, but whenever anyone doubts top level bowlers know what they're doing wrt seam movements and being so accurate, I always refer them to that video of McGrath bowling to Warner in that exhibition T20 where he was miked up and basically just talked everyone precisely through how he would get him out. Was amazing. Would be the same with Cummins and the different lines he bowled in that clip. See also The Testr doco where the bowling group literally decides as a group to adjust the length they are bowling by a matter of inches and do it. Elite bowlers are next level skillful.
 
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TheJediBrah

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He's a very special bowler. Gets something out of even the most lifeless tracks. He's one of the main reasons England won't win a test here again when they next tour.
Am I right in saying that England have only won 3 games total in their last 4 tours to Australia?
 

stephen

Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
Starc, Haze, Cummins and Lyon always had the potential to be a very special attack but were often let down by the batsmen. They've gotten better and Australia's batting has too.
 

Daemon

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Starc, Haze, Cummins and Lyon always had the potential to be a very special attack but were often let down by the batsmen. They've gotten better and Australia's batting has too.
Against India they were also massively let down by Starc
 

Daemon

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amir/sreesanth would have been proud of those no balls. What a ****ing huge no ball and not getting called is the ultimate lol. I guess thats the way it was back in those days
They weren't really no balls according to the rules back then. Where you ended up didn't matter as long as you landed your back foot behind the bowling crease (in line with the stumps). Bowlers would land and then drag the back foot along the crease to get that extra foot or so.
 

Line and Length

Cricketer Of The Year
Gordon Rorke brought the back-foot dragging controversy to its peak in 1959 when he played 4 Test matches.

"A six-foot five-inch (or 1.96 m) "Blond Giant", Rorke was the fastest Australian bowler and accused of throwing by the English press, but this paled beside his excessive dragging. With his seven-foot stride, if dragging his rear foot a yard over the crease he could be only eighteen yards from the batsman when he finally delivered the ball. At times he seemed impossible to score from. Fred Trueman was no balled for dragging his foot a couple of inches over the crease and wrote "It was really annoying as this umpire seemed to allow Gordon Rorke to bowl with both his feet over the front line!". One picture showed him with his rear foot past the bowling crease before he had even begun to drag. Colin Cowdrey joked "I was frightened that he might tread on my toes"

In his test debut Rorke took 3 for 23 off 18.1 eight ball overs (not a bad economy rate) and finished his Test career with 10 wickets 20.3 before ill-health ended his career.
 

Burgey

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Am I right in saying that England have only won 3 games total in their last 4 tours to Australia?
Yeah, all of them in 2010-11. Next year it will be a whole decade since they won a match here. Embarrassing really, given they tour regularly.
 

Burgey

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Against India they were also massively let down by Starc
Yeah Starc lifting his game has made a massive difference tbh. That and Haze being back to his best. Thought he was a bit off in the 12-18 months leading up to the Ashes.
 

TheJediBrah

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Yeah, all of them in 2010-11. Next year it will be a whole decade since they won a match here. Embarrassing really, given they tour regularly.
That is pretty terrible. Even during the 90s-00s when they were getting thrashed every Ashes they still usually won 1 game a series
 

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