Controversial opinions

[Neptune]

Give us your controversial opinions...

Dominic Sibley will be the best opener in test cricket in a couple years time.
Virat Kohli is the worst of the Fab Four in test cricket- flat track bully imo.
Marnus Labuschagne will have 1 poor series and will never return back to good form.
New Zealand are an overrated test team.
England will become world no 1 test team in a couple years time.

 

[MrPrez]

Or, in summary, you're an English cricket fan.

 

[Adders]

I think you spelt deluded wrong in the thread title mate

 

[Flem274*]

uranus shook

 

[Flem274*]

an actual controversial opinion i am entertaining in my head, deciding if i want to run with it.

true pace and true medium pace are harder for test batsmen to face than 'normal' 135kph, assuming bowler skill is equal.

 

[stephen]

an actual controversial opinion i am entertaining in my head, deciding if i want to run with it.

true pace and true medium pace are harder for test batsmen to face than 'normal' 135kph, assuming bowler skill is equal.

Nah, medium pace is easier for test batsmen to face. Limited overs batsmen on the other hand may find mediums harder to get away.

 

[SteveNZ]

Sibley's technique is nowhere near up to being the best Test opener in the world. But hey, at least history shows that England fully back their Test openers and give them enough rope to build their games and become great.

Eh, can't disagree with Kohli after the last month.

Marnus is the real deal. Loves batting.

Overrated? NZ? Just rate us on the amount of wins we've had in the last 6-7 years. Unbeatable at home. Now winning in Asia (not India, mind you). Nah.

Good luck with the #1 Test spot. Just remember that the pitiful effort in NZ didn't count to the WTC but it did count to rankings.

 

[stephen]

With the discovery of Labuschagne Australia are the most versatile side in the world and will hit number 1 in the rankings in the next two years.

 

[TheJediBrah]

an actual controversial opinion i am entertaining in my head, deciding if i want to run with it.

true pace and true medium pace are harder for test batsmen to face than 'normal' 135kph, assuming bowler skill is equal.

depends on the pitch. Generally speaking though, no. Good use of the thread though.

With the discovery of Labuschagne Australia are the most versatile side in the world and will hit number 1 in the rankings in the next two years.

this thread is about controversial opinions stephen

 

[RossTaylorsBox]

Cricket is full of drug cheats, Australia being the worst of them.

 

[cnerd123]

finger spin is the ultimate bowling art form

 

[ImpatientLime]

as much as you might hate kohli, he, kw and smith are ****ing light years ahead of root who will go down as maybe the biggest test cricket disappointment of my lifetime.

i have never seen a player look in such good touch, look so at ease, look so dominant and just completely fail to capitalize on all that repeatedly.

root is a genuine gun. look at him in odi cricket. obviously kohli is ahead of him but he out streaks williamson and smith easily there imo. its all there but it just doesn't happen enough in the red ball game.

 

[Cabinet96]

an actual controversial opinion i am entertaining in my head, deciding if i want to run with it.

true pace and true medium pace are harder for test batsmen to face than 'normal' 135kph, assuming bowler skill is equal.

My guess on this is that the skill level isn't equal in the comparisons we see in international cricket. I.e. the people we see who actually bowl those speeds effectively in international cricket can only do it because they're so skilful, while a lot more 135kph guys are able to survive despite being worse in most other areas of bowling, so the sample is skewed. It's kind of circular logic on my part though. Maybe I only think they're more skilful because they have their success without speed. Hard to prove either way unless all the county division 2 county seamers played loads of tests.

 

[Flem274*]

it's basically part of my attempt to explain the mcgrath/philander/clark/cdg almost beating people for pace or lack of (mcgrath and clark bounce rather than speed). i think batsmen are more in their comfort zone against 135kph straight up and down.

 

[cnerd123]

the thing is when you take pace off the ball you force a batsman to generate their own power through footwork and timing. That's why slower bowling is generally a better challenge of a batsman's technique - you can't simply rely on your reflexes to just get bat on ball to score runs. So until a certain level of cricket, Flem has a point. If I had to face an erratic quick bowler vs an erratic medium one, the medium one could be more challenging for me to put away, simply because I've got to play good cricket shots to put away the bad balls, wheres for the quick bowler his pace will do half the work for me.

But I think once you get to a professional level of cricket, any batsman worthy of the role will be competent enough technique-wise to put away bad balls from a medium pacer. For them, it might be a question of having too much time to think that leads to their dismissal.

 

[cnerd123]

it's basically part of my attempt to explain the mcgrath/philander/clark/cdg almost beating people for pace or lack of (mcgrath and clark bounce rather than speed). i think batsmen are more in their comfort zone against 135kph straight up and down.

very few bowlers that are quicker than McGrath/Philander/Clark are also more skilful than them.

CDG gets quite a lot of movement, and I reckon his lack of pace makes boundaries harder to come by in Tests, which helps him build pressure effectively. Works for the modern generation of batsmen, but IDK if it would have worked maybe two decades ago. Feels like strike rotation is a skill that's generally in decline these days.

 

[Neptune]

as much as you might hate kohli, he, kw and smith are ****ing light years ahead of root who will go down as maybe the biggest test cricket disappointment of my lifetime.

i have never seen a player look in such good touch, look so at ease, look so dominant and just completely fail to capitalize on all that repeatedly.

root is a genuine gun. look at him in odi cricket. obviously kohli is ahead of him but he out streaks williamson and smith easily there imo. its all there but it just doesn't happen enough in the red ball game.

Smith is light years ahead of root, Kohli and Williamson aren’t at all. Root is such a consistent player around the world. He averages 51.55 in England for gods sake, it’s such a difficult country to bat in as India found out in 2018. He gets **** on because of his poor conversion rate, but he regularly makes decent scores. Rarely has Kohli type series’. I feel like his batting has regressed since becoming captain. He’s still such a brilliant batsmen. Williamson and Kohli have been failures in England to be honest. I know Kohli scored a century in England in 2018, but it was one of the worst centuries you’ll ever see. I mean, he was dropped about 7 times. Kane averages 30 in England ffs, 20 in South Africa, 25 in Sri Lanka and of course about 95 in Zimbabwe (to inflate his average). While I’m on about Williamson, I’d just like to point out how overrated he is. To call him light years ahead of root is laughable, root is probably a better batsmen overall tbh. Kane obviously the better captain though.

 

[Cabinet96]

Philander in helpful conditions would swing it a bit both ways, get lots of seam movement and a lot of bounce. Don't think there have been many bowlers in test history who have done those things at genuine pace.

It's definitely the case if you ever do something as simple as driving drills in the nets that there's a pace where you're most comfortable driving and something slower can test your technique more. But I find it only really applies if there's a lot of bounce. I.e. driving a tennis ball bowled overarm can be harder at a slower pace, but not when it's rolled underarm. So maybe players can only get away with that slow pace if they have the combination of height and the ability to move the ball.

Edit: Also generally the faster the bowler the shorter the length is where you can drive on the up I find. Maybe this allows slower (and taller) bowlers to get away with bowling a fuller more attacking length.

 

[TheJediBrah]

it's basically part of my attempt to explain the mcgrath/philander/clark/cdg almost beating people for pace or lack of (mcgrath and clark bounce rather than speed). i think batsmen are more in their comfort zone against 135kph straight up and down.

**** me and you accuse other posters of being biased. I can't even remember the last time I saw a post from you that wasn't massively overrating a NZ cricketer in some form.

anyway as others have said McGrath & Philander aren't successful because they're slow. They're good because they bowl **** all bad balls and move the ball optimally. They are as skilful as it gets.

 

[Flem274*]

very few bowlers that are quicker than McGrath/Philander/Clark are also more skilful than them.

CDG gets quite a lot of movement, and I reckon his lack of pace makes boundaries harder to come by in Tests, which helps him build pressure effectively. Works for the modern generation of batsmen, but IDK if it would have worked maybe two decades ago. Feels like strike rotation is a skill that's generally in decline these days.

strike rotation is more important than ever in the modern game

i wonder if the challenge of facing medium pacers is amplified because every long term medium pacer in international cricket has always bowled to the percentages? mcgrath, philander, clark and even someone more mid range like cdg always keep every mode of dismissal in play. cdg and philander in particular seem to find nip in almost every game even if the other bowlers can't, so one mistake is all they need to get the lbw/caught behind/bowled.

a lot of 135kph blokes often bowl back of a length or in the 'unlucky but not' length or in wide channels. if you're 130kph or less and you do this, you get dropped real quick for looking innocuous, but if you're a 135kph englishman with a kookaburra it's the balls fault and the pitches are too flat.

so basically the shorter leash = medium pacers bowl to the percentages = long career medium pacers are a nightmare to face because they're always threatening your wicket.