DoG's Top 100 Test Batsmen Countdown Thread

[Slifer]

Lara should have made his Test debut couple of years before he actually did (was supposedly kept out because of inter-Island politics when it came to West Indian batsmen selection).
In January 1988, he scored a brilliant 92 on a wet pitch in the Red Stripe Cup against Marshall & Garner when (as usual) rest of his side collapsed. After watching the innings,
Holding said something to the effect of - if he were the selector, Brian Lara would be the first name he would pen down.
Lara would make his Test debut 3 years later.

Lara's Test career could be almost evenly divided into 3 phases.
1. Brilliant first 5 years - his career took off with him scoring a 50 in 8 of his first 10 Test matches which were against Pakistan, South Africa & Australia
2. Abysmal second 5 years - his Test average during this phase was 36. Averaged 20 against Pakistan, 30 against Sri Lanka, 31 against South Africa, 38 against England. Failed against everyone.
3. Stellar last 5 years - scored 500+ runs in a single series against Australia, South Africa, England. Nearly did against Pak too in his final Test series.
He "retired" earlier than he should have (in the sense that he was still the best Test batsman of his side when he retired).

Tbh famous West Indian politics probably forced him to retire sooner than he should have. And as much as I love Lara, he can be a head case at times.

 

[Slifer]

If you take the Top 7 batsmen here(which includes a WK) and the Top 4 bowlers from the bowlers' thread, you get an XI like this.

Hobbs
Bradman
Lara
Tendulkar
Smith
Sobers
Sangakkara
Hadlee
Steyn
Barnes
Muralitharan

Great team !

Great team. But since when is Bradman an opener?? Also, I'd stick to Gilchrist as the WK. Sanga the pure batsman is much much better than sanga the batsman/wk:

Hobbs
Hutton
Bradman*
Smith
Lara
Sobers
Gilchrist +
Hadlee
Steyn
Barnes
Murali

 

[stephen]

The most demoralizing innings I've ever been witness to was Lara's massive double ton at the SCG. It was an important match - Australia finally had the chance to break the Windies domination and win a series. But then Lara strode to the crease and totally schooled Australia from start to finish, as if to say "The West Indies shall rule forever, new talent emerging just as we appear fallible".

Lara would forever be the batsman I feared most in test cricket. He could play innings that no others could. He was brilliant, flamboyant, devestating. He was a charicature of West Indian flair, but a nasty charicature who belted your bowlers into submission.

A joy to watch and a batsman to fear. What a player.

 

[h_hurricane]

Great team. But since when is Bradman an opener?? Also, I'd stick to Gilchrist as the WK. Sanga the pure batsman is much much better than sanga the batsman/wk:

Hobbs
Hutton
Bradman*
Smith
Lara
Sobers
Gilchrist +
Hadlee
Steyn
Barnes
Murali

I didn't think about batting positions before picking up the players Just took the Top 7 batsmen and Top 4 bowlers from each of the epic threads and then played around the batting positions. Just an interesting team, thats all.

 

[stephen]

Tendulkar
Hobbs
Bradman
Smith
Lara
Sobers
Sanga+
Hadlee
Steyn
Barnes
Murali

Would be the batting order I'd go with.

 

[kyear2]

In my humble estimation, when he was on and his mind right, it is hard to imagine there was ever a better batsman. As Slifer mentioned he was at times a massive head case, but what a talent. He was never as consistent as Sachin far less Bradman but was capable of unmatchable feats. It sometimes seemed like he was capable of multiple shots for any given delivery, which made him at times possible to contain and he never played for averages. As he intimated when he retired, his goal was to entertain.

Similar to how Brady is the greatest while I believe Rogers was the best, is how I see the Prince of Port of Spain.

 

[Flem274*]

not a stretch to open with bradman in that team tbh. if there's a batsman who could adapt to being out of position, it's him. i open with him in my aus xi to cram in more h4x middle order players.

 

[kyear2]

not a stretch to open with bradman in that team tbh. if there's a batsman who could adapt to being out of position, it's him. i open with him in my aus xi to cram in more h4x middle order players.

But why take the risk of exposing your best batsman earlier than required.

 

[stephen]

not a stretch to open with bradman in that team tbh. if there's a batsman who could adapt to being out of position, it's him. i open with him in my aus xi to cram in more h4x middle order players.

Yeah but if Bradman's average drops by 20% by opening and Tendulkar's drops by 30%, you're still sacrificing more runs by batting Bradman out of position.

 

[OverratedSanity]

Lara's that rare kind of batsman who combined 'great player' with 'player of memorable innings'. The latter is usually a trope I associate with batsmen in the tier below true greatness like a VVS or a Pietersen. This isnt to say other atg batsmen didnt play great knocks, but it always felt like lara's were far more frequent. Its probably partly down to him being in a kind of perfect situation to produce memorable performances (attacking batsman with a **** ton of flair on a bad team which presented him with repeated "opportunities", if you can call them that, to produce great innings), but it's something I value greatly as a viewer. If I made a list of best batting performances Ive witnessed, a third of the list would probably be Lara.

 

[Malcolm]

Brian Charles Lara was arguably the best placer of cricket ball in its fabled history. Batting came so naturally to him just like his great predecessors Sobers and Richards. It is a tribute to his greatness that he underachieved so much and yet accomplished a hell lot.

Where does Kohli stand in that aspect? I feel he is as good as any, especially in LOs.

 

[h_hurricane]

Where does Kohli stand in that aspect? I feel he is as good as any, especially in LOs.

Yeah, I was thinking the same. One of the shots today which he bisected long on and deep mid wicket was tremendous. And not the first time he has done that.

 

[harsh.ag]

KL does look good with the gloves. Dunno how he feels about keeping.

Bad review there. There was no upside.

 

[srbhkshk]

Yeah but if Bradman's average drops by 20% by opening and Tendulkar's drops by 30%, you're still sacrificing more runs by batting Bradman out of position.

Yeah, but it could also be that Bradman will find a way for his average to not drop at all while Tendy goes down in flames.

 

[Spark]

The best player should get to pick where he wants to bat, as it has been in every cricket team ever.

 

[Slifer]

In my humble estimation, when he was on and his mind right, it is hard to imagine there was ever a better batsman. As Slifer mentioned he was at times a massive head case, but what a talent. He was never as consistent as Sachin far less Bradman but was capable of unmatchable feats. It sometimes seemed like he was capable of multiple shots for any given delivery, which made him at times possible to contain and he never played for averages. As he intimated when he retired, his goal was to entertain.

Similar to how Brady is the greatest while I believe Rogers was the best, is how I see the Prince of Port of Spain.

Just imagine if Lara cared more about his average and was just a tad bit more selfish and cared about his stats. Imagine if he had even half the notouts as Chanders and he easily could have. I remember b4 the '01 series in SL Lara's average was under 50. I believe one of his stated goals was to get his average bk over 50. And he did but the hard way; zero notouts but a mountain of runs. WAG

 

[h_hurricane]

I had Bradman opening in that team because there was only one opener available in the list and thought no one else would fit in there better than the mighty Don. After all, no one else from that middle order would have faced new ball better than him in their playing days. Would love to watch Hobbs and Bradman come out to bat together. One for the ages without doubt.

Tendulkar is technically equipped to handle new ball but I highly doubt about the temperamental part. He was averse to batting anywhere in the top 3. Don't go by his ODI record. A different ball game.

 

[pardus]

Just imagine if Lara cared more about his average and was just a tad bit more selfish and cared about his stats. Imagine if he had even half the notouts as Chanders and he easily could have. I remember b4 the '01 series in SL Lara's average was under 50. I believe one of his stated goals was to get his average bk over 50. And he did but the hard way; zero notouts but a mountain of runs. WAG

What makes it further great is, he had ample number of opportunities to stay not out (if he really wanted to) in matches like these, where he was the 9th or 10th batsman out.
On at least 10 occasions since 2001, he was 8th, 9th or the last batsman out. While batting with the tail, he would often tend to hit out and try to score as many runs as quickly as possible.

https://www.espncricinfo.com/series...nd-test-south-africa-tour-of-west-indies-2005
https://www.espncricinfo.com/series...test-west-indies-tour-of-south-africa-2003-04
https://www.espncricinfo.com/series...nd-test-west-indies-tour-of-sri-lanka-2001-02

 

[Slifer]

What makes it further great is, he had ample number of opportunities to stay not out (if he really wanted to) in matches like these, where he was the 9th or 10th batsman out.
On at least 10 occasions since 2001, he was 8th, 9th or the last batsman out. While batting with the tail, he would often tend to hit out and try to score as many runs as quickly as possible.

https://www.espncricinfo.com/series...nd-test-south-africa-tour-of-west-indies-2005
https://www.espncricinfo.com/series...test-west-indies-tour-of-south-africa-2003-04
https://www.espncricinfo.com/series...nd-test-west-indies-tour-of-sri-lanka-2001-02

Precisely. Add to that the 226 vs oz, 213 vs oz, etc etc.

 

[TestMatch]

Lara had his flaws, but he was one of the most aesthetically beautiful batsmen, his innings were often super dramatic (thanks largely to the WI being in shambles), and his batsmanship had an upper limit which seemed higher than other batsmen.

ABDV is the only batsman I've seen with this quality; the ability to occasionally go places and do things which you never quite saw any other greats go or do.

It's also telling that he's the only batsman in the 10,000 runs club with a strike rate in the 60s.

As for favorite Lara innings, his double century in South Africa is underrated IMO, and he has a couple funny ODI knocks which resemble modern T20 knocks. He was a strange hybrid of old-school test patience, and modern aggression.

It would be interesting to see where Smith ranks on this list. Could he be higher than Sobers?