Which country's All Time XI is the strongest?

[mr_mister]

Hammond is certainly in that elite tier. He had that 905 run series as well as a great reputation for big daddy hundreds

The most common 8 names thrown around as potential second best after Bradman I've seen by cricket fans

Hobbs
Hutton
Hammond
Headley
Pollock
Lara
Tendulker
Grace (though this is a little more complicated to justify)

And now Smith.

Edit - somehow forgot Viv and Sobers. Lol


So there's 11 in the elite argument

I know plenty of people rate say Gavaskar/Ponting/Sanga over Pollock/Headley but the latter 2 have that mystique of an unfinished career hanging around them

 

[aussie tragic]

Meanwhile Victor Trumper is in the wilderness as the best Aussie before Bradman

 

[mr_mister]

He's in the Grace category. You can go beyond his test stats and rate him for pioneering reasons

 

[SillyCowCorner1]

Bradman was the white Headley for all I know.

 

[mr_mister]

But as I proved recently Clem Hill was arguably as good as Trumper(and statistically it isn't even an arguably, Trumper just has more mythos) so it's hard for me to consider him the same way I do Grace

 

[Logan]

Greatest pace bowler too..

Overall, yes.

Tests, maybe not.

 

[Slifer]

Afaic there are big 4 openers:

Hobbs, Hutton, Sutcliffe and Gavaskar

2nd tier:

Ponsford, Greenidge, Hunte, Lawry, Boycott, Sehwag, Hayden, Simpson, Smith, Saeed, Morris etc.

3rd tier:

Gayle, Haynes, Slater, Taylor, Sidhu, Fredericks, etc

On the fence for the likes of Langer and B Richards.

 

[SillyCowCorner1]

Sangakkara was pretty much in the same tier as a Marvan Attapatu.

 

[aussie tragic]

But as I proved recently Clem Hill was arguably as good as Trumper(and statistically it isn't even an arguably, Trumper just has more mythos) so it's hard for me to consider him the same way I do Grace

Proved only to yourself, so doesn't count on CW

 

[mr_mister]

Proved only to yourself, so doesn't count on CW

No I had people agreeing with me in the thread. I'm not bragging btw, a cursory glance at their record will tell you they were as good as each other

 

[trundler]

Hammond is certainly in that elite tier. He had that 905 run series as well as a great reputation for big daddy hundreds

The most common 8 names thrown around as potential second best after Bradman I've seen by cricket fans

Hobbs
Hutton
Hammond
Headley
Pollock
Lara
Tendulker
Grace (though this is a little more complicated to justify)

And now Smith.

Edit - somehow forgot Viv and Sobers. Lol


So there's 11 in the elite argument

I know plenty of people rate say Gavaskar/Ponting/Sanga over Pollock/Headley but the latter 2 have that mystique of an unfinished career hanging around them

Elite - absolutely. Alpha - undecided. IMO of course. I'd say pre war Hobbs was uber alpha whilst post war Hobbs was perhaps not. Sutcliffe wasn't alpha either.

Of course this is all based on my conception of alpha so it may be completely meaningless to everyone else lol.

 

[SillyCowCorner1]

Yeah, conception of alpha is subjective.

 

[OverratedSanity]

I've noticed Sidhu is seriously overrated on CW. Strictly decent opener, nothing more.

 

[the big bambino]

Australian openers: Langer Hayden Slater Simpson Lawry Barnes Morris Woodfull Ponsford Trumper. All good but none stand out from each other. You could pick them according to conditions like Hayden in India. If selection is condition dependent then I'd also consider Laird v WI. Otherwise you could try a middle order champion as an opener. I'd like the look of McCabe to audition as an opener.

 

[stephen]

So assuming first XIs of:

Hayden
Trumper
Bradman
Smith
Waugh
Border
Gilchrist+
Davidson
Warne
Lillee
McGrath

and

Greenidge
Haynes
Richards
Lara
Headley
Sobers
Dujon +
Marshall
Holding
Garner
Ambrose

What would the second XI match up look like?

Ponsford
Simpson
Ponting
Chappell G
Harvey
Clarke
Miller
Healy
Lindwall
O'Reilly
Spoffoth

vs

Hunte
Gayle
Walcott
Weekes
Worrell
Lloyd
Murray DL+
Roberts
Garner
Croft
Gibbs

That would be a mouth watering matchup. If Spoffoth is perceived as being impossible to rate and Australia had to pick someone else, either McDermott or Gillespie come in and add a weak link to the side (although both bowlers were very good).

 

[SillyCowCorner1]

So assuming first XIs of:

Hayden
Trumper
Bradman
Smith
Waugh
Border
Gilchrist+
Davidson
Warne
Lillee
McGrath

and

Greenidge
Haynes
Richards
Lara
Headley
Sobers
Dujon +
Marshall
Holding
Garner
Ambrose

What would the second XI match up look like?

Ponsford
Simpson
Ponting
Chappell G
Harvey
Clarke
Miller
Healy
Lindwall
O'Reilly
Spoffoth

vs

Hunte
Gayle
Walcott
Weekes
Worrell
Lloyd
Murray DL+
Roberts
Garner
Croft
Gibbs

That would be a mouth watering matchup. If Spoffoth is perceived as being impossible to rate and Australia had to pick someone else, either McDermott or Gillespie come in and add a weak link to the side (although both bowlers were very good).

I like the Windies 2nd XI more than the first.

Which begs the question, which XI's team would a guy like Shiv Chanderpaul fit into?

 

[trundler]

Chanders over Walcott, who was a bit of a HTB. Massive ~20 run difference between home and away averages and he doesn't have the reputation Worrell and Weekes do. Worrell-Weekes-Chanderpaul-Lloyd.

Also Hill over Clarke in the A team.

 

[stephen]

I like the Windies 2nd XI more than the first.

Which begs the question, which XI's team would a guy like Shiv Chanderpaul fit into?

Chanders could possibly play ahead of Lloyd in the second XI. Otherwise he's in the third XI along with Rowe, Kanhai and a few others who were great but don't get talked about because their not usually in contention for the first XI.

 

[aussie tragic]

If selection is condition dependent then I'd also consider Laird v WI

Lol at picking an opener in an all-time XI that never scored a test century...

Beautiful 92 and 75 on debut though

 

[mr_mister]

Chanders over Walcott, who was a bit of a HTB. Massive ~20 run difference between home and away averages and he doesn't have the reputation Worrell and Weekes do. Worrell-Weekes-Chanderpaul-Lloyd.

Also Hill over Clarke in the A team.

Weekes was a massive minnow basher

And Worrell burnt out a bit during the back half of his career after initial ATG numbers

You can poke big holes in all the of the 3 W's records