S.Kennedy
International Vice-Captain
Make the Aussies their bunny in their own backyard.
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How did India become the No. 1 Test Side?
- Thread starter sumantra
- Start date
flibbertyjibber
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Been easily beaten home and away by England though.
S.Kennedy
International Vice-Captain
Without Steyn. I'm beginning to think that 2015 win of England was a fluke as everything else about England's test team since Strauss and Bayliss took over points to complete and utterly woeful terminal decline. England couldn't even beat the West Indies away. They drew Pakistan at home.
flibbertyjibber
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Steyn isn't a factor now and hasn't been for years sadly. His injuries mean you have to discount the guy.
SeamUp
International Coach
He sorted out his long-term shoulder & bicep issue.
As he said in an interview recently he feels refreshed and ready to go and may play longer than his SA contemporaries as he isn't married or close to getting married and having children.
This last injury was like a batsman getting hit on the finger and getting a fractured or broken finger. Basically a cricket injury that can happen at any time.
I certainly wouldn't be writing him off especially what he showed in that first innings at Newlands.
As he said in an interview recently he feels refreshed and ready to go and may play longer than his SA contemporaries as he isn't married or close to getting married and having children.
This last injury was like a batsman getting hit on the finger and getting a fractured or broken finger. Basically a cricket injury that can happen at any time.
I certainly wouldn't be writing him off especially what he showed in that first innings at Newlands.
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S.Kennedy
International Vice-Captain
The last major test team India defeated away was 2007 (England). South Africa have won three back-to-back tours of Australia, and also defeated England in 2012. England beat India in 2012 and South Africa in 2015. Australia never lose in South Africa and came closest to beating India in India than anyone else. I'd go,
South Africa
Australia
India
England (England are just shite that even their away wins do not save them).
South Africa
Australia
India
England (England are just shite that even their away wins do not save them).
Slifer
International Captain
I kinda feel the same about RSA but then they went and got soundly beaten by England and they really should've drawn in NZ so that muddies it for me. If they can beat Oz at home for the first time since readmission it'll be a huge step in the right direction.
Slifer
International Captain
Sigh:
India has beaten everyone at home and dominated all except for Oz.
Away, they'll likely lose to every team barring WI, SL, BAN and maybe PAK.
Australia beats everyone at home except for RSA.
Away they'll likely lose to Eng, PAK, India, SL, lose /draw Ban and win or draw in RSA, win away to WI and nz
RSA win at home vs all except maybe Oz and England.
Lose away to England, India, draw/lose PAK/SL win every where else.
England really isn't in this contest.
People really being disingenuous to India imo and I'm not even an Indian fan. India struggling to win in NZ, Eng Oz or nz. Is more than balanced by the fact that Oz drew in Bangladesh and lost badly to SL and have consistently lost at home to RSA. RSA has yet to win at home to Oz and lost home and away to Eng and got smashed in India so they aren't worthy either.
weldone
Hall of Fame Member
Australia lost 0-3 in Sri Lanka, so I'd swap them with India. Other points sound fine.
Furball
Evil Scotsman
England had a half fit Anderson for that series.
S.Kennedy
International Vice-Captain
How do South Africa always beat Australia in Australia, and Australia always beat South Africa in South Africa? This has pedigree: commencing 1993-4 Australia have won five series and drawn the other two in South Africa whilst South Africa have won three in a row in Australia beginning 2008-09 (obviously the Warnes and McGraths had to all retire before this could happen).
Yes the wickets are similar but this should not imply a weakening in your own country.
Yes the wickets are similar but this should not imply a weakening in your own country.
GotSpin
Hall of Fame Member
Yeah if he pulled his shoulder again I would have called curtains on his career.
The toss decides games in SL.
A touring side hasn't won batting second in SL in over 8 years.
Australia lost all 3 tosses.
When India won 3-0 there, they won all three tosses.
When SA won 1-0, they won 2/3 tosses.
I wouldn't hang too much **** on Australia, India were the last side to win batting second there, like I said that was about 4 tours ago for them.
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Motorwada
Banned
Do you even read the thread? Black Warrior gave rebuttals to everything. Pakistan had a record chase in 2015. Even in the first test of the series they chased there. Bangladesh won a match chasing there in early 2017 (almost same team Aus faced).
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Slifer
International Captain
Oz lost because they were outplayed. Using the toss is really grasping at straws. Nobody made excuses when india lost in badly in England for example, they were just outplayed.
Black_Warrior
Cricketer Of The Year
South Africa won their last tour series in New Zealand, with the last one in 2017. Not sure they have ever lost a test series in New Zealand.
The thing with assessing South Africa's test team is that due to a variety of factors, they really haven't had a full strength first choice test side since World Cup 2015 which means the last time they did was January 2015 against West Indies
I mean sure everyone has injuries and all that but South Africa's issues were not just stray injuries but a variety of other factors, the most important being the AB factor.
In Bangladesh in 2015, they had two rained out test matches which they would have won 2-0 and earned some more points
Against England at home in 2015, they Steyn broke down and whatever you might say about Steyn now, in December 2015, he was definitely the first choice fast bowler and he had never been out of the game for so long at that time. I believe Philander was injured for that series too so they basically had two of their best bowlers out for a home series. Take out Starc and Hazelwood, or Anderson/Broad and then judge their attacks.
Then in 2016, they looked to be finally coming together but AB at first had major injuries that kept him out of the New Zealand and Australia away series and then he finally took a break. The fact that they still won 4 series in that time without AB, Steyn is a testament to how quickly the new guys Rabada, QDK stepped up.
In 2017, the England loss was a major setback but out of 4 test matches, they didn't have their best XI for the first 2. Rabada got banned, and Faf was out for the first. Philander had injuries throughout the series although Morkel stepped up.
Watching the India-South Africa series, one thing is clear though - South Africa might be able to replace Steyn and guys like Rabada, Lungi have stepped up big time while the return of Morkel has helped greatly. But there is no replacement for AB. I know that CW has it's share of contrarians who like to say "AB is not all that" but South Africa is not a great batting side and the absence of AB just makes that batting extremely vulnerable. Take the first 2 tests against India, you take out AB's contribution in both the games and then consider how those matches might have gone.
The fact that they're still number 2 in world cricket and only have one major loss - the England series in the last 2 years speaks volumes of their depth. I don't think any of India, Australia or England would have the same record as South Africa if you take out Kohli, Smith or Root for a year.