How good is Sanga?

[Migara]

MoYo and Sanga both have peak rating higher than Tendulkar. Both are surely better.

MEh! MoYo is #1 for 83 tests?

 

[Riggins]

Agree. Wagon wheel is useless in finding out if a batsman frequently played pull or cut. I found your method more accurate and just for fun counted the same for Rahane's inning. Anyway, having seen that knock I already knew that he played plenty of those. It was not a surprise to me. Also, we don't really need to do all this counting. Most of us know which players are normally good against short balls.

Yeah for sure. In no way do I think Sangakkara isn't good against the short stuff either. Outrageous claims like he scores the majority of his runs from the pull or that he invented the question mark just piss me off though.

 

[Migara]

Actually he's right after Lara (just), but my ratings is a work in progress - i'm always looking at ways to improve it.

Also, he is at a career peak right now, it's unlikely that he will bat like this into the future, so it's slightly unfair to rate him with batsmen that have already retired in a sense (since he is likely to have a period of decline before retirement). I would say he is safely top 10 all time though.

Do not feed senile trolls.

 

[viriya]

I dont get how you can say that and still insist Sanga deserves to be up there with Sachin and Lara.

Because he has made runs when all others have failed as well. Lara probably was in that situation for most of the latter half of his career and I rate him highly partly because of that. Tendulkar on the other hand more often than not had great teammates that also got a lot of runs and came into bat when there was no pressure with the platform set for him to make a ton.

 

[simonlee48]

MEh! MoYo is #1 for 83 tests?

I don't understand what are trying to convey here?

Blocky made 4-5 statements about peak rating in that post and also one statement about being number 1 for #83 tests for Sanga. Both are irrelevant in proving if he Sanga is better than Sachin. I was making fun of that peak logic argument which he repeated 4-5 times in that post.

Now, can you elaborate, what you are trying to say here?

 

[Migara]

Trying to show that your nit picking of the part of the argument is utter stupid. Nothing more, nothing less.

 

[simonlee48]

Trying to show that your nit picking of the part of the argument is utter stupid. Nothing more, nothing less.

Nitpicking? He made two irrelevant points. You are telling me that if some one makes 2 irrelevant points, we need to either laugh at both points or don't laugh at all. Peak rating was his major point in that post, in case you missed.

ps... more statistics for you by way of the Reliance ICC Rankings

Sangakkara has the highest number of tests (83) as #1 ranked batsman in the world.
Sangakkara has a higher highest rating (938) than Tendulkar ever had (898)
Sangakkara's current test ranking (920) is higher than Tendulkar has ever been rated.
Only Ponting of any modern batsman has ever rated higher at 942.
Viv Richards highest rating is equal to Sangakkara's highest rating.

But yes, Tendulkar must be better right?

 

[Blocky]

I predict Blocky's response will be "they didn't bowl short to him often because of his complete mastery of the cut and pull."

No, they just learnt that bowling short to him made no sense as it wasn't actually a weakness like some idiot here claims.

 

[NUFAN]

I dont get how you can say that and still insist Sanga deserves to be up there with Sachin and Lara.

Is Sachin now known as a brilliant batsman on seaming tracks where the match lasts 3 days?

 

[Singh Is King]

Nitpicking? He made two irrelevant points. You are telling me that if some one makes 2 irrelevant points, we need to either laugh at both points or don't laugh at all. Peak rating was his major point in that post, in case you missed.

You know things are tough when you are using ICC rankings as your argument. Look at Tendulkars record against arguably the best team ever Australia home and AWAY. His away records piss all over Sangakaras. Lara v Tendulkar is a debate. Sangakara v Tendulkar is not a debate for so many reasons which people have listed but get ignored by these Sangakara fans.
Yes Sangakara is a great player, top 15 ever.
But Tendulkar and Lara tier he is not in.

Tier 1- Bradman (has his own tier really), Tendulkar,Sobers,Sir Viv, Brian Lara.
How can you put Sanga in that tier ?

 

[CWB304]

This new suggestion of Sangakkara as being comparatively weak against the short ball is bizarre. Perhaps an act of desperation given that the consensus on this thread is clearly moving in favour of promoting Sanga to the Lara/Tendulkar tier. Right from first noticing Sangakkara a couple of years after he came into the SL Test side one thing that stood out about him was how incredibly quick he has always been to pick up length against fast bowling. When he's not in position to pull or hook in a controlled fashion he sways out of the way. Occasionally he will wear one on the body. Bowlers know this so he I can't recall him having ever being targeted by the short ball - perhaps someone can set me right here - and cannot recall having heard any whisper of him being considered as being suspect technically against hostile short pitched bowling.

The reason he is not particularly known for his hooking and pulling not because he is not proficient at those shots but because generally speaking short pitched bowling is a very low percentage delivery against Sanga as he does not always take it on and therefore bowlers have not tended to attack him in that way. If it is a perfectly targeted delivery which surprises him and follows him of course there is a chance of a short ball getting him out like any other batsman. But generally speaking a well directed short ball will be a dot ball as he will defend, sway out of the way or allow it to hit him as appropriate. Anything else will be punished. He can play all types of pull, hook and cut with authority.

As Dravid said, "no apparent weaknesses". Which is why the man's average is nigh on 60.

 

[harsh.ag]

This thread.... O this thread....

Of course the people who think Sangakkara is better than Sachin et al, and that he is the best since Bradman have a valid argument, regardless of what others think.

You don't have to agree, but it's not a delusional claim.

Just give it a rest.

 

[marc71178]

Even your rating has Kumar second best (equal) since Bradman, all time.

Well my rating has 5 of his contemporaries as being ahead of him.

 

[indiaholic]

This thread.... O this thread....

Of course the people who think Sangakkara is better than Sachin et al, and that he is the best since Bradman have a valid argument, regardless of what others think.

You don't have to agree, but it's not a delusional claim.

Just give it a rest.

I think that is the basis for this thread. I do believe it is a delusional claim. Jassy clearly believes it is a delusional claim. And I don't see any argument so far that has convinced me otherwise.

 

[91Jmay]

How can anyone think Sanga being better than Sachin is delusion? I get you might disagree, but its not delusion.

 

[CWB304]

I think that is the basis for this thread. I do believe it is a delusional claim. Jassy clearly believes it is a delusional claim. And I don't see any argument so far that has convinced me otherwise.

The basis for the thread is the OP, in which I made no such claim. But as it happens, given Sangakkara's subsequent performances in places such as England where there had previously been question marks over his record, I now rate post-Viv batsmen in the order Lara > Sanga > Tendulkar.....with Dravid, Ponting and Kallis occupying the next rung down.

 

[CWB304]

How can anyone think Sanga being better than Sachin is delusion? I get you might disagree, but its not delusion.

Some people define "delusional" as any opinion contrary to one which they hold dear. And don't forget that Indians have little to cling on by way of sporting success, as evinced by continued pathetic performances at events like the Olympics and - dare I mention it? - the Commonwealth Games. Even cricket - the game itself, not its shorter derivatives - has not exactly been a happy hunting ground. For which reasons I'm happy to turn a blind eye to blinkered Tendlya idolatry.

 

[cnerd123]

Delusion is a strong word. I do believe thinking Sanga is the same class as Sachin/Lara is blinkered and a view one will only come to based on pure statistics and not actually following the careers of the batsmen and watching them bat. Even statistically, Sanga has holes in his records, but those who are in the Best After Bradman camp dont think these holes are significant enough and thus wont be convinced by any arguments put forward.

FWIW I happily rate Sanga in Tier 2 with Dravid, Kallis, Ponting etc. out of modern gteats. Sachin and Lara do come above.

 

[OverratedSanity]

I definitely rate Tendulkar higher, quote a bit higher at the moment, but it's definitely not delusional to rate Sanga higher.

This generation for me:

Tendulkar- Lara - Ponting
Waugh - Dravid - Kallis - Sanga
Hayden - Sehwag - Inzamam - Younis - Smith - Gilchrist

 

[Singh Is King]

Tendulkar or Sanga

Just a poll.