Top ten greatest bowlers and batsmen of all time

[smash84]

he may have missed out the matches that Bond and Akhtar were on the field

 

[Prince EWS]

Surely Walsh, Kumble, Bond, Akhtar > Anderson

Would take Anderson comfortably over Bond.

 

[smash84]

and Anderson over Akhtar?

 

[Prince EWS]

and Anderson over Akhtar?

Not yet, but I reckon I might say yes by the time Anderson retires. Shoaib was an awesome bowler when he was on the park but 46 Tests is not a great deal of service in this day and age. Anderson's been about as good as Shoaib was for the last 30 or so Tests of his career so if he can keep that going for another two-three years then he'll eclipse him I reckon. It's a big if though really.

 

[NUFAN]

Not yet, but I reckon I might say yes by the time Anderson retires. Shoaib was an awesome bowler when he was on the park but 46 Tests is not a great deal of service in this day and age. Anderson's been about as good as Shoaib was for the last 30 or so Tests of his career so if he can keep that going for another two-three years then he'll eclipse him I reckon. It's a big if though really.

Yeah, if you look at Anderson's figures since Strauss took over the captaincy, his record and Shoaib's is comparative.

Jason Gillespie is ahead of both of them though.

 

[smash84]

Jason epilepsy was quite decent before his post 2004 fits

 

[Mike5181]

Seen:

1.Glenn McGrath
2.Shane Warne
3.Muttiah Muralitharan
4.Allan Donald
5.Shaun Pollock
6.Shane Bond
7.Shoiab Ahktar
8.Dale Steyn
9.Courtney Walsh
10.Jason Gillespie

1.Sachin Tendulkar
2.Brian Lara
3.Ricky Ponting
4.Jacques Kallis
5.Rahul Dravid
6.Steve Waugh
7.Inzaman Ul-Haq
8.Kumar Sangakkara
9.Shivnarine Chanderpaul
10.Mohammad Yousuf

Allrounders
1.Jacques Kallis
2.Shaun Pollock
3.Christopher Cairns
4.Andrew Flintoff
5.Daniel Vettori

 

[kyear2]

I'll give you a special preview of my upcoming final versions of my top 100 test batsmen and bowlers lists by releasing the top 10s now

Test Batsmen:

1 DG Bradman 1410
2 BC Lara 913
3 GS Sobers 911
4 JB Hobbs 901
5 SR Tendulkar 893
6 SM Gavaskar 879
7 GA Headley 874
8 L Hutton 871
9 RT Ponting 867
10 WR Hammond 861

Test Bowlers:

1 M Muralitharan 1103
2 SF Barnes 1084
3 Sir RJ Hadlee 1051
4 MD Marshall 985
5 CEL Ambrose 946
6 GD McGrath 931
7 Imran Khan 903
8 WJ O'Reilly 900
9 SK Warne 890
10 CV Grimmett 880

Don't think this is too much of a spoiler since the ratings have obviously changed but the bowling ratings are obviously heavily influenced by wpm. Hope its not as influenced this time.

 

[Agent Nationaux]

Waqar
Wasim
Shoaib
Donald
Steyn
Pollock
McGrath
Ambrose
Asif
Bond

 

[Paul S]

Funny how people pick Warne in the top 2 or 3 bowlers of all time. He never ran through an Indian batting line-up, and it's glaringly obvious that Indians have been the best players of spin for the past few decades. He failed to deliver a single brilliant performance against the best throughout his career in both formats of the game, then people pick him in the top 3 bowlers of all time. I can understand picking him as one of top 5 bowlers in the past couple of decades, but a bowler with such an obvious weakness against the best making it to the top 3 of all time is ludicrous.

Marshall, Hadlee, Imran, Ambrose, McGrath these guys performed well against their best opponents quite a few times.

 

[Howe_zat]

Hi Paul.

That seems a little circular to me. Did Warne fail because he couldn't take down the best players of spin in his career, or were the best players of spin considered so because they could play Warne?

I also note you've picked Marshall and McGrath despite neither of them running through the best players of pace in their time, what with being on the same team. Who do you consider the best spinner, seeing as all your bowlers are pacemen? Or do you think bowling spin is inherently less impressive?

 

[Migara]

That seems a little circular to me. Did Warne fail because he couldn't take down the best players of spin in his career, or were the best players of spin considered so because they could play Warne?

That would have been circular if Warne was the only spinner available in the world. That isn't the case and there were two or three spinners who did run through Indian batting lineups.

And if you were wondering, Murali, Saqlain and Mendis ran through Indian sides in varying frequencies.

 

[Paul S]

Hi Paul.

That seems a little circular to me. Did Warne fail because he couldn't take down the best players of spin in his career, or were the best players of spin considered so because they could play Warne?

I also note you've picked Marshall and McGrath despite neither of them running through the best players of pace in their time, what with being on the same team. Who do you consider the best spinner, seeing as all your bowlers are pacemen? Or do you think bowling spin is inherently less impressive?

Actually it's not circular at all. Indians were the best simply because they played spin bowling (not just Warne) much better than others in that era (1990-2010). It was a clear weakness Warne had throughout his career. Saqlain and Muralidaran did put on match winning performances against India.

Obviously you can't blame them for not getting a chance to bowl at their own countrymen. Didn't Marshall do well against Australia and England? Highlighted those 5 bowlers because of the way they performed well against top opponents. I have nothing against spin bowling. If I had to pick one spinner from the ones I've seen, I'd go for Muralidaran. His ability to produce wicket taking spells against India gives him the edge. Warne couldn't lift his game against the best batting line ups.

Anyway, on all-time greats - Comparing players across eras is difficult. It becomes almost nonsensical when you consider how so many factors change over time.

 

[Ikki]

That would have been circular if Warne was the only spinner available in the world. That isn't the case and there were two or three spinners who did run through Indian batting lineups.

And if you were wondering, Murali, Saqlain and Mendis ran through Indian sides in varying frequencies.

The only player in the above that did better than Warne in India against India was Saqlain and while he was good for a time, no one would put him on Warne's level.

It was a clear weakness Warne had throughout his career. Saqlain and Muralidaran did put on match winning performances against India.

Only Saqlain did in India. Murali did so only in SL. And bowling spin in SL isn't like bowling spin in Australia. Warne has a better record in India against India than Murali does.

And Warne also had several injury problems during that period, which coincided with many of his India series.

Regardless, it's not like Warne was the only spinner getting pummelled. All of them were.

 

[Migara]

The only player in the above that did better than Warne in India against India was Saqlain and while he was good for a time, no one would put him on Warne's level.

Only Saqlain did in India. Murali did so only in SL. And bowling spin in SL isn't like bowling spin in Australia. Warne has a better record in India against India than Murali does.

And Warne also had several injury problems during that period, which coincided with many of his India series.

Regardless, it's not like Warne was the only spinner getting pummelled. All of them were.

THe difference is Warne never did it against India anywhere. Murali at least did it in SL where the pitches are like second home for Indian batsmen.

And if you insist, this is regarded as one of the best displays of spin bowling by a foreign spinner in India.

 

[benchmark00]

This should be interesting, I've never seen a Warne v Murali debate on CW.

 

[Paul S]

Only Saqlain did in India. Murali did so only in SL. And bowling spin in SL isn't like bowling spin in Australia. Warne has a better record in India against India than Murali does.

And Warne also had several injury problems during that period, which coincided with many of his India series.

Regardless, it's not like Warne was the only spinner getting pummelled. All of them were.

You are just looking at averages. They both had similar averages in India I think (don't have the stats with me right now). Muralidaran bowled a brilliant spell where he took 5 wickets for about 20 runs in 7 or 8 overs to restrict India. Warne never managed that.

Anyway, my point is Warne shouldn't be considered as one of the top 3 all-time bowlers (rather than Muralidaran being better than him) because of the weakness I pointed out. He never ran through India home or away. ODI performance was even worse if I'm not mistaken.

Debate about these two spinners has been done many times on various sites. Both did well against most teams, but only Muralidaran was able to trouble Indian batting of that era. That's why I picked him. I think we all know both of them were great bowlers. So let's put it as - best leg spinner - Warne, best off spinner - Muralidaran.

 

[ankitj]

Ikki check your facts. Murali did do it in India.

http://www.espncricinfo.com/ci/engine/match/226362.html

Look at the batsmen he dismissed in the first inning there. If you are trying to argue that there was no difference between the performances of two spinners against India, you simply haven't seen them play against India. Give it up man, try some other argument.

 

[ankitj]

Don't think this is too much of a spoiler...

Hadn't seen this spoiler before. I quite like these lists, for both batsmen and bowlers.

 

[OverratedSanity]

Top ten that I've seen:

Batsmen:
Tendulkar
Lara
Ponting
Dravid
Kallis
Gilchrist
Steve Waugh
Pietersen
Sangakkara
Inzamam

Bowlers:
Warne
Ambrose
McGrath
Murali
Steyn
Donald
Waqar
Walsh
Wasim
Akhtar