masterblaster said:
By the way, I'm from Melbourne too mate, whereabouts in Melbourne are you?
I live in Essendon.
masterblaster said:
Why do all the 'smart marks' or 'internet wrestling community' hate him so much?
He provides so much entertainment to everybody, yet people still hate him...
Why?
masterblaster said:
Go for it mate, but I do hope you give me better reasons than 'Triple H is holding down talent', 'He's a political demon backstage' and better reasons than the 'necrophilia' angle because I've read all that over the internet where the Triple H haters congregate. Even in one of his interviews, Triple H has admitted to the necrophilia angle being one of the worst angles he's been involved in and that it was Vince's idea (no surprises there).
This was what I mean by bias. Look at your first question. You asked why do smarks hate Triple H. Yet, before a discussion even begins you wipe off the table his political influence because 'you've heard it all before'. How is that fair? Would you like me to argue that people hate him because of his big nose? Because that would make my argument weak, correct? It’s like asking me to explain why Nehra is a poor bowler, but demanding that I argue something other than he has no consistent line and length because you’ve already heard that. Your question was, 'why do the IWC hate him?' If you already know the answer to that, as it seems you do (even if you don’t agree with it), why ask?
It's already obvious that I'm in the position of Henry Fonda in 12 Angry Men. 11 jury men are voting guilty, and I some how have to convince them all that the defendant is not guilty. This isn't going to be an easy task, especially when my evidence is thrown out the window because it's been heard before.
Well I’ll begin anyway, although my concern that this will go in circles still exists. If you’re willing to read a lot, then it’s on.
Let’s go back in time. WWF - 1998/99. Triple H has been in an awesome mid-card feud with The Rock. The Ladder Match at SummerSlam 98 for the IC title was amazing. Triple H is rising, he’s improving, he’s receiving more and more fan reaction. He’s been getting better and better ever since Shawn had to ‘retire’ due to his back injury after WM 14, and Triple H took over DX. He had the world’s attention, he was fresh. Triple H was good.
The WWF booking team know that both Austin and Undertaker, at the time the WWF’s two biggest stars, were going to take time off. Now after kicking WCW’s ass ever since WM 14, the last thing the WWF wanted to do was hand back the ratings to them. In 1999 Austin and Taker were the big daddies (Yes Rock/Austin happened at Mania, but Austin vs. The Ministry was the main angle), however the WWF were slowly building up Trips to take the main event spot, along with The Rock who had already been built ever since Survivor Series 98. They had Trips turn heel at Mania 19, they had him in the Corporation, the Corporate Ministry and so on. Finally Austin and Taker are temporarily gone, and Triple H has beat Big Show at Survivor Series for the WWE title. Holy hell we have the new main heel.
Still, the WWF needed Trips to be mega over. He had Steph, he had Vince’s backing, he had a lot of smart booking to push him as a heel. But was he credible? Not yet. Enter Foley. THE MOST selfless guy ever in wrestling. More so than The Rock (who could job 100 times and still be over), more so than Angle, Jericho etc. Triple H beat Foley clean at the Royal Rumble (Street Fight) and No Way Out (HIAC) in two amazing matches. Triple H then eliminated Foley at Mania. Triple H is definitely credible now. Bingo. Smart booking works. Unpolitical booking works. But why was Foley the man to put Triple H over? Because he had credibility. The fans loved him, no matter how much he jobbed. The minute he was thrown off the HIAC at KOTR 98, Foley was immortal in the marks’ eyes. (that’s casual fans – just in case some don’t know). Along with The Rock, Triple H
OWNED the year 2000, main eventing PPVs and being a solid heel champ. His feud with Austin was kick ass, and he continued into 2001 on top of his game.
This logic has always been used. Hogan put Yokozuna, Undertaker and Ultimate Warrior over. Bret Hart put Austin and Shawn over. The big men jobbing to the next stars has, and will always put people over if done correctly. There’s no disputing that.
So why the history lesson you ask? Simple. The WWE (as it known now) today is stuck in a hole, and it’s going to be tough for it to get out of. Why? Well let’s see. Since 2002 the WWE has lost Rock, Austin and Lesnar (who they were banking on to be their next top man), and on top of that Taker competes at a minimal rate. Now this problem could have been avoided back in 2001/02, but it wasn’t. Why? Because of two things. The great Triple H (and I admit, he is great) used his influence, and the WWE booked for the short-term… not the long term.
So Triple H is injured after 4 years straight of quality wrestling and feuds in 2001. Along with that The Rock is temporarily gone. Lucky for the WWE, Austin returned and took over the main heel status, and Taker was back (in 2000). See that’s fine, they’ve still got all their top stars. However they knew that they needed to push future talent. So they did: Angle (who admittedly was pushed in 2000, and at the time was their goldmine) as well as Benoit and Jericho (who immediately main evented after Jericho’s injury) were pushed. Following the failed Invasion angle (really how the hell did the WWE fail an angle like this?) Jericho was given the world title. He beat Rock and Austin in a row. Not clean, but hey the WWE gotta start somewhere. Jericho ends up defeating Rock at Royal Rumble 2002 and Austin at No Way Out 2002 (with the help of the NOW, wow that’s some short-term booking). Enter Triple H.
Okay, did you mark out when Triple H returned? I admittedly did. Did you know that Triple H was going to win the Royal Rumble? I did. It was obvious. Was I angry? No. It was logical booking, as the fans were eating up Trips. The problem lies here… Triple H vs. Jericho was money. Remember Jericho “won” the title off Triple H in 2000, but it “never happened” in storylines. Remember how the crowd blew the roof off? Jericho was over, despite not being at ME status.
Okay so Jericho/Trips begins after Triple H wins back his title shot (which he lost to Angle at No Way Out). But why add Steph MB? Why? Why would you take the heat and attention away from Jericho… the champ, and make the feud Triple H vs. Steph, despite Jericho being the one who deserves to main event Mania? You cannot answer that, and you know it. It’s illogical booking. On top of that, the angle involved Triple H still carrying his quad injury, and his quad muscle was “hanging by a thread”. Wow, Jericho should kick his ass easily right? Bad booking. You must be asking: “why blame Triple H?” Well I’ll get to that.
So Triple H
DESTROYS Jericho at Mania 18. We all knew he was going to win, but why bury him? Who knows. So Jericho couldn’t beat a cripple with the help of the cripple’s ex-wife. Great. Triple H’s title ends up being cut short because the WWE were short sighted, and milked the Hogan nostalgia for all they could. On to Judgment Day.
Triple H vs. Jericho continues. Jericho has already been buried by Trips at Mania, on the biggest stage of them all. But that’s not enough. Triple H has to DRILL THE NAIL IN THE COFFIN by kicking his ass cleanly at Judgment Day as well. That’s it! Jericho’s credibility, which he slowly gained during his title reign (mind you it wasn’t a well booked title reign), is dead.
Triple H then RUINS Kane’s character. I don’t care if the Katey Vick angle wasn’t Triple H’s idea. Kane was embarrassed, he was made to look weak during the whole feud. You know what happens when someone is made to look weak during the feud? They WIN the blow off. Especially if they are a face. Yet Triple H beats Kane, Kane’s character is destroyed and doesn’t recover until the is unmasked. Triple H at work again.
However, later in the year, Triple H loses to Shawn Michaels… not once… but TWICE! SummerSlam 2002 in the unsanctioned match, and Survivor Series 2002 in the Elimination Chamber. Is this fair? Don’t bother answering. I was cheering Michaels when he returned. I marked out, I’m not ashamed to admit that. But Jericho was dead. Kane was dead. This saddens me
Obviously you and Triple H fans don’t mind, because Triple H has the belt and is dominating Raw, so who cares right?
Following the
amazingly crap feud with Steiner, where Steiner/Triple H at the Rumble was arguably the worst match of the year, Triple H began to feud with one of my personal favourites going back to the WCW days… Booker T. When Booker T threw Rock out of the ring in the battle royal for number one contendership, I jumped up and down like a 6 year old. I EXPECTED A BOOKER T WIN! All logic pointed towards this. Booker T was RACIALLY DESTROYED by Triple H. He was made to stand there and take it, while Triple H insulted him, and his race. Fine, the WWE haven’t had any moralistic value in years. So it bothered me, but I got over it… until Mania 19.
Triple H buried Booker T, just like he did with Jericho. Booker should have won, and no not just in my biased opinion. Every smark knows it. Every one of them. Booker T should have won the blow off, because that’s how booking works. When someone is racially denigrated… they win.
Fine, Triple H doesn’t want to job his title to Booker, but he’ll do it to Shawn Michaels. Whatever, I’m over it (actually I’m still not) but meh. Now here is where I blow my gasket. Booker T gets his rematch on Raw, but the match is dominated by KLIQ BS! It was never about Booker T. It was always about Shawn, Nash and Triple H. Members of the backstage Kliq in the mid 90s. That’s selfish. That’s disgusting. Please prove me wrong. Please.
So we have to deal with not one month, but TWO MONTHS of a crappy feud between Nash and Triple H. Nash is old, he is garbage in the ring. He’s no Diesel on 1995-96, he’s no WCW Kevin Nash of 1996-1998. He’s old. He was never going to win the title, so why waste the fans… the loyal fans (That is the internet wrestling community, not the bandwagon jumpers who only watched wrestling in 1998 because Austin was ‘cool’) time and money by shoving us this crap? Because Triple H wanted his kliq feud to continue. He had Michaels, now he had Nash. Hell the Nash feud at Bad Blood 2003 (one of the worst PPVs of all time) consisted mainly of Foley/Triple H, as Foley was special ref for the Hell in a Cell match. Nash was too crap, and not over with the fans, yet he still had a title shot. Fair? No. Triple H’s influence evident once again.
Where did Booker T go? He fell down to the IC title, and never made it to the main event scene again until Survivor Series 2004. Thanks Triple H, thanks for burying another wrestler.
So Triple H continues having crap match after crap match. Crap feud after crap feud. He buries Jericho, he buries Kane. He has a shocking feud with Steiner with one of the worst matches of all time. The fans were booing the crap out of both of them. Thank God for Angle/Benoit at the Royal Rumble to lift the crowd. God Benoit and Angle rule
He has a shocking feud with Nash as well. Then… ENTER GOLDBERG! *does Goldberg scream and stupid face*
Goldberg, is a short term investment. He wants lots of money, he wants a dominant character, and he has no long term interest in the WWE. So what happens? Triple H drops the title to him. Not Booker T, Jericho or Kane who have been with the WWE for how long now? Ages. Okay this might not be Triple H’s fault, its stupid booking, but Triple H has a part to blame… here it is.
Summer Slam 2003. Elimination Chamber (EC). WWE title match. Triple H is injured. HE cannot wrestle. That is why Goldberg vs. Triple H for the title had to be changed to the EC, to compensate for Triple H’s lack of ability to wrestle because he is injury prone (he’s gotten over that this year though, I’ll admit that). Goldberg was booed out of the building against Rock at Backlash. He was booed by the fans against Jericho at Judgment Day. Yet both Jericho and Rock were heels. Why was this? The booking was wrong. Goldberg has limited wrestling talent, limited mic skills, but what he does have is an awesome look and intense mystique. The bookers killed that… until Summer Slam. The EC match WAS GOLDBERG. The fans were sooooo behind him. But Triple H wins… despite not doing a single move the whole match. You heard me, all that occurred was a sledgehammer shot. Now I didn’t want Goldberg as champ… not at all. But if the WWE is going to put all their money into a short-term investment like Goldberg, they may as well do it right.
By the time Unforgiven came around, Goldberg’s mystique to the WWE fans was lost. He won the title? Big whoop. He was done. Yeah he beat Triple H at Survivor Series (why did that match happen again?), but no one cared. Goldberg loses the title back to Triple H at Armageddon. Goldberg is done. He’s booed out of the arena (along with Brock) at Mania XX as they knew he didn’t renew his contract, and the WWE didn’t offer him more money because they knew they stuffed up. Now this may have been different if Triple H lost the belt at Summer Slam. Actually I can almost guarantee it. But oh well. More money lost for the WWE.
On to 2004. Triple H FINALLY has a great (I said great not good) match in the year in late December 2003. Shawn Michaels “wins” the belt, but there was some BS angle and it didn’t really happen. Then at the Royal Rumble there’s a double count out in the Last Man Standing Match. Holy hell. Triple H will put Michaels over to no end (Why, Michaels doesn’t need to be put over does he?) but won’t job to Jericho, Kane, Booker T, anyone. He’ll put Goldberg over, who wasn’t even with the WWE for more than a year? But I repeat he won’t put the talent that matters over.
Triple H/Benoit/Michaels was SWEET! No denying it. Benoit is a God. A Titan. He is the wrestling beast. His title win at Mania XX is in my top 5 wrestling moments ever, and it is in most smarks’. Seeing the man shed tears, actually caring about winning the world title, that was touching.
HALT! Don’t go too far. Bad Blood 2004. Benoit is feuding with Kane for the title, and yet he is given the BACK SEAT to yet again, another Triple H vs. Shawn Michaels match. What do I mean by back seat? THEY MAIN EVENTED THE SHOW! The World title did not main event the PPV. That’ BS and you know it, Triple H knows, and my dog Benji knows it. Don’t even try and tell me that the booking team advised Triple H to main event the PPV. It is reported by very reliable sources (Meltzer anyone?) that Triple H believed that Kane/Benoit could not draw. Yet Bad Blood did GARBAGE buyrates with Triple H and Shawn Michaels main eventing in a shocking HIAC match. Why? Because the fans had seen that a million times. In the space of 2 years this is how many times Triple H and Michaels have faced each other (both one on one and other matches):
- Triple H/Michaels in the unsanctioned match up at Summer Slam 2002
- Triple H/Michaels in the Elimination Chamber at Survivor Series 2002
- Triple H/Michaels in the 2/3 falls match up at Armageddon 2002.
- Triple H/Michaels in the 6 man at Backlash
- Triple H/Michaels in the Elimination Chamber at Summer Slam 2003
- Triple H/Michaels on Raw in December
- Triple H/Michaels in the Last Man Standing match at the Royal Rumble 2004
- Triple H/Michaels in the 3 way title match Mania 20
- Triple H/Michaels in the 3 way title match at Backlash 2004
- Triple H/Michaels in the HIAC at Bad Blood.
Come on now. =-/ That’s has kliq all over it.
So Orton ends Benoit’s title reign, and Triple H wins back the title, and is obviously going to face Orton at Mania 21. Whatever. I’m not going to argue that Triple H’s match quality as sucked in 2004. He’s actually been very awesome this year. But 2003 was hell on Earth. Ask anyone that isn’t biased either way.
I’ll conclude with this. Since the roster split, Triple H has held the World Championship (Raw title) 4 times. He was given it by Bischoff, he won it back from Michaels, he won it back from Goldberg, and he beat Orton for it. Jericho has had
none, and instead was given compensatory IC title reigns, to put over people like Shelton, and Christian (who both kick ass, and I don’t mind them being Jericho). But the problem is, Jericho isn’t over enough to put people over himself. The crowd love him yes. But they’ve come to see him as a jobber. A very cool jobber, but a jobber none the less. Rock put him over, Austin put him over (slightly), but Triple H has yet to. So what’s Jericho doing now? Getting his ass owned by Batista on Raw. He’s on Raw for 10 minutes. The man is Godly over, but he’s on Raw for 10 minutes. Sad really. Why use someone who is seen as a choker, to put people over. Why not have Triple H do that? Oh right...
Triple H at his best is amazing. Absolutely amazing. But he doesn’t need to be a dominant heel. When he realises that (if he ever does) the WWE will improve. Jericho should have been one of the main stars now. They were planning to build him ever since late 2001, but Triple H never allowed that to happen. Now the WWE have to book for the short-term again, and build up Orton despite him not being ready yet. You reap what you sew.
Pat Patterson, a VERY close friend of Vince McMahon for many many years, quit the WWE because he believed Triple H was causing ratings and buy rates to heavily fall. When Pat Patterson leaves, you know there’s a problem.
I’m tired, I’m hungry, peace.
