***Official*** England in New Zealand series 2013

[flibbertyjibber]

I just wanted to pop in and say how awesome yesterday was. I took the afternoon off work and watched the final two sessions. I now have no fingernails left. What an absolute emotional roller coaster. But, despite that roller coaster, at the end of play I didn't feel disappointed. Instead I felt exhilarated. New Zealand didn't win, but the team played their hearts out. And England played magnificently to deny them. The team should not be ashamed of not winning, or feel regret for decisions and actions that they did not take and which might have helped them win. They should just feel proud of their performance. Damn proud.

Top post and I agree. Hope they use it as a springboard to better results for the future.

 

[Arachnodouche]

Should've called Australia over after England. Would've been plenty morale boosting then.

 

[HeathDavisSpeed]

I think I should stop going to Test matches. The four days I went to of this series were seriously turgid. Then Auckland of all places gets all the drama. Wankers.

 

[Days of Grace]

Was absolutely gutted listening on my i-phone at work yesterday. So devastated that I left work early, and didn't go to a teacher's mini-drinking session scheduled for the evening. I shouldn't let a bloody cricket match affect me like that, but fellow tragics on here will understand.

Anyway, great effort by the guys, but I wish the poor bowlers didn't have to create 12 chances to get 10 wickets.

Because of the close result, the pitch has not been discussed. The only reason Broad could survive 100 balls like was because the pitch as flat as some birds over here.

And are there also some of you who are also thinking like me that Boult and Southee will probably be more successful overseas in the future due to the increasingly flat and slow wickets they are encountering in home conditions?

Also very disappointed in Martin yesterday. Mark Watson calling him a gun find clearly wasn't watching days 4 and 5. Might as well bring Vettori back since, like Martin, he gets wickets when batsmen attack him.

Try this on for size for the Lord's test:

Rutherford
Fulton
Williamson
Taylor
McCullum (c)
Watling (wk)
Vettori
Bracewell
Southee
Wagner
Boult

Light on batting? Harsh on Brownlee and I'm not replacing him because of the dropped catch, but do we really expect him to average more than 35 over a career? Having said that, he does break up the aggressive middle-orders players quite nicely, and sometimes you need that.

Come to think of it, I might get Brownlee back in there and take out Wagner. Again, harsh on Wagner, but it's actually exciting times to be a New Zealand cricket supporter for once because we have genuine back ups.

Henry also has to be worth a shot for the limited overs touring squad.

 

[Flem274*]

Brownlie bats in a bubble, but often he bats at a good strike rate and I reckon he can average high 30s. Yes he's been very inconsistent but he has a hundred against SA in SA (and was smashing them I might add) and was our best batsman by far in Australia on green tops. He has also improved out of sight against spin, though he is yet to be tested in front of our eyes against a Swann or an Ajmal (he did play against Swann in the warm up game and played a good hand though). He is a quality batsman. Will be at least as good as Vettori imo.

and is a better bowler too trollololololol

 

[Mike5181]

I'd back Brownlie to average 35-38.

 

[Prince EWS]

I'm not really a big Brownlie fan but you shouldn't be dropping him for Vettori unless you think Vettori is likely to hit more runs than him. Williamson has proved more than capable as the fifth bowler IMO regardless the balance of the best of your attack; you shouldn't need six.

 

[Days of Grace]

Accepting that six batsmen is the go, do we really think that Bartin is a better test cricketer than Vettori?

I expect Bartin to average around 35 (with the ball) at best and he will probably average high 30s. I was feeling fine about having him in the side until yesterday.

 

[Prince EWS]

Accepting that six batsmen is the go, do we really think that Bartin is a better test cricketer than Vettori?

I expect Bartin to average around 35 (with the ball) at best and he will probably average high 30s. I was feeling fine about having him in the side until yesterday.

I don't think Vettori's batting should really come into that comparison unless you think they're essentially equal as bowlers.

If you think Bruce Martin is a better bowler than Vettori and you think Brownlie is a better batsman than Vettori, then Vettori shouldn't be playing.

Essentially what I'm saying is that there's no need to pick Vettori as a bits and pieces cricketer. You either pick him because you think he's one of your best four middle order batsmen excluding Watling, or you pick him because you think he's your best spinner, or you leave him out. Williamson is fine as the fifth bowler and the combined strength of the tail is also fine; you shouldn't need Vettori to prop these things up unless he makes the side or batting or spin bowling alone.

 

[jcas0167]

Was absolutely gutted listening on my i-phone at work yesterday. So devastated that I left work early, and didn't go to a teacher's mini-drinking session scheduled for the evening. I shouldn't let a bloody cricket match affect me like that, but fellow tragics on here will understand.

I was moping around the office quite despondent after finding out Bell was dropped and Prior continued his excellent form. A shame that emotionally it seems worse to dominate the majority of a game and draw than to be pummelled but hang on to survive.

More philosophical about it now and agree with the poster above that the team should be hugely proud of their efforts. Was a great series.

 

[straw man]

Cricket | Daniel Vettori to play limited role on... | Stuff.co.nz

Daniel Vettori will not be considered for New Zealand's test tour of England but could be in line to play his first one-day international in over two years.

Still hope Vettori doesn't quit tests. Needs to prove that he can contribute with the bat again to be selected for home series, the next of which is the West Indies at the end of the year - should get some FC or A cricket before then. There's also a tour to Bangladesh in Oct-Nov where he could perhaps be an option as a second spinner.

 

[NZTailender]

Tbh I was surprised when he gave it up because he's a far more effective L/O player. His Test bowling wasn't flash and his batting wasn't as good either as a batting all-rounder than it was when he was a bowling all-rounder.

Bruce Martin deserves to keep his place.

 

[Zinzan]

Tbh I was surprised when he gave it up because he's a far more effective L/O player. His Test bowling wasn't flash and his batting wasn't as good either as a batting all-rounder than it was when he was a bowling all-rounder.

^ This

Bruce Martin deserves to keep his place.

Although he was absolute garbage in the last test, must be said.

 

[BeeGee]

Still hope Vettori doesn't quit tests. Needs to prove that he can contribute with the bat again to be selected for home series, the next of which is the West Indies at the end of the year - should get some FC or A cricket before then. There's also a tour to Bangladesh in Oct-Nov where he could perhaps be an option as a second spinner.

He's not a spin bowler. Hasn't been for years. He bowls slow left arm door knobs.
Personally, I think it would probably be a good time for him to quit tests.

Tbh I was surprised when he gave it up because he's a far more effective L/O player. His Test bowling wasn't flash and his batting wasn't as good either as a batting all-rounder than it was when he was a bowling all-rounder.

He did it purely as a stats padding exercise (wanted Hadlee's record), which is the worst reason imaginable.

 

[NZTailender]

^ This




Although he was absolute garbage in the last test, must be said.

He wasn't great, no, but McCullum had some faith in him. It was possibly down to nerves of the occasion i.e. I'm expected to bowl my team to victory in my 3rd Test. Overall I thought he was impressive, and he looks like a Test bowler too. Reminds me a bit of when Graeme Swann came back - just looks to have his game sorted from FC cricket and the rest will just come naturally.

However touring the seam friendly wickets of England won't do him a great deal of help, but that will be a good test as well, to get wickets on unresponsive wickets.

I look forward to him playing on the subcontinent.

 

[Mike5181]

I wouldn't be surprised if that last test was an indication of what he's really going to be like at test level. When you get completely out-bowled by Kane Williamson, you probably aren't the best spinner running around. He's got himself on the tour to England though, and it's not like we have many alternative spin bowling options anyway.

 

[NZTailender]

I wouldn't be surprised if that last test was an indication of what he's really going to be like at test level. When you get completely out-bowled by Kane Williamson, you probably aren't the best spinner running around. He's got himself on the tour to England though, and it's not like we have many alternative spin bowling options anyway.

Full-time bowlers out done by part-time bowler shocker. There's a whole different psychology that enters into being when someone like Kane Williamson is given the ball, and that's why they're part time options to grab surprise wickets and not full time options.

 

[Mike5181]

Full-time bowlers out done by part-time bowler shocker. There's a whole different psychology that enters into being when someone like Kane Williamson is given the ball, and that's why they're part time options to grab surprise wickets and not full time options.

Or it's just a case of a decent part-timer outperforming an ordinary test spinner. Entirely attributing the difference in their performances to the different mindset a batsman has when a part-timer is thrown the ball would be naive. England knew what their job was, they didn't suddenly get complacent when Williamson was thrown the ball. He consistently bowled better areas than Martin. The latter bowled far too wide for far too long. He was given close to 40 overs in that fourth innings. That's ample opportunity to settle into his work.

 

[vic_orthdox]

Looks unthreatening when a team shuts up shop, but thought (when I watched) he looked good when teams were looking to bat normally against him.

Slower decks made him placid when they are just blocking.

 

[hendrix]

TBH I thought he bowled well most of the time. Should've been given slightly more defensive fields initially against Prior to force him to not play his natural game.