***Official*** Pakistan and England in UAE

[Prince EWS]

You wrote that I had "conveniently ignored" a factor that I had in fact fully acknowledged in the post you were alluding to. Questioning your reading comprehension under those circumstances was IMO a more than reasonable thing to do.

WAG.

 

[sledger]

You wrote that I had "conveniently ignored" a factor that I had in fact fully acknowledged in the post you were alluding to. Questioning your reading comprehension under those circumstances was IMO a more than reasonable thing to do.

Acknowledging his achievements and then belittling them in the vein that you did, was imo, akin to ignoring them.

 

[Jarquis]

I don't think I've actually ever heard a suggestion as ridiculous as dropping Ian Bell and playing both Eoin Morgan and Ravi Bopara

 

[sledger]

I don't think I've actually ever heard a suggestion as ridiculous as dropping Ian Bell and playing both Eoin Morgan and Ravi Bopara

And acknowledging the consistant achievements of Ian Bell over the last year or so as part of the reasoning behind it. ITSTL.

 

[Rasimione]

Lmao. This is crazy. Drop Bell for Bopara? Really? Oh well with Steyn and co on the way i back that idea, for obvious selfish reasons.

 

[Howe_zat]

I like this guy, even though I completely disagree with pretty much everything he's said so far.

Welcome to the forum, dude.

Was thinking the same thing. 10/10 for effort.

 

[CWB304]

I don't think I've actually ever heard a suggestion as ridiculous as dropping Ian Bell and playing both Eoin Morgan and Ravi Bopara

For me Bell against an attack like this is a 15-20 average man. I don't rate Morgan or Bopara particularly highly but they have had less chances than Bell so there is the slight chance that one or both of them could step it up and average 30 or 40, which IMO is more than can be expected from Bell, who has always looked like a tailender against attacks like this and X factor bowlers like Ajmal. Perhaps Bopara will be just as clueless. But I find it impossible to believe he can do any worse, and the fact that Bell has had so many opportunities against attacks like these, and been found wanting every time, swings me in Bopara's favour.

FWIW, would you still consider what I am suggesting "ridiculous" if Bell is picked for the remaining matches and averages less than 20, as I expect him to? I expect Morgan to remain in the team for the rest of the series and comfortably outscore Bell, making a nonsense of the suggestion that it would be "ridiculous" to have him ahead of Bell. But is Bopara so nailed on in his cr*pness for you that a Bell averaging less than 20 would by default be better than anything he could offer?

For me you have to take risks when faced with differentr challenges. Once the wickets start to fly the last man you want to come in is Bell. He has never done anything for England under those circumstances and even if it is not a question of temperament which I think it is there is an obvious problem picking Ajmal's variations. Going back to Hilfenhaus who had failed in the recent past was a risk for the Oz selectors, but they thought he would trouble the Indian batsmen with his movement and they were proved right. England has to start thinking in the same way and get guys like Bell who are simply not equipped to cope with the challenge posed by the Pakistan attack out of the firing line.

 

[Xuhaib]

would love to have this guy as English selector. Bopara for Bell will be Christmas time fr Pakistan.

 

[Faisal1985]

Guys its not gonna matter..Bell or Bopara or bring back Vaughn...its Pakistan's series with atleast 2-0.

 

[Viscount Tom]

Guys its not gonna matter..Bell or Bopara or bring back Vaughn...its Pakistan's series with atleast 2-0.

Just saying but perhaps Bumble's an option?

David Lloyd (Bumble) vs Murali - "This Ground's Not Big Enough For Both Of Us!" - YouTube

Also by saying that Bell's a walking wicket against decent attacks your ignoring how good against these decent attacks he has been over the past few years.

His record against SA is pretty handy and no one in their right mind will say they're a poor side. He had 1 bad game in which he got much better balls than certain other team mates, the fact that he got out to them shouldn't lead to people calling for his head.

Pietersen's edgy on 0 this hasn't changed and probably won't the fact that he decided to try and get going against a ball that was too short likewise shouldn't bring about people calling for his head.

Bopara's crap end of argument and he shouldn't play test cricket again, period. The man is mentally frail a much poorer fielder and would suffer much worse against the seamers. The way your suggesting thah he'd be in some way better than Bell makes it sound like Bell has never played decent knocks against strong opposition which is woefully inaccurate.

 

[Jacknife]

Looks like Belly can't win some fans over, anyway I've heard some serious gash before but the dude above takes some beating. Lines like 'not equipped to cope' and 'is a 15-20 average man' how can you take that **** seriously, then if people don't agree with him ,they know nothing about cricket,hmmm. Listening to him speak you'd think England were facing Warne and McGrath etc, they're not they're facing a good spinner in Ajmal and decent pacers, that's all.

 

[CWB304]

Looks like Belly can't win some fans over, anyway I've heard some serious gash before but the dude above takes some beating. Lines like 'not equipped to cope' and 'is a 15-20 average man' how can you take that **** seriously, then if people don't agree with him ,they know nothing about cricket,hmmm. Listening to him speak you'd think England were facing Warne and McGrath etc, they're not they're facing a good spinner in Ajmal and decent pacers, that's all.

Still too good for Bell. As I said before, what will you guys say if Bell continues to suck, and averages, as I predict, less than 20 for the series? "Bad luck, he was due a bad series?" LOL.

He failed against Warne and McGrath, and he has failed every time subsequently that he has encountered a balanced attack with decent spin and seam options. Not a single person that has disagreed has been able to point to Bell doing well against a well balanced attack with decent seam and spin threats. The one knock in SA is not really an exception because SA had little or nothing to back up Steyn and Morkel, and certainly no spin.

Nevertheless, doing well against that duo is nothing to sniff at; unfortunately for Bell, that performance is the exception that proves the rule.

I look forward to reading a lot of "gash" from you and other subscribers to the myth of Bell as a top class bat when this series is over and as I predict he ends up with a lower average than any of the specialist batsmen, Prior, Broad and Swann also. Rather than accepting this as yet more proof of what has been crystal clear since 2005 - that he doesn't have what it takes to succeed against well balanced attacks when the chips are down - discussion will conveniently be swerved to Ajmal's action or whether management has selected six specialist bats or not.

 

[honestbharani]

I don't think I've actually ever heard a suggestion as ridiculous as dropping Ian Bell and playing both Eoin Morgan and Ravi Bopara

you should start listening to Pak fans more often tbh.. They have wanted this all along.

 

[Eds]

This guy is MF for sure.

 

[sledger]

Nah, he's too busy dealing drugs iirc.

 

[slowfinger]

For me Bell against an attack like this is a 15-20 average man. I don't rate Morgan or Bopara particularly highly but they have had less chances than Bell so there is the slight chance that one or both of them could step it up and average 30 or 40, which IMO is more than can be expected from Bell, who has always looked like a tailender against attacks like this and X factor bowlers like Ajmal. Perhaps Bopara will be just as clueless. But I find it impossible to believe he can do any worse, and the fact that Bell has had so many opportunities against attacks like these, and been found wanting every time, swings me in Bopara's favour.

FWIW, would you still consider what I am suggesting "ridiculous" if Bell is picked for the remaining matches and averages less than 20, as I expect him to? I expect Morgan to remain in the team for the rest of the series and comfortably outscore Bell, making a nonsense of the suggestion that it would be "ridiculous" to have him ahead of Bell. But is Bopara so nailed on in his cr*pness for you that a Bell averaging less than 20 would by default be better than anything he could offer?

For me you have to take risks when faced with differentr challenges. Once the wickets start to fly the last man you want to come in is Bell. He has never done anything for England under those circumstances and even if it is not a question of temperament which I think it is there is an obvious problem picking Ajmal's variations. Going back to Hilfenhaus who had failed in the recent past was a risk for the Oz selectors, but they thought he would trouble the Indian batsmen with his movement and they were proved right. England has to start thinking in the same way and get guys like Bell who are simply not equipped to cope with the challenge posed by the Pakistan attack out of the firing line.

New Richard?

 

[Flametree]

This is fun!

I think Alistair Cook is hopeless against the moving ball (see home series vs Pakistan, last summer against India apart from one innings), and if he'd played in another era (eg, any time up to about 1995) where every series he'd have been facing a Windies barrage, Lillee/Alderman, Hadlee, Kapil Dev etc, he'd have averaged about 20. When listing great English openers, he isn't fit to lace the boots of John Edrich or Alec Stewart even though his average is many points higher. I'd put him in with the likes of Martyn Moxon or Chris Smith.

Anyone else want to take a pop at someone?

 

[Jacknife]

New Richard?

Who cares.

 

[Howe_zat]

Well by all means what really counts when picking a team for a match against Pakistan in 2012 is how well they'd do against the Windies in 1984. Crucial.

 

[fredfertang]

This is fun!

I think Alistair Cook is hopeless against the moving ball (see home series vs Pakistan, last summer against India apart from one innings), and if he'd played in another era (eg, any time up to about 1995) where every series he'd have been facing a Windies barrage, Lillee/Alderman, Hadlee, Kapil Dev etc, he'd have averaged about 20. When listing great English openers, he isn't fit to lace the boots of John Edrich or Alec Stewart even though his average is many points higher. I'd put him in with the likes of Martyn Moxon or Chris Smith.

Anyone else want to take a pop at someone?

Harsh, but he's not as good as Foxy Fowler was