West Indies vs Australia

[archie mac]

I'm not sure Bradman tilts the scales to such a great extent in a hypothetical All Time matchup against the West Indies, as his Bodyline average was merely Tendulkar-esque.

Not sure about that. The Bodyline field placements are not allowed anymore. Bradman loved pace and never had a problem with Larwood until Bodyline or any other fast bowler for that matter

 

[smash84]

Can agree with the rest but not this. I think having Ponting and Waugh makes Australia better in the middle-order.

yeah waugh and ponting makes it slightly better but a very marginal call if at all. Dussey isn't as good anymore tbh

 

[Furball]

Not sure about that. The Bodyline field placements are not allowed anymore. Bradman loved pace and never had a problem with Larwood until Bodyline or any other fast bowler for that matter

Yeah, I'm not for a minute suggesting he'd fail, but in a series vs an AT Windies lineup I'd expect him to average between 56 and maybe 75-80 - still ****ing awesome, but not as awesome as averaging 100.

If that makes sense.

 

[Furball]

Can agree with the rest but not this. I think having Ponting and Waugh makes Australia better in the middle-order.

Although surely if we're just limiting ourselves to 1980-95, Lara is a shoe-in for the middle order, which tips it back towards the Windies.

 

[archie mac]

Yeah, I'm not for a minute suggesting he'd fail, but in a series vs an AT Windies lineup I'd expect him to average between 56 and maybe 75-80 - still ****ing awesome, but not as awesome as averaging 100.

If that makes sense.

It makes sense but I am not sure what you are basing this on

 

[vcs]

I think Gomes was a very underrated batsman of his time, like Martyn in Australia's 00's team. People hardly seem to talk about him much these days.

 

[vcs]

yeah waugh and ponting makes it slightly better but a very marginal call if at all. Dussey isn't as good anymore tbh

A batting lineup with both Steve Waugh and Mussey in it would be virtually impossible for any attack to run through IMO. Awesome lower-middle order.

 

[Howe_zat]

If we were to have an all-time match up rather than just the best teams, would the Windies play a spinner?

 

[Furball]

If we were to have an all-time match up rather than just the best teams, would the Windies play a spinner?

No, as they don't have a spinner better than their ATG pacers IMO.

 

[vcs]

I don't see why. I reckon their four best pacers would be better options than Lance Gibbs. Also, they came and dominated in India in '83 on what must presumably have been spin-friendly tracks. Their quicks would be unplayable if there's a hint of uneven bounce.

 

[Howe_zat]

Thinking about it, an all-time lineup would have Sobers, so there's even less need.

 

[archie mac]

I think Gomes was a very underrated batsman of his time, like Martyn in Australia's 00's team. People hardly seem to talk about him much these days.

Was a very good player, frustrating. Was not of the same ethnicity as the rest of the team. Seemed to make him more cautious. Although if you can bat at three in that team you were a class act

 

[smash84]

Although surely if we're just limiting ourselves to 1980-95, Lara is a shoe-in for the middle order, which tips it back towards the Windies.

Oh i forgot this. Lara.

WI go up

 

[Borges]

Were the West Indians of 1980 better than the Australian team of 2000? You bet they were. By a country mile and then quite some more.

There have been great test sides over the years, but the great West Indian sides have, IMHO, never been equalled; either in pure cricketing skills or in the manner in which they played the game, the joy that they gave to the lovers of the game. True, they have had a couple of abrasive characters over the years, but the abiding memory of that team will always be that of their attitude to cricket, their sportsmanship, their love for the game and their exuberance. They didn't sledge; that one needed to stoop to such levels in order to win probably didn't occur to them; they didn't see the need for anything other than their cricketing skills to do that. Fairness, melded with awesome firepower, quicksilver flair, ruthless efficiency, and absolute confidence that comes from the knowledge that they were the best.

The 1980's WI team. A fearsome pace quartet, each one different from the other, attacking in four different ways. Holding, Roberts and Garner with Croft and Marshall battling it out for the last quick's place. Wayne Daniel not good enough to even get a game. Sylvester Clarke, Hartley Alleyne and Norbert Phillip playing county cricket because they couldn't come anywhere near the WI dressing room. Devastating batsmen and superb fielders. The batting line-up that included Richards, Greenidge, Haynes, Lloyd and Kallicharan. Without a shadow of doubt, the best test side that I've ever seen. For me, nothing has equalled watching those guys play cricket. The sheer aura of that team that captured the imagination of cricket fans all over the world. No team comes even close to them in terms of the respect that they commanded, the affection that they received. They were always fair, never arrogant, and they just didn't gloat.

What did you just say? That they didn't have a spinner while Australia had Warne? What material difference did that make? They were the team that beat India 3-0 in India; no team, with or without spinners, has ever come even remotely close to doing that during my cricket watching days. That WI side never felt the absence of a spinner; their over rates were excruciatingly slow by 1980's standards, but Lloyd had a point when he asked the whining English media: "Do you want us to beat you in three days instead of four?"

 

[Furball]

Were the West Indians of 1980 better than the Australian team of 2000? You bet they were. By a country mile and then quite some more.

There have been great test sides over the years, but the great West Indian sides have, IMHO, never been equalled; either in pure cricketing skills or in the manner in which they played the game, the joy that they gave to the lovers of the game. True, they have had a couple of abrasive characters over the years, but the abiding memory of that team will always be that of their attitude to cricket, their sportsmanship, their love for the game and their exuberance. They didn't sledge; that one needed to stoop to such levels in order to win probably didn't occur to them; they didn't see the need for anything other than their cricketing skills to do that. Fairness, melded with awesome firepower, quicksilver flair, ruthless efficiency, and absolute confidence that comes from the knowledge that they were the best.

The 1980's WI team. A fearsome pace quartet, each one different from the other, attacking in four different ways. Holding, Roberts and Garner with Croft and Marshall battling it out for the last quick's place. Wayne Daniel not good enough to even get a game. Sylvester Clarke, Hartley Alleyne and Norbert Phillip playing county cricket because they couldn't come anywhere near the WI dressing room. Devastating batsmen and superb fielders. The batting line-up that included Richards, Greenidge, Haynes, Lloyd and Kallicharan. Without a shadow of doubt, the best test side that I've ever seen. For me, nothing has equalled watching those guys play cricket. The sheer aura of that team that captured the imagination of cricket fans all over the world. No team comes even close to them in terms of the respect that they commanded, the affection that they received. They were always fair, never arrogant, and they just didn't gloat.

What did you just say? That they didn't have a spinner while Australia had Warne? What material difference did that make? They were the team that beat India 3-0 in India; no team, with or without spinners, has ever come even remotely close to doing that during my cricket watching days. That WI side never felt the absence of a spinner; their over rates were excruciatingly slow by 1980's standards, but Lloyd had a point when he asked the whining English media: "Do you want us to beat you in three days instead of four?"

lol

 

[Spark]

Complete rubbish that WI were perfect flawless paragons of the game in some way.

 

[salman85]

Borges isn't completely off the mark.They might not have been perfect paragons of the game,but i don't think the WI team was ever disliked because of arrogance the way Australia was during the last decade.To put it in simple terms,they were not perfect gentlemen,and yes the game was played differently back then as far as how players conducted themselves on the pitch goes,but the WI side was more likeable than the modern day Australian side.

 

[smash84]

Were the West Indians of 1980 better than the Australian team of 2000? You bet they were. By a country mile and then quite some more.

There have been great test sides over the years, but the great West Indian sides have, IMHO, never been equalled; either in pure cricketing skills or in the manner in which they played the game, the joy that they gave to the lovers of the game. True, they have had a couple of abrasive characters over the years, but the abiding memory of that team will always be that of their attitude to cricket, their sportsmanship, their love for the game and their exuberance. They didn't sledge; that one needed to stoop to such levels in order to win probably didn't occur to them; they didn't see the need for anything other than their cricketing skills to do that. Fairness, melded with awesome firepower, quicksilver flair, ruthless efficiency, and absolute confidence that comes from the knowledge that they were the best.

The 1980's WI team. A fearsome pace quartet, each one different from the other, attacking in four different ways. Holding, Roberts and Garner with Croft and Marshall battling it out for the last quick's place. Wayne Daniel not good enough to even get a game. Sylvester Clarke, Hartley Alleyne and Norbert Phillip playing county cricket because they couldn't come anywhere near the WI dressing room. Devastating batsmen and superb fielders. The batting line-up that included Richards, Greenidge, Haynes, Lloyd and Kallicharan. Without a shadow of doubt, the best test side that I've ever seen. For me, nothing has equalled watching those guys play cricket. The sheer aura of that team that captured the imagination of cricket fans all over the world. No team comes even close to them in terms of the respect that they commanded, the affection that they received. They were always fair, never arrogant, and they just didn't gloat.

What did you just say? That they didn't have a spinner while Australia had Warne? What material difference did that make? They were the team that beat India 3-0 in India; no team, with or without spinners, has ever come even remotely close to doing that during my cricket watching days. That WI side never felt the absence of a spinner; their over rates were excruciatingly slow by 1980's standards, but Lloyd had a point when he asked the whining English media: "Do you want us to beat you in three days instead of four?"

Wonderful tribute although I must say that nostalgia probably does not allow you to remember some of the unsportsman things that the WI side of the 80s did.

 

[Borges]

Wonderful tribute although I must say that nostalgia probably does not allow you to remember some of the unsportsman things that the WI side of the 80s did.

Hmm... Agree that I'm quite sentimental about the WI teams that Sobers/LLoyd/Viv captained. But what I'd posted about was factual, based on what I had seen (and watched on TV). Admittedly a very small sample; TV coverage those days was extremely limited.

They were great teams; they played with grace and won with dignity.

 

[smash84]

IIRC they were quite ruthless and not averse to bouncing out the tail either