*Official* Fifth Test at the SCG

[Prince EWS]

I agree he should bat 6, but I think you might be slightly overrating his technique under pressure given the shot he played first innings.

Julian over-rating Haddin slightly? Never.

 

[G.I.Joe]

Trying to win = treating it as a dead rubber?

Treating it as an opportunity to experiment in a manner you wouldn't have initially = treating it as a dead rubber

 

[Julian87]

Disagree.

 

[Julian87]

Julian over-rating Haddin slightly? Never.

Ha. Well if Prior can bat 6 in test (in the past, obv) Haddin should be able to open and comfortably average 50 or so.

 

[Ruckus]

Treating it as an opportunity to experiment in a manner you wouldn't have initially = treating it as a dead rubber

New players have to be introduced to test cricket sometime. Why not in a series where the most important aspect of it has been already decided? If we wait, then it probably be at the start of another series where the actual important (series) result is still on the line.

 

[Prince EWS]

ha. Well if prior can bat 6 in test (in the past, obv) haddin should be able to open and comfortably average 50 or so.

 

[Julian87]

Which brings me to my next question...

If that ball from Johnson had have safely lolled to Haddin for a dot ball, would Waqar Younis II have referred it?

 

[G.I.Joe]

New players have to be introduced to test cricket sometime. Why not in a series where the most important aspect of it has been already decided? If we wait, then it probably be at the start of another series where the actual important (series) result is still on the line.

See thats where the difference in perception lies. I can only speak from personal experience that retaining the Border Gavaskar Trophy in 2004 was nowhere near as satisfying as winning it in Sydney would have been. I certainly hope the Australian team isn't taking this as light heartedly as you guys are.

 

[Prince EWS]

The funny thing is, Julian, I'm actually regarded as a bit of a Prior-hating Haddin fanboy by certain members of this forum, and yet I still think you're one. That's how ridiculously extreme your opinions of the situation are - even the known Haddin fans think you're over-the-top.

You seriously suggested that Swann should bat above Prior in Melbourne, FFS. The bloke averages over 40 in Tests with three tons. You've gone mad.

 

[vcs]

I agree wholeheartedly. Australian cricket is very much geared towards the Ashes, though. Even when they do lose/draw a non-Ashes series, the immediate reaction is usually to discuss the impact it'll have on Ashes preparations and whether the current team is good enough to win the Ashes. That the actual series has been lost is a secondary consideration.

I'm not saying it's right (it isn't, IMO) but it's the way cricket works in this country. It's almost applied to the same extent as other countries building towards a World Cup in ODIs.

I always got that impression more from England TBH. I started reading a lot more of their press after Ashes 2005 and in the buildup to Ashes 2006-07, so my impression is probably a bit influenced by that.

 

[Prince EWS]

I always got that impression more from England TBH. I started reading a lot more of their press after Ashes 2005 and in the buildup to Ashes 2006-07, so my impression is probably a bit influenced by that.

The attitude wasn't as strong in Australia when England were crap, particularly amongst the younger generation, but since losing the 2005 series in England it's all been very Ashes-centric.

 

[G.I.Joe]

I agree wholeheartedly. Australian cricket is very much geared towards the Ashes, though. Even when they do lose/draw a non-Ashes series, the immediate reaction is usually to discuss the impact it'll have on Ashes preparations and whether the current team is good enough to win the Ashes. That the actual series has been lost is a secondary consideration.

I'm not saying it's right (it isn't, IMO) but it's the way cricket works in this country. It's almost applied to the same extent as other countries building towards a World Cup in ODIs.

Would you say this is a recent change, PEWS? England have had this obsession towards the Ashes for a long time, but Waugh's Australia didn't appear to me as singularly focussed as that.

 

[G.I.Joe]

woah, vcs. Spooky.

 

[Prince EWS]

Would you say this is a recent change, PEWS? England have had this obsession towards the Ashes for a long time, but Waugh's Australia didn't appear to me as singularly focussed as that.

Haha yeah, I'm guessing you started typing that before Post #71 appeared.

When Australia were hammering England every time it obviously wasn't the key focus, but since 2005, all the press and all the general fan chatter has been very Ashes-focussed.

 

[vcs]

The attitude wasn't as strong in Australia when England were crap, particularly amongst the younger generation, but since losing the 2005 series in England it's all been very Ashes-centric.

Hmm.. can understand that.

Joe, great minds etc..

 

[Dissector]

Would you say this is a recent change, PEWS? England have had this obsession towards the Ashes for a long time, but Waugh's Australia didn't appear to me as singularly focussed as that.

Well, Waugh's career coincided almost perfectly with England's two decades of mediocrity. They have been a lot better after he retired. The Ashes become that much more important if you feel you are playing against one of the world's top teams which England certainly is now.

 

[Ruckus]

See thats where the difference in perception lies. I can only speak from personal experience that retaining the Border Gavaskar Trophy in 2004 was nowhere near as satisfying as winning it in Sydney would have been. I certainly hope the Australian team isn't taking this as light heartedly as you guys are.

I genuinely believe though with the changes the team would actually have a better chance of winning anyway. Sure it's a risk to debut some new players, but hell the selectors were already willing to do that in the series at times far more important than what Sydney will be. Doherty, Smith, Beer?

 

[social]

All the guys treating Sydney as adead rubber, you do realise that beyond the Ashes, there's also the small matter of avoiding a home series defeat, don't you? Sydney is not a dead rubber by any means.

**** that

Every series there has been some excuse for why changes cant be made e.g. playing India, the Ashes, Rooty Hill RSL next so we cant do that

How about we try a novel approach and actually pick a combination that represents arguably the best player for each position

If that means punting some "established"but consistently underperforming players then so be it

Subject to fitness, I'd pick

Watson
Hughes
Katich
Hussey
Ponting - (c) for the very last time
Khawaja
Haddin
Hauritz
Johnson
Siddle
Dougeh/Cameron/Copeland
Smith - 12th man

 

[Spark]

Here's the problem with dropping Clarke though and then bringing him back when Ponting retires. Ghappel has said in no uncertain terms that Clarke will be the next captain. If you drop him, then bring him back and make him captain, what kind of message will that send to the team?

 

[Son Of Coco]

Clarrie Grimmett's dead

Maybe so, but at least he'd put up a bit more of a fight than our current team.